(Rumour) Nux have given permission for Boeser’s agent to talk to other teams

[RWJC]

1 hour ago, aGENT said:

I hope they also revisit the "is Miller a long term fit here" issue personally.

 

If I had my way, we'd move him before Bo. 

If I had my way we’d move them both (+ others) and really make a fresh start with some decent assets as a kickstarter 

Edited December 7, 2022 by RWJC

[JayDangles]

21 hours ago, RWJC said:

The problem is perception. 
Especially fan perception and the homogenization of a player and their skill set. What people want else from Boeser is not his forte. Same goes with Bo. 
You have fans coming on the board and ranting and raving about a player not doing this or that, but more often than not it’s because they just aren’t that type of player. But this is continuously overlooked and then picked apart as nauseam.

 

Boeser is not a defensive stalwart and never will be. Injuries have plagued his best asset - his shot. 
 

Bo is not a physical F. He doesn’t have to hit for us to win a f**king game, so get over it.

 

If a player isn’t playing up to capability and giving a poor effort (like JTM has shown on numerous occasions) then by all means, analyze to death because we know he can play better.

 

Boeser may have peaked, maybe not.

but for people to continually admonish him for aspects that arent part of his game, or never were, is just redundant.

 

I think the personal and professional sides of sports are prone to being blurred. That’s just the nature of being in the spotlight. 
 

in this case, it’s not just about taking it easy on him because of his loss, it’s also berating a player for not using a skill set that isn’t inherently part of theirs to begin with. Again - homogenization by some in the fan base. That’s why BB6 has fans that defend him…because he gets attacked for shortcomings that become a focus when others who are capable in that capacity fail at their responsibility.

 

im no BB6 homer and have said many times both him and the club are better parting ways, but he does get a lot of unfair criticism imho. 

I don't know. I don't agree or disagree. I mean some players are willing to build in different areas in order to be a more rounded player.

How many times have you heard a new guy come in and say things like "whatever they need me to do, block shots, be physical, kill penalties" etc

 

I don't know that people are admonishing BB6 for "aspects that aren't part of his game" I mean back checking, playing defense, scoring goals, being tough on the boards, those are just part of the game and should be in every players wheelhouse.

 

In regards to Bo being physical or not, my issue is that Bo does 2 things wrong in the physical department.

1. He actually avoids hitting. He does so many fly bys it's ridiculous. Hitting can be strategic and if the other team knows Bo won't hit then they will have more time to make decisions etc.

2. Hitting can be used as a tool to gain momentum, to turn the tides, to rally the team etc. His failure to have this tool in his toolbox makes him a less effective captain.

 

So to sum up, of course some players are better at different aspects of the game than others, but they are still hockey players. They grew up playing hockey, they know, or should know how to tap into areas of their game that aren't their primary skill set.

 

It would appear to me that the only 2 players that know how to make in-game assessments And adjust their play accordingly are Petey and Schenn.

That's a big problem in regular season and don't even get me started on what will happen if this team ever made the playoffs!

[Darius]

1 minute ago, EddieVedder said:

Why does brock have far and away the worst plus/minus on the team?  Why does he have the worst plus/minus out of every forward in the league?  

There is so much delusion on this board.  

Well Eddie, this is one of the worst defensive teams in the NHL, with one of the worst goalie performances, Id expect some of the forwards not to be lighting it up in the plus minus department.  Reminds me of Bo Horvat a few years ago, amongst the leagues worst, even though everyone knew he wasnt that bad.

 

Also, I find your double standard amusing.  You attribute his assists/secondary assists to serendipity, but refuse to do the same with his plus minus.  If its possible for 'luck' to be the explanation for him getting a point after a couple guys have touched the puck, it is also possible that his plus minus is inflated in the wrong direction after other players, such as the goalie, have not done their job.  In light of the fact that defence / goaltending has been horrible this year, id expect some of the players plus minus to be skewed in the wrong direction. That said, I dont have faith in your ability to understand this.

 

 

[Bure_Pavel]

11 minutes ago, -Vintage Canuck- said:

 

Glad there is no sweetener being discussed, fairly obviously they will have to take a contract back. Only a handful of tanking teams can take on Boesers full contract without send money the other way. 

[RWJC]

29 minutes ago, JayDangles said:

I don't know. I don't agree or disagree. I mean some players are willing to build in different areas in order to be a more rounded player.

How many times have you heard a new guy come in and say things like "whatever they need me to do, block shots, be physical, kill penalties" etc

 

I don't know that people are admonishing BB6 for "aspects that aren't part of his game" I mean back checking, playing defense, scoring goals, being tough on the boards, those are just part of the game and should be in every players wheelhouse.

 

In regards to Bo being physical or not, my issue is that Bo does 2 things wrong in the physical department.

