RWJC Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 2 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said: That wouldn't align with what Rutherford has stated in wanting to get younger. The only way I see us trading Hog is if we get a defenseman the same age, value and same level. Same goes for Petey/Pod for that matter. Not really any RD out there like that on the market off the top of my head. I see Miller gone and maybe Garland or Boeser after that as the major moves. Only if one of Garland/Boeser could land us a top 4 RD at similar age(Carlo?). True, but he has also stated he wants size up front, which is the only reason why I think we hear about Garland from the pundits. I always look at what is said that underlies PR, and I could be wrong but I’ve heard GMJR reference “the future” many times now that it would not surprise me if he sees Hoglander as expendable given whom has emerged in that role as well as requiring a roster spot in the future for Podz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkyard Dog Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 2 minutes ago, RWJC said: Regarding EP and our F as a whole, I may be in the minority here but I would rather have 2 young 20+ goal, 50-60+ point scoring Fs in our top 9 at the same combined cap hit as EP, than EP. we require the luxury of spreading the scoring out and having accountable diversity and option amongst our lines, rather than hoping and praying that our elite level talent shows up and resting on those laurels it get us into the playoffs. It’s just not perpetually realistic. Finding two young players like that is a lot hard to do. You usually have to draft them. I only really see us trading Petey in a similar situation to that of PLD/Laine. In a sideways deal that trades one struggling star for another. Deals like that usually take time to form(an example being with players wanting a fresh start like PLD/Laine). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 1 minute ago, McBackup said: Yes. That is exactly the point. Glad we're in agreement. BREAKING NEWS: Cale Makar is no longer untouchable. Wait! So he's available? No. But you said he's no longer untouchable. Yes. So... we could offer something for him? No. Oh screw off Sakic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 8 minutes ago, RWJC said: Regarding EP and our F as a whole, I may be in the minority here but I would rather have 2 young 20+ goal, 50-60+ point scoring Fs in our top 9 at the same combined cap hit as EP, than EP. we require the luxury of spreading the scoring out and having accountable diversity and option amongst our lines, rather than hoping and praying that our elite level talent shows up and resting on those laurels it get us into the playoffs. It’s just not perpetually realistic. My hope is that Petey becomes a 75pt producer... just below a PPG. Would keep his cap down and allow us to add more depth. If he becomes a 90pt guy, he'll probably want $9.5M+... Like you, I'd prefer a couple guys that can produce than one guy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkyard Dog Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 1 minute ago, RWJC said: True, but he has also stated he wants size up front, which is the only reason why I think we hear about Garland from the pundits. I always look at what is said that underlies PR, and I could be wrong but I’ve heard GMJR reference “the future” many times now that it would not surprise me if he sees Hoglander as expendable given whom has emerged in that role as well as requiring a roster spot in the future for Podz. Said he also wants speed too. He also said cap was an issue and Hoglander's cheap and his next deal will probably be pretty cheap too. We're pretty secure on wing moving forward, but any moves we make beyond a Miller + one of Garland/Boeser will start to create problems at wing. Like I said maybe if there was a 21 year old 3rd pair RD that has solid top 4 promise I would pull the trigger with Hog maybe but I would be moving Garland/Boeser for a Carlo-type D before that. We'd be likely getting that sort of young promising RD from a Miller trade anyway. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phat Fingers Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 46 minutes ago, RWJC said: The problem is this team isn’t one similar EP type player away from being a playoff caliber club. We are deficient in a few areas. Could returns from BB and JTM address replace said players contribution and address our needs? Maybe and hopefully, but likely not immediately. And if we do move those players out, who complements EP long term? Another wait and see approach to catering to specific players. We need a heart and soul team that plays by committee. I’m sold on EP as an elite level talent, and again reiterate how much I like him as a player and feel we were fortunate enough to draft him, but I don’t think he’s the right player for our team to build around. I hope I’m wrong. I want to be wrong, haha I don’t see the same long term issues yet, I do think he is a player that we need to keep or replace at this time. In fact it would be incredibly short sighted and the return unless it’s a similar player won’t be nearly worth any move unless he wants out. Same for Horvat, Hughes and Demko. Miller is a needed player, so we need something back that is as big or potentially better. That said, Miller has only one yea4 left on his deal, and is older and the team did not draft and develop him. Brock seems to have hit a short term plateau and is up for a raise. I would advocate to max out a return on Garland or Brock today without hesitation is we got a player or prospect with some upside for our RHD. Brock could maybe get you there, Garland doesn’t likely. But we could lose a decent amount of cap potentially depending. Miller has more return and is a older player, by 3 years, so not a giant leap but still he plays a more rugged and more valuable game than Brock or Garland. Other than losing some wasted cap and the gain from the Florida AGM penalty and , we could try and find a new home for Poolman and Dickinson. Kinda plus by minus. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBackup Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 4 minutes ago, HKSR said: BREAKING NEWS: Cale Makar is no longer untouchable. Wait! So he's available? No. But you said he's no longer untouchable. Yes. So... we could offer something for him? No. Oh screw off Sakic! Conversations that happen inside your head aren't relevant. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 Seen examples of some trade packages for Miller on The Hockey Writers site: NYR (most likely destination) - (LD) Nils Lundkvist - (LW) Kappo Kakko or (C) Filip Chytil - 1st BOS - (G) Jeremy Swayman - prospect - (LD) Mason Lohrei - prospect - 1st - (possibly Jake Debrusk added) MIN - (RD) Calen Addison - prospect - (LW) Adam Beckman - prospect - (LW) Jordan Greenway - 1st CGY (least likely destination) - (LW) Jakob Pelletier - prospect - (LD) Juuso Valimaki - prospect - 1st Gotta say, I like the NYR offer a lot more than the others (if it happens) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJC Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 1 minute ago, Junkyard Dog said: Finding two young players like that is a lot hard to do. You usually have to draft them. I only really see us trading Petey in a similar situation to that of PLD/Laine. In a sideways deal that trades one struggling star for another. Deals like that usually take time to form(an example being with players wanting a fresh start like PLD/Laine). I hear ya, but truth is we only need a superstar player for EP if they can fill two roles: 1) replace EP’s production/playmaking 2) also fill a captaincy/leadership role. They have to be an innate team leader. we aren’t going to find that in another player who is disengaged/disenfranchised with their current situation. EP serves as a great merchandising/marketing tool and a face for the franchise. He’s also a pretty damn good hockey player. But he hasn’t proven to be captain material yet, he’s potentially a little fragile, and the expectation for him to lead this team is HUGE. I don’t trust one player to determine the fortunes of this franchise. Again, I love him, but I just don’t think he’s the long term answer here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKSR Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 2 minutes ago, McBackup said: Conversations that happen inside your head aren't relevant. Neither are you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester13 Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 25 minutes ago, Provost said: Yep… but it is fairly easy to envision a scenario where a bigger deal is happening and Motte is a secondary piece going the other way. 12 minutes ago, McBackup said: Somebody who uses words without understanding their definition, or even punctuation like the ellipses should not be telling anyone they have poor reading comprehension. If you're referring to his post above, well, he has you again, as the ellipses was used quite well to portray his thoughtful pause of reflection on the poster's prior response before he provided his further addition to the conversation. It's also important to consider where we are: an Internet forum. This means that writing can be informal and still correct, as the rules are relaxed. But, if you would like to continue critiquing others, I recommend getting your own rebuttals spot on, as you lost when he literally addressed his meaning behind "untouchable", and you lost with the ellipses. I'm more of a word person, but if my math is correct... 1... plus 1... equals, yup, you're 0/2. Wait, you also missed a comma after the word ellipses, so I guess you're 0/3, which means: 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJC Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 4 minutes ago, McBackup said: Conversations that happen inside your head aren't relevant. I don’t think we’re a contender yet. Not even close. Otherwise we’d be looking to add for a playoff run, not potentially sell off. There wouldn’t be any discussion of it at all. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junkyard Dog Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 Just now, RWJC said: I hear ya, but truth is we only need a superstar player for EP if they can fill two roles: 1) replace EP’s production/playmaking 2) also fill a captaincy/leadership role. They have to be an innate team leader. we aren’t going to find that in another player who is disengaged/disenfranchised with their current situation. EP serves as a great merchandising/marketing tool and a face for the franchise. He’s also a pretty damn good hockey player. But he hasn’t proven to be captain material yet, he’s potentially a little fragile, and the expectation for him to lead this team is HUGE. I don’t trust one player to determine the fortunes of this franchise. Again, I love him, but I just don’t think he’s the long term answer here. Maybe he is, maybe he isn't. He did show very capable in the bubble, especially vs Vegas where he was the only guy outside Demko proving his worth and coming in clutch. He has certainly lost that level of play though. We probably won't find similar situation for Petey now. These types of deals take a while to develop like it did for Laine/PLD. We have the luxury of time with Petey so we don't need to rush to any decision yet with him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBackup Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 Just now, Jester13 said: If you're referring to his post above, well, he has you again, as the ellipses was used quite well to portray his thoughtful pause of reflection on the poster's prior response before he provided his further addition to the conversation. It's also important to consider where we are: an Internet forum. This means that writing can be informal and still correct, as the rules are relaxed. But, if you would like to continue critiquing others, I recommend getting your own rebuttals spot on, as you lost when he literally addressed his meaning behind "untouchable", and you lost with the ellipses. I'm more of a word person, but if my math is correct... 1... plus 1... equals, yup, you're 0/2. Wait, you also missed a comma after the word ellipses, so I guess you're 0/3, which means: The ellipses is used to denote lost text. Not a "thoughtful pause", unless we're ignoring the actual use of written language like when we say "literally" to mean the complete opposite of what literally means. I'm not going to bother with the rest of your worthless post because you completely missed what was being said, I was not the one who started that, but you feel like you need to live up to your name and join in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBackup Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 5 minutes ago, HKSR said: Neither are you. Then why do you keep trying to get my attention? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandmaster Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 5 hours ago, Warhippy said: Why not flip the damned script and just trade Petey for an RHD and a pick, then find that grittier complimentary player. If everyone is so worried about Petey handling it just jettison him instead. I gave you a Miller cheers on that one. My preference is to keep the power forward that has been more of a consistent game changer. Petey is nice to have but he won’t win you games. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester13 Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 Just now, McBackup said: The ellipses is used to denote lost text. Not a "thoughtful pause", unless we're ignoring the actual use of written language like when we say "literally" to mean the complete opposite of what literally means. I'm not going to bother with the rest of your worthless post because you completely missed what was being said, I was not the one who started that, but you feel like you need to live up to your name and join in. An ellipses is used as an omission. In this instance, Provost first agreed with the poster and then omitted information before adding to the conversation, essentially saying to the poster, "I completely hear what you're saying, even agree with it, but...". Do you see the difference? Provost didn't actually say the words, "I hear what you're saying" but rather said it through an omission. This omission is his thoughtful pause. The difference is slight and can be hard for some to comprehend, but it's there. Maybe you can enlighten us as to how he used literally incorrectly? It seems as though you're missing something again here. Also, you have a misplaced comma after "being said", but, please, keep going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nergish Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 I am deathly serious here... Quinn Hughes is so far and away our best player, that I would put together an ungodly package to get his brothers on the Nucks. Anyone not named Demko or Quinn for the Hughes brothers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJC Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 8 minutes ago, grandmaster said: I gave you a Miller cheers on that one. My preference is to keep the power forward that has been more of a consistent game changer. Petey is nice to have but he won’t win you games. And only caveat to that…does Miller want to stay? I don’t think we can even risk that anymore and unfortunately he has to be traded because if this team can’t perform up to his expectation level (whether it be as a playoff contender or just a blood and guts identity) then he will become a malcontent. Better to maximize off his value, sadly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJC Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 Just now, nergish said: I am deathly serious here... Quinn Hughes is so far and away our best player, that I would put together an ungodly package to get his brothers on the Nucks. Anyone not named Demko or Quinn for the Hughes brothers. Funny, I had a dream last night that Garland, Rathbone and a 1st was sent to NJ for Jack Hughes. yeah I know, NJD would never accept that. Truthfully tho, a Jack Hughes isn’t what we would need anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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