D.B Cooper Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 22 minutes ago, aGENT said: I've had cancer. I never had to deal with any wait times etc for care when I was under treatment. Our medical system has numerous flaws, no doubt, but they're pretty damn good about triaging critical care accordingly. Or at least they were pre-Covid. Anti-Vaxxers are the main reason there's issues with that today. Not the government, not health care workers (who should be bloody applauded for their efforts at not letting the entire system collapse under such selfish, short sighted, and ignorant strain). I’m not debating those @ssholes are filling beds, and I’d never blame healthcare workers. They are straight up super heroes. Ive been witnessing people waiting for important surgeries since I can remember. I’m very happy you were able to get great treatment. Let’s not act like that is the usual though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 1 minute ago, D.B Cooper said: I’m not debating those @ssholes are filling beds, and I’d never blame healthcare workers. They are straight up super heroes. Ive been witnessing people waiting for important surgeries since I can remember. I’m very happy you were able to get great treatment. Let’s not act like that is the usual though. So is sending these idiots to the back of the line going to make things better or worse for most people? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, D.B Cooper said: I’m not debating those @ssholes are filling beds, and I’d never blame healthcare workers. They are straight up super heroes. Ive been witnessing people waiting for important surgeries since I can remember. I’m very happy you were able to get great treatment. Let’s not act like that is the usual though. But it is usual for critical care. Cancer patients, stabbing/gunshot vivtims, heart attacks etc....those people get seen (or did, pre Covid anyway). My elderly, overweight and out of shape mother had to wait for her knee surgery, yes. It's called triage. And nobody's suggesting it's perfect or without it's flaws. Edited January 11, 2022 by aGENT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.B Cooper Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 47 minutes ago, King Heffy said: So is sending these idiots to the back of the line going to make things better or worse for most people? I’d run them through like any regular day. Most urgent people gets the first care. Im not saying put these dummies at the front of the line. Im saying we shouldn’t be choosing to let our friends or neighbors die because of a difference of opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedestroyerofworlds Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 Or you could be the USA and if you don't have the cash, you're SOL. That is how their care is rationed. There really isn't a silver bullet that can erase all problems. When I broke a bone, I got seen and got surgery for it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24K PureCool Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 (edited) 25 minutes ago, D.B Cooper said: I’d run them through like any regular day. Most urgent people gets the first care. Im not saying put these dummies at the front of the line. Im saying we shouldn’t be choosing to let our friends or neighbors die because of a difference of opinion. Let's say there is only one bed and two people came in with severe covid symptoms and one is vaxxed, the other is un-vaxxed. I know for sure who I'll put into that bed. Edited January 11, 2022 by 24K PureCool 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24K PureCool Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 My only hesitancy with covid passport is that they will inevitably botch the implementation and make it a headache for everyone. Stick it to what we already have like driver license and passports and check it where people will need those anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.B Cooper Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 25 minutes ago, 24K PureCool said: Let's say there is only one bed and two people came in with severe covid symptoms and one is vaxxed, the other is un-vaxxed. I know for sure who I'll put into that bed. Me too. Im not saying put unvaxed over vaxed whatsoever. Not at all. I stand by the people, like myself included, who did the right thing and got vaxed and tried to make the right moves to stay out of the hospital. People here are saying no treatment whatsoever, and that’s what I’m calling gross. We cant be leaving each other to die in a hospital parking lot waiting to get in. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24K PureCool Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 (edited) 10 minutes ago, D.B Cooper said: Me too. Im not saying put unvaxed over vaxed whatsoever. Not at all. I stand by the people, like myself included, who did the right thing and got vaxed and tried to make the right moves to stay out of the hospital. People here are saying no treatment whatsoever, and that’s what I’m calling gross. We cant be leaving each other to die in a hospital parking lot waiting to get in. I say make them pay a premium like before Horgan got rid of it. They are an extra risk to the health system and thus need to be charged accordingly. Edited January 11, 2022 by 24K PureCool 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 3 minutes ago, 24K PureCool said: I say make them pay a premium like before Horgan got rid of it. They are an extra risk to the health system and thus need to be charged accordingly. Follow Quebec's lead here. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 14 minutes ago, D.B Cooper said: Me too. Im not saying put unvaxed over vaxed whatsoever. Not at all. I stand by the people, like myself included, who did the right thing and got vaxed and tried to make the right moves to stay out of the hospital. People here are saying no treatment whatsoever, and that’s what I’m calling gross. We cant be leaving each other to die in a hospital parking lot waiting to get in. I would never suggest not offering care personally. But I'd be just fine if they passed laws leaving unvaccinated citizens responsible for the costs of any Covid related health issues they have. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 2 hours ago, DrJockitch said: This is France, they protest everything all the time. Anyone who spent significant time in French cities will know that. Also, anyone who's watched a game at the old Montreal Forum..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 32 minutes ago, D.B Cooper said: Me too. Im not saying put unvaxed over vaxed whatsoever. Not at all. I stand by the people, like myself included, who did the right thing and got vaxed and tried to make the right moves to stay out of the hospital. People here are saying no treatment whatsoever, and that’s what I’m calling gross. We cant be leaving each other to die in a hospital parking lot waiting to get in. The healthcare problem has been oversimplified by many to suggest that the main problem is non vaccinated patients. The system had major problems pre-Covid and to many people are ignoring that reality. So no, many people with life altering health issues were not getting care in a timely manner. Look at the wait lists prior to Covid. My son works in a hospital and simply shakes his head at the lack of management. Underfunding for many equipment needs, wasteful spending in other areas. No effective process for resolving operational issues. If you have friends in healthcare ask them what they are experiencing? If the magic cure for Covid comes out tomorrow will everyone assume business as usual? Do we get another 5 year investigation on what failed here? A study that won’t amount to any changes? That is the most likely scenario. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.B Cooper Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 1 hour ago, aGENT said: I would never suggest not offering care personally. But I'd be just fine if they passed laws leaving unvaccinated citizens responsible for the costs of any Covid related health issues they have. They have paid it though. Just like every citizen in the country. So you want them to pay for eveyone else’s stay (who would rather see them die according to lots here) as well as an extra fee on top? Why would they do that? It would be much easier to stop paying MSP and extended health coverage and take that money to private treatment. You guys may not like it, but this is group insurance. A retaining wall started collapsing at the opposite side of my townhouse complex. 5 minute walk away from my house. We all payed for the repair. I didn’t like it, but that’s what happens in a community Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 (edited) 17 minutes ago, D.B Cooper said: They have paid it though. Just like every citizen in the country. So you want them to pay for eveyone else’s stay (who would rather see them die according to lots here) as well as an extra fee on top? Yes. 17 minutes ago, D.B Cooper said: Why would they do that? Same reason smokers pay extra taxes. 17 minutes ago, D.B Cooper said: It would be much easier to stop paying MSP and extended health coverage and take that money to private treatment. Fill your boots. 17 minutes ago, D.B Cooper said: You guys may not like it, but this is group insurance. A retaining wall started collapsing at the opposite side of my townhouse complex. 5 minute walk away from my house. We all payed for the repair. I didn’t like it, but that’s what happens in a community No it isn't and group insurance has limits. Risky behaviour that's harmful or exorbitantly costly to the rest of that group is frequently not covered and/or charged appropriately for. As for your poor retaining wall analogy... No, this is more like your collapsing retaining wall doing direct and obvious damage to your elderly neighbours property and causing risk to their safety and you telling them that you will pay your fair share but otherwise refuse to lift a finger to help them. Edit: While actively taking actions that worsen the condition of the wall. Edited January 11, 2022 by aGENT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24K PureCool Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 11 minutes ago, D.B Cooper said: They have paid it though. Just like every citizen in the country. So you want them to pay for eveyone else’s stay (who would rather see them die according to lots here) as well as an extra fee on top? Why would they do that? It would be much easier to stop paying MSP and extended health coverage and take that money to private treatment. You guys may not like it, but this is group insurance. A retaining wall started collapsing at the opposite side of my townhouse complex. 5 minute walk away from my house. We all payed for the repair. I didn’t like it, but that’s what happens in a community The system is an insurance scheme, those involved in more risky behaviour will be charged a higher premium. Not getting vaxxed is a riskier behaviour and should be charged more accordingly. Also, un-vaxxed will pay into the msp through taxes whether they like it or not. It is not like there is a separate tax scheme for this like the vacancy tax. If they don't want to pay the additional msp, they can go and pay for care themselves but chances are it will cost them way more than just paying the premiums. It is more equivalent to not putting in a claim to the insurance you already have so you can avoid the deductible. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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