[Rumour] Bo Horvat Trade/Contract Talks

[BureBurrito]

27 minutes ago, Nigerian said:

Also FWIW, Demko isn’t happy with the way his Injuries have been dealt with either. Hearing New Jersey is likely the spot and they want him and Hughes in a massive deal. 

Vancouver's medical staff used to be leading class and now they're ruining careers.

[Coconuts]

1 hour ago, Joe_Kerr said:

Not being able to get him re-signed just seems like an unacceptable excuse to me

 

1 hour ago, Sharpshooter said:

Unless it’s an unreal return for Horvat, everything must be done to keep him on the team. 
 

 

Horvat has to want to stay though and I don't reckon he does at this point. I doubt it's just about the money, he'd get the money from someone else somewhere else. I reckon it's also about winning, careers can end at any time and you only get so long to try and chase a cup, he sure as hell won't be doing that here any time soon. 

 

If Bo wants a cup, and I think he does, he'll have to go to a more competitive team. 

 

All he's done for the most part in Vancouver is lose, doesn't look like Vancouver will be winning more than losing any time soon. 

Edited January 21, 2023 by Coconuts

[MeanSeanBean]

45 minutes ago, Nigerian said:

I’ve got a very reliable source close to Neely saying that Boston is going for Horvat and that Neely was initially trying a multi player deal for Horvat + Boeser but wanted the Nucks to retain to much salary on both (mostly Boeser being the issue) 

 

32 minutes ago, Nigerian said:

Also FWIW, Demko isn’t happy with the way his Injuries have been dealt with either. Hearing New Jersey is likely the spot and they want him and Hughes in a massive deal. 

 

[Coconuts]

32 minutes ago, Nigerian said:

Also FWIW, Demko isn’t happy with the way his Injuries have been dealt with either. Hearing New Jersey is likely the spot and they want him and Hughes in a massive deal. 

Demko to Buffalo makes more sense. If they can find stability in net, beef up their D, and add some defensive minded players to their forward group they could probably be a playoff team sooner than later. 

 

Luukkonen may be pegged as the future but he's far from a sure thing. 

[steviewonder20]

4 hours ago, spook007 said:

The goalie situation has been debated into obliviousness... it was either Marky or Demko. 
As soon as Bubble Demko showed up, the problem arose. 
Prior to that, they may have held on to Marky and tried to sneak Demko through. 
Way too much crying (only my opinion) over the winger, and the fact that Tanev turned into iron man in Calgary, was not something anyone could foreseen.

the list of trade proposal including Tanev was endless as he was 'too old' and 'too injury prone'.... He was never properly replaced and that was/still is a major problem. He has still not been replaced...
It was disappointing to see Tanev and Marky go, but understandable. 
If anything, Benning should be held accountable for not knowing, that Demko was good enough to take over, and thus trade either Marky or Demko at TDL. 

 

For the record I was also annoyed to see Tanev go...

For me, the issue wasn't not retaining those players, it was losing them  (and Tofolli) for free. That’s inexcusable.

[Coconuts]

It's also telling how interested teams seem to keep crawling out of the woodwork regarding Bo, I don't recall so many teams being rumoured to be interested when the Miller speculation was at it's most intense. 

 

Doesn't shock me at all, some fans may not have been able to see his value here but clearly other teams do. 

[.Naslund]

31 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

It's also telling how interested teams seem to keep crawling out of the woodwork regarding Bo, I don't recall so many teams being rumoured to be interested when the Miller speculation was at it's most intense. 

 

Doesn't shock me at all, some fans may not have been able to see his value here but clearly other teams do. 

The same people who paid Jonathon Toews 10.5 million a year to put up second/third line stats. InTanGiBleZ

[Coconuts]

11 minutes ago, .Naslund said:

The same people who paid Jonathon Toews 10.5 million a year to put up second/third line stats. InTanGiBleZ

The hell are you going on about? That was a bad contract the moment it was signed, the identical contracts Toews and Kane signed were the beginning of the end for their cup aspirations.  But hey, winning three cups, providing the intangibles you mock, putting up top six level offense, being the team's top center, and showing up come playoff time gets you paid. 

 

Nobody's arguing Bo should be making 10.5M, let alone 9M.  

 

Toews has put up top six level offense almost his entire career. https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=93829

Edited January 21, 2023 by Coconuts

[Ted Lasso]

1 hour ago, Nigerian said:

Also FWIW, Demko isn’t happy with the way his Injuries have been dealt with either. Hearing New Jersey is likely the spot and they want him and Hughes in a massive deal. 

Eklund? Is that you?