1. He actually avoids hitting. He does so many fly bys it's ridiculous. Hitting can be strategic and if the other team knows Bo won't hit then they will have more time to make decisions etc.

2. Hitting can be used as a tool to gain momentum, to turn the tides, to rally the team etc. His failure to have this tool in his toolbox makes him a less effective captain.

 

So to sum up, of course some players are better at different aspects of the game than others, but they are still hockey players. They grew up playing hockey, they know, or should know how to tap into areas of their game that aren't their primary skill set.

 

It would appear to me that the only 2 players that know how to make in-game assessments And adjust their play accordingly are Petey and Schenn.

That's a big problem in regular season and don't even get me started on what will happen if this team ever made the playoffs!

Let’s put it this way…the league’s Ironman is a one dimensional F who doesn’t do any of what you described but score goals, yet has had a  very lengthy and successful career with many teams interested in his services. 
 

Should we now expect Phil Kessel to change his game and adapt and become a 2 way grinder because he’s a bit long in the tooth?  Nah, it doesn’t happen like that for the majority of skilled offense minded players.  You get the small few who can transition that way, but it’s not a common occurrence across the board. And even if BB6 did become more of a complete player while struggling to score goals, he’s not being paid to do that. It’s not why he was signed for his current contract. That value is for goals and production, because mgmt has prioritized that from him. Checking, 2 way play, is what guys like Aman, Lazar, are being paid for. 
 

I understand what you’re saying and I agree in that I would love to have a cast of players who can adapt, but unfortunately it’s been evident for a long time that BB6 is limited in that capacity.

And that is why he needs to be replaced because at that contract value, we need to extract more from that price point.

 

We don’t ask or expect Demko to turn into Hextall/Billy Smith when the opposition is pushing play into the crease. We expect the D to push back.

bad example, but I guess what I’m saying is that there are certain defined roles, and while BB6 is capable of playing with a stronger defensive IQ, it should be expected that he will follow his own true nature and default to being an offense driven thinker.

 

that goes for Bo as well to a degree. Bo is often the catalyst on the line that he’s placed on. He doesn’t often hit because it will put him out of position, which is a major issue when playing as C. He’s the transition piece and needs to be readily in the play on both sides of the ice. That may sound like an excuse, but as witnessed this year, Bo can be an offensive dynamo…problem is he’s been asked for years to play the 2 way role. 
As we can see especially this year, the way he chooses to play that style is majorly effective. The guy is 3rd in NHL scoring, FFS. Does he really need to be hitting too or do we have other players who can fill that role??? I’d rather him be scoring and driving this team like a captain than also looking to make big hits that aren’t specific to his wheel house, and potentially undermine what little success this team is having because of him.

 

 

 

Edited December 7, 2022 by RWJC

[SilentSam]

2 hours ago, Petey Castiglione said:

Not everyone has the same emotional capacity.  Everyone process' emotions differently and its clear Brock is an empathetic person who's had quite a bit of tragedy happen to him.  His best friend died in a car accident before going pro.  His dad passes from cancer.  He tries to do good, helps out a special needs kid who's a big fan of his and I'm sure there's more he does that we don't know about.  This "suck it up and play" is a bad hold over from the previous generations work force.  Kinda sucks if you dad dies and your boss tells you to "suck it up and play your ass off".   All the money in the world ain't gonna bring his Dad back.

Then a leave of absence should be granted to Brock ( without pay) until he sorts his issues out.   His play has let down this team , and the contract he signed for looks ridiculous.

 

I think enough time and empathy has been given,  and Brock needs to deal with this alone.

 

 

Sure enough he will get traded somewhere else,  and wake himself up to the idea that LIFE goes on,  it dosent stop,.   And you have to progress from your losses.

 

Death is a stop ,    

Only memories are left behind , and the attachment to those memories should bring you pride. Make you feel proud for the times you had, and where they have placed you for your future to go forward with.

Be proud.

When you feel the loss,  fill back up with pride of being so close to that person and what you shared.

 

That is how you honour death..  you let it live on through you, and with you into the future before you.

           What is Dead may never die.

 

Latin:    quid agis ut mortui non mori

 

 

 

[Canucks Curse]

A trade for Lucic + CGY 2nd for Boeser makes sense for both sides, Lucic can resign for cheap if he wants, and we get a 2nd, tbh I would even take a 3rd and 4th instead of 2nd to get out from under the cap, Lucic gives some toughness and can gives us cap space at years end and another voice and some deterrent for other teams.

[RWJC]

8 minutes ago, SilentSam said:

Then a leave of absence should be granted to Brock ( without pay) until he sorts his issues out.   His play has let down this team , and the contract he signed for looks ridiculous.

 

I think enough time and empathy has been given,  and Brock needs to deal with this alone.

 

 

Sure enough he will get traded somewhere else,  and wake himself up to the idea that LIFE goes on,  it dosent stop,.   And you have to progress from your losses.