[bishopshodan]

1 hour ago, Nigerian said:

I’ve got a very reliable source close to Neely saying that Boston is going for Horvat and that Neely was initially trying a multi player deal for Horvat + Boeser but wanted the Nucks to retain to much salary on both (mostly Boeser being the issue) 

 

1 hour ago, Nigerian said:

Also FWIW, Demko isn’t happy with the way his Injuries have been dealt with either. Hearing New Jersey is likely the spot and they want him and Hughes in a massive deal. 

Do you happen to be a Nigerian Prince?

I haven't seen the money you promised in my bank account. 

[Junkyard Dog]

Just now, bishopshodan said:

 

Do you happen to be a Nigerian Prince?

I haven't seen the money you promised in my bank account. 

 

[JeremyCuddles]

1 hour ago, Coconuts said:

It's also telling how interested teams seem to keep crawling out of the woodwork regarding Bo, I don't recall so many teams being rumoured to be interested when the Miller speculation was at it's most intense. 

 

Doesn't shock me at all, some fans may not have been able to see his value here but clearly other teams do. 

Or teams are familiar with Miller. Bo is a professional at all times. Only our fanbase hates leaders like the Sedins and Horvat. Miller is loud and a spaz. For some reason people like that. With the support Trump got. Being the loudest guy in the room is a trait people like I guess. Be damned what that person is saying.

[MeanSeanBean]

1 hour ago, Coconuts said:

It's also telling how interested teams seem to keep crawling out of the woodwork regarding Bo, I don't recall so many teams being rumoured to be interested when the Miller speculation was at it's most intense. 

 

Doesn't shock me at all, some fans may not have been able to see his value here but clearly other teams do. 

There was no where near the amount of interest in Miller. At least, if there was, not publically. As much as I hate that we signed Miller long term, it does make more sense after seeing what an actually desirable trade asset looks like. Must have been very minimal value in Miller 

[Coconuts]

17 minutes ago, Shayster007 said:

There was no where near the amount of interest in Miller. At least, if there was, not publically. As much as I hate that we signed Miller long term, it does make more sense after seeing what an actually desirable trade asset looks like. Must have been very minimal value in Miller 

Unfortunately I also chalk that up to management having made up their mind on Miller, Miller was also a different animal. 

 

If you look at Miller's first couple seasons as a Canuck he'd hovered closer to a point per game and that was the first time his entire career that he'd shown the ability to do that. He'd shown that he could put up top six level offense his last couple years in New York and during his time in Tampa but he hadn't been hovering around point per game. Then he blew up in his later 20's, it's not as if he was a MacKinnon hitting his stride and elevating his game, it looked more like a career season than Miller suddenly figuring something out. 

 

If the Canucks were asking for the kind of return a player who regularly puts up 90-100 points might get it's not a shocker that there probably weren't many interested parties, Miller didn't have the track record of consistently putting up that kind of offense. Guys like MacKinnon and Marner have that track record. JT's probably a point per game guy at best. That's not bad, but if the ask doesn't reflect that you'll probably have a tough time finding a taker. 

 

Bo is more of a Swiss army knife than Miller is and does everything Miller does better than Miller except for the offensive side of things and regularly providing a more physical game. But even then, if you look at their career numbers it's not as far off as folks make it out to be. Bo is two years younger and has 200 goals and 215 assists in 617 gams, most of this having been accomplished while being saddled with subpar wingers. Miller has 186 goals and 308 assists in 682 games. 415 points vs 494 with Miller having played 65 more games. Bo is a legitimate top 6 center who could slot in and fill multiple roles for any team who acquires him and who'd probably thrive playing with legit top six talent on a more talented roster, Miller is a top six winger who can win draws but who struggles with the defensive responsibility that comes with playing center. 

 

Management bought their own hype, thought we were further ahead than we were despite recognizing that Demko covered a lot of the rosters shortcomings. 

Edited January 22, 2023 by Coconuts

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

Unfortunately I also chalk that up to management having made up their mind on Miller, Miller was also a different animal. 

 

If you look at Miller's first couple seasons as a Canuck he'd hovered closer to a point per game and that was the first time his entire career that he'd shown the ability to do that. He'd shown that he could put up top six level offense his last couple years in New York and during his time in Tampa but he hadn't been hovering around point per game. Then he blew up in his later 20's, it's not as if he was a MacKinnon hitting his stride and elevating his game, it looked more like a career season than Miller suddenly figuring something out. 

 

If the Canucks were asking for the kind of return a player who regularly puts up 90-100 points might get it's not a shocker that there probably weren't many interested parties, Miller didn't have the track record of consistently putting up that kind of offense. Guys like MacKinnon and Marner have that track record. JT's probably a point per game guy at best. That's not bad, but if the ask doesn't reflect that you'll probably have a tough time finding a taker. 