 

Death is a stop ,    

Only memories are left behind , and the attachment to those memories should bring you pride. Make you feel proud for the times you had, and where they have placed you for your future to go forward with.

Be proud.

When you feel the loss,  fill back up with pride of being so close to that person and what you shared.

 

That is how you honour death..  you let it live on through you, and with you into the future before you.

           What is Dead may never die.

 

Latin:    quid agis ut mortui non mori

 

 

 

That exactly it. He hasnt taken a leave because he feels responsible to this club.

 

Why are we complaining about a guy who is just below a ppg pace this season after recent events? That’s enough proof he’s trying to bounce back, no? Then what the f**k is?

 

at what f**king point is anyone good enough for this fanbase???

 

Infuriating. 

 

If fans want to target anyone, focus on the team management. They are the ones handing out the contracts to these players and continuing to choose to employ a cast that doesn’t f**king work. There’s your “fall guy”. Not some dude who is actually playing reasonably well considering all the setbacks he’s faced since his rookie season. 

 

Edited December 7, 2022 by RWJC

[Darius]

Just now, RWJC said:

Why are we complaining about a guy who is just below a ppg pace this season after recent events? That’s enough proof he’s trying to bounce back, no? Then what the f**k is?

 

at what f**king point is anyone good enough for this fanbase???

 

Infuriating. 

 

its kinda puzzling seeing the sharks circle around certain players this year. 

 

Bo Horvat is another example.  Kid is on a Pavel Bure goal scoring pace, amongst the best clips/rates of scoring in the 50+ years of this franchise,  but he doesnt hit and intimidate enough.  Not captain material. Bizarre.  If you told me in 2013 that Bo Horvat will turn into one of the league's elite face off centres while sustaining a pavel Bure goal pace during his prime time window...and then in the same breath said there would be an element in the crowd that wont think he is captain material...i would not have believe it.    

 

I go into HF BOARDS and see other fan bases assessment of Bo and it is obvious he is highly regarded.  

 

 

[shazzam]

50 minutes ago, EddieVedder said:

Why does brock have far and away the worst plus/minus on the team?  Why does he have the worst plus/minus out of every forward in the league?  

There is so much delusion on this board.  

Check out Montreal's go ahead goal from the other night. Boeser standing there thinking he's Ovechkin 

[Sophomore Jinx]

11 minutes ago, Canucks Curse said:

A trade for Lucic + CGY 2nd for Boeser makes sense for both sides, Lucic can resign for cheap if he wants, and we get a 2nd, tbh I would even take a 3rd and 4th instead of 2nd to get out from under the cap, Lucic gives some toughness and can gives us cap space at years end and another voice and some deterrent for other teams.

Lucic? 

 

At this point, the 2nd, or 3rd & 4th and bonus of nearly $7M in cap relief will suffice.

 

He needs a fresh start, and a parting of ways should be facilitated with everyone's best interest in mind, no mudslinging, posturing, or wringing of hands. Just an honest business transaction, beneficial to all......but I have little faith in this FO, so we'll wait and see how this all plays out, I guess.

 

[SilentSam]

6 minutes ago, RWJC said:

That exactly it. He hasnt taken a leave because he feels responsible to this club.

 

Why are we complaining about a guy who is just below a ppg pace this season after recent events? That’s enough proof he’s trying to bounce back, no? Then what the f**k is?

 

at what f**king point is anyone good enough for this fanbase???

 

Infuriating. 

 

I don’t know if anything exists in the CBA in matters like this,. But it should.

especially If a contract has to be dealt with in the same time period in a death/ loss situation.

Perhaps even a suggested / allowance to the Cap for any team involved with “said” player.

 

Every one handles the death of a loved one differently,.   and a sudden / tragic loss is different from one that slowly dissipates.… but it needs to be addressed properly.

 

My personal take on life and death is this:

 

the sooner we all realize our mortality, 

the sooner we respect death,.  
Only then do we realize how precious life is,  and how the lives of those we lose can live on thru us.

 

Hopefully Brock has found the “breast pocket beside his own heart” to carry his dad in proudly.

 

Having said all of that ,.  Perhaps Brock has just made the realizations to realize he can not die on his fathers sword.

 

I hope for him , that is the case.

[SilentSam]

12 minutes ago, Darius said:

its kinda puzzling seeing the sharks circle around certain players this year. 

 

Bo Horvat is another example.  Kid is on a Pavel Bure goal scoring pace, amongst the best clips/rates of scoring in the 50+ years of this franchise,  but he doesnt hit and intimidate enough.  Not captain material. Bizarre.  If you told me in 2013 that Bo Horvat will turn into one of the league's elite face off centres while sustaining a pavel Bure goal pace during his prime time window...and then in the same breath said there would be an element in the crowd that wont think he is captain material...i would not have believe it.    

 

I go into HF BOARDS and see other fan bases assessment of Bo and it is obvious he is highly regarded.  

 

 

Those other teams Fans probably have more aggressive forwards to support Bo’ s game.

[Darius]

1 minute ago, SilentSam said:

Those other teams Fans probably have more aggressive forwards to support Bo’ s game.

So you want agression, on top of the 40-60 goals, top tier face off abilities....guy that hits, fights, scores....you are asking for a unicorn.

[EddieVedder]

23 minutes ago, RWJC said:

That exactly it. He hasnt taken a leave because he feels responsible to this club.

 

Why are we complaining about a guy who is just below a ppg pace this season after recent events? That’s enough proof he’s trying to bounce back, no? Then what the f**k is?

 

at what f**king point is anyone good enough for this fanbase???

 

Infuriating. 

 

If fans want to target anyone, focus on the team management. They are the ones handing out the contracts to these players and continuing to choose to employ a cast that doesn’t f**king work. There’s your “fall guy”. Not some dude who is actually playing reasonably well considering all the setbacks he’s faced since his rookie season. 

 

Why is it so hard to understand that if we want to keep Horvat, we need to get rid of boeser?  

Hes been a pro for over 6 years- its time to stop making excuses for him.  

 

 

[Elias Pettersson]

1 hour ago, EddieVedder said:

Why does brock have far and away the worst plus/minus on the team?  Why does he have the worst plus/minus out of every forward in the league?  

There is so much delusion on this board.  

Brock has always been a minus player. 5 out of his 6 seasons he’s been a minus player.  Compare that to Elias Pettersson who has always been a plus player in his 5 year career.  Miller has been a minus player in 7 out of 13 seasons.  Hornet has been a minus player in 7 out of 9 seasons. 

[Jester13]

Although I know we could use the cap space by trading Brock, and he's probably the slowest player on the team and maybe even has the worst defence of any forward, I still do have a concern that if he leaves then so, too, will Petey, especially after Brock getting scratched on such an important night to him and his family.

 

So far, this management group has continued like Benning, and possibly even made the whole debacle worse since getting here.

[RWJC]

3 minutes ago, EddieVedder said:

Why is it so hard to understand that if we want to keep Horvat, we need to get rid of boeser?  

Hes been a pro for over 6 years- its time to stop making excuses for him.  

 

 

No one is making excuses for him and no one needs to. Just look at facts Eddie and you’ll see a player who had a hot start and hadn’t lived up to the hype, expectation and hope cast on him.

You can trash him all you want, but he’s not a player who has given up on anything. With all that’s gone on it’s set him back. Straight up.

Very common to pick someone apart when you think you deserve more from them…and that’s kind of my whole point. You expect more and at the same

time when you get it, you look for other means to support your rationale. I mean let’s face it - you’re pointing out flaws because you think he’s not good enough, yet you passionately argue against what good he’s also trying to accomplish when he does. You’re biased and detracting from his current improvements because your only focus is to argue for your perspective. 

 

Like others, I believe he should be traded and both sides start fresh.

I think a complete and total reset is on order, especially with this mgmt team/too many cooks that we have now. 
They’ve had enough time, let’s put it on their shoulders instead of continually blaming past GMs and whatever else we can grasp onto for the current state.

 

if this mgmt team is worth their weight, then go full bore and take a responsible claim for this roster. Make the changes. Lets f**king Go. I’m sick of the anemic stance that they keep spinning.

[SilentSam]

12 minutes ago, Darius said:

So you want agression, on top of the 40-60 goals, top tier face off abilities....guy that hits, fights, scores....you are asking for a unicorn.

It dosent have to be 40-60 goals if a guy plays a complete game and not play a complimentary role as just a goal scorer.

EP Is actually showing more tenacity and aggression than Bo or Brock put together, and his time in the NHL is less.

No unicorns necessary,  maybe they can learn something from EP.

 

Im just tired of watching players sign their UFA contracts to play safe and disengaged.

 

Im concerned that is the tendency that might come with Bo or Brock..   that has been our culture here.

 

[RWJC]

16 minutes ago, Jester13 said:

Although I know we could use the cap space by trading Brock, and he's probably the slowest player on the team and maybe even has the worst defence of any forward, I still do have a concern that if he leaves then so, too, will Petey, especially after Brock getting scratched on such an important night to him and his family.

 

So far, this management group has continued like Benning, and possibly even made the whole debacle worse since getting here.

Doesn’t matter. It’s time.

if it means that team falls apart, then that’s prime example of why they can’t succeed to begin with, ya know?  If the players are that passionate about their friends status in the dressing room, then show it on the ice. Unfortunately a player’s coach like Green only enabled the country club. That’s now a fixture. 
Blow it up because it’s an insidious aspect of any team identity. 

Edited December 7, 2022 by RWJC