 

Bo is more of a Swiss army knife than Miller is and does everything Miller does better than Miller except for the offensive side of things and regularly providing a more physical game. But even then, if you look at their career numbers it's not as far off as folks make it out to be. Bo is two years young and has 200 goals and 215 assists in 617 gams, most of this having been accomplished while being saddled with subpar wingers. Miller has 186 goals and 308 assists in 682 games. 415 points vs 494 with Miller having played 65 more games. Bo is a legitimate top 6 center who could slot in and fill multiple roles for any team who acquires him and who'd probably thrive playing with legit top six talent on a more talented roster, Miller is a top six winger who can win draws but who struggles with the defensive responsibility that comes with playing center. 

 

Management bought their own hype, thought we were further ahead than we were despite recognizing that Demko covered a lot of the rosters shortcomings. 

Rumour was we had a solid (futures) offer from the Rags for Miller a couple weeks before the TDL.  Our team was winning and pushing for a playoff spot.  And Miller was th3 guy (along with Demko) leading the charge.  Then Friedman said we took Miller off the market and intended to extend him in the summer.  Not too sure if that wasn’t our owner stepping in because we were doing so well and Miller was the key guy.  Easy to understand why our owner would do that too.  The stretch run of games were exciting.  

[Coconuts]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Rumour was we had a solid (futures) offer from the Rags for Miller a couple weeks before the TDL.  Our team was winning and pushing for a playoff spot.  And Miller was th3 guy (along with Demko) leading the charge.  Then Friedman said we took Miller off the market and intended to extend him in the summer.  Not too sure if that wasn’t our owner stepping in because we were doing so well and Miller was the key guy.  Easy to understand why our owner would do that too.  The stretch run of games were exciting.  

Like I said, I'm pretty sure management had already made up their mind at that point unfortunately. It was likely going to take an unrealistic kind of offer for them to move Miller. That Bruce bump was fun to watch but in retrospect it was the worst thing that could have happened last season as if led management and segments of the fanbase to believe we were further along than we really were. We weren't that second half team we were also that first half team, it wasn't a tale of two seasons we were both halves and that's continued this season. The biggest difference being Demko isn't covering for us anymore. 

 

Same thing goes for the bubble playoffs, same deal. That season Markstrom had gone down with a knee injury and we were sliding prior to the season being canceled. We had a high enough point percentage or whatever to make the cut for the previously non-existent playoff round and went on to play a stretch of good hockey. Had the season continued we likely would have missed and we probably wouldn't have gone out and made the OEL and Garland trade. Benning thought we were further ahead than we were, funny how that's a recurring theme. 

 

We should have traded Miller, signed Bo during the summer, actually begun addressing our defense, and been willing to possibly take a step back to take multiple steps going forward. We'd likely have a better record with a more well-rounded roster. But hey, woulda coulda shoulda. 

[Nigerian]

1 hour ago, bishopshodan said:

 

Do you happen to be a Nigerian Prince?

I haven't seen the money you promised in my bank account. 

Unreal. I’ll follow up with another email. You just may have to make another quick one time payment. 

[Nigerian]

1 hour ago, Kenny Powers said:

Eklund? Is that you?

My name is clearly Nigerian. 
 

E4

[Nigerian]

2 hours ago, Shayster007 said:

 

 

Jenn Law, really? Listen here you lil shyster007

[Alflives]

8 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

Like I said, I'm pretty sure management had already made up their mind at that point unfortunately. It was likely going to take an unrealistic kind of offer for them to move Miller. That Bruce bump was fun to watch but in retrospect it was the worst thing that could have happened last season as if led management and segments of the fanbase to believe we were further along than we really were. We weren't that second half team we were also that first half team, it wasn't a tale of two seasons we were both halves and that's continued this season. The biggest difference being Demko isn't covering for us anymore. 

 

Same thing goes for the bubble playoffs, same deal. That season Markstrom had gone down with a knee injury and we were sliding prior to the season being canceled. We had a high enough point percentage or whatever to make the cut for the previously non-existent playoff round and went on to play a stretch of good hockey. Had the season continued we likely would have missed and we probably wouldn't have gone out and made the OEL and Garland trade. Benning thought we were further ahead than we were, funny how that's a recurring theme. 

 

We should have traded Miller, signed Bo during the summer, actually begun addressing our defense, and been willing to possibly take a step back to take multiple steps going forward. We'd likely have a better record with a more well-rounded roster. But hey, woulda coulda shoulda. 

You make good sense.  And the one constant across both: last season’s BB bump and the Bubble success (which were both not truly a representation of where our club really was) is our owner.