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#31 Kesler's Nose

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 05:02 PM

The main guilty parties of this horrific maneuver are Alex Edler and Kevin Bieksa. I think that it is the most brutal play to watch in the Canucks' arsenal, even when it works.

First of all, when it doesn't work, you look like a complete dope. Second of all it is becoming far too predictable. And finally, you lose all your momentum entering the zone. Even on a power play, it just doesn't seem feasable to me, and is just scarring to watch.

My body literally cringes every time one of the forementioned uses this tactic. Am I wrong for feeling this way? Or am I not alone?


Actually I believe Edler and the Sedin twins use it more. Kes and Bur were doing it for a bit.. It's not too bad of a move, I'd much rather see them stop with the cross ice passes... Those are killing us with the take overs! Let's see some more defensive responsibility from our forwards and especially our D, I mean damn it's about time they stop thinking about offense.

The offense will come by itself, it's the defensive coverage that has to be necessary. We can win games even if they are low scoring, but if we are behind because of defensive errors then we're pretty much screwed. Besides, our team has a hidden offensive spike that could show up out of no where.. It's just a matter of time. I notice that Lu started falling off a hell of a lot more after the team started focusing on an offense first type of system, just saying. <_<

Edited by Kesler's Nose, 28 January 2013 - 05:03 PM.

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#32 Hockey Fever

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 05:29 PM

They have to be more unpredictable, and yeah i was thinking the same thing about the drop pass. It's starting to drive me nuts.
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#33 brewdog

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 05:30 PM

It's a fine play when it works (75% of the time, maybe?). It's just so high-risk when it doesn't click. Offensive-zone faceoffs after a penalty were the best thing that ever happened to the Canucks because we've never been great at gaining the zone.

If I was running the PP, I'd say... hmmm... Edler fake the drop, dish to Raymond/Burrows, cross the blueline with speed, buttonhook on the half boards, feed a Sedin. /end
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#34 Phil_314

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 06:57 PM

It's a fine play when it works (75% of the time, maybe?). It's just so high-risk when it doesn't click. Offensive-zone faceoffs after a penalty were the best thing that ever happened to the Canucks because we've never been great at gaining the zone.

If I was running the PP, I'd say... hmmm... Edler fake the drop, dish to Raymond/Burrows, cross the blueline with speed, buttonhook on the half boards, feed a Sedin. /end


Very nice suggestion!

Aside from that, I think the Sedins should also quit being so fancy with their passes all the time, it slows everything and keeps things to the perimeter (sure, Kassian's in front and he can shoot their passes from in close but they should also be more aggressive instead of just working it around in such a nifty fashion).
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#35 Hugemanskost

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 07:13 PM

Anyone watch the Oilers-Flames on Saturday night? The Oil were using it on their power play for zone entry. OMG... It's spreading!

:shock:
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#36 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:31 PM

Anyone watch the Oilers-Flames on Saturday night? The Oil were using it on their power play for zone entry. OMG... It's spreading!

:shock:


As I mentioned earlier, there are several teams using it.

Apparently, their respective PP coaches don't read these boards, or they'd realize what a dumb play it is....
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#37 Dogbyte

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:45 PM

I've said it before and I'll say it again.

FIRE Newell Brown.

The drop pass stopped working about half way through last season. Everyone knew it was coming. Yet we couldn't change it up. And in the playoffs, Edlers' drop pass inside our own blue line was picked off and allowed the Kings to score and win the game.

Yet here we are doing it again. And every freaking time, I can feel the bile rising!!

Funny thing is that after watching a few games this week, it seems like many teams around the league have copied this little trick and are using it as well.


Yeah, I've been saying Brown has to go for a long time now. Even when our PP was number one it was due to the players exceling, not Brown.

He hasn't stopped all the turnonvers and short handed goals that kill us in the playoffs, he hasn't stopped this farce of a drop pass, he hasn't taught Edler, Bieksa, or any defender the importance of when to shoot, and when the puck needs to get through to the net, and he hasn't been able to adapt and make it simple when it's not clicking.
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#38 CanucksSayEh

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:58 PM

We should have a triple drop pass, Edler to Bieksa, then Bieksa to Luongo/Schnieder who drop it back into the net. Then we don't have to watch other players look like studs scoring SH goals, we'll just getRdone ourselves.
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#39 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 11:24 AM

Just wanted to point out that I saw the drop pass used 4 times last night....

...and it worked 4 times. In fact, on only one occasion were they not able to sustain pressure after entering the Oiler's zone.

It also worked on the one occasion that I saw Edmonton use it...
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Orland Kurtenbach and Dennis Kearns had just been torched 8-1 by the Habs, but they still took time to come out to meet us, some fellow BC boys who were playing hockey in Montreal. THAT"S what being a Canuck is!

#40 ice orca

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 11:43 AM

As I mentioned earlier, there are several teams using it.

Apparently, their respective PP coaches don't read these boards, or they'd realize what a dumb play it is....

If coatches read these boards they would useless..death by laughter.
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#41 Kassian's Face

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 12:19 PM

I don't think its the drop pass thats the problem. Its the loss of momentum gained by it by cycling the puck for 30 seconds until it is taking away or they get so desperate they take bad angle or unscreened shots that are easily stopped. You want to screw with their heads and be unpredictable? Have our first line actually shoot the puck, including Henrik, within 5 seconds of gaining the zone. Then everyone will be like "wtf? did Hank just shoot the puck?"
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#42 Gooseberries

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 12:28 PM

I don't think its the drop pass thats the problem. Its the loss of momentum gained by it by cycling the puck for 30 seconds until it is taking away or they get so desperate they take bad angle or unscreened shots that are easily stopped. You want to screw with their heads and be unpredictable? Have our first line actually shoot the puck, including Henrik, within 5 seconds of gaining the zone. Then everyone will be like "wtf? did Hank just shoot the puck?"

this Is so true. This is where I miss samuelson. Shots don't all neesnto be perfect. Just turn amd shoot sometimes. Doesnt evem need to hit the met all the time to be effective. It keeps the defenders on their heels. If you hit the net you have a good chance to create a rebound. If you miss theres a good chance it corals of the boards and you regain possession.
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#43 pwnstar

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 12:51 PM

I think it was kassian who faked a drop pass and got a quality scoring chance with a rebound. Maybe since the teams are accustomed to the play, try faking it, make them commit, then get it to the net.
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#44 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 01:44 PM

If coatches read these boards they would useless..death by laughter.


If "coaches" read these boards, they wouldn't have a clue what it was that you were trying to say here...
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Orland Kurtenbach and Dennis Kearns had just been torched 8-1 by the Habs, but they still took time to come out to meet us, some fellow BC boys who were playing hockey in Montreal. THAT"S what being a Canuck is!

#45 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 01:48 PM

I don't think its the drop pass thats the problem. Its the loss of momentum gained by it by cycling the puck for 30 seconds until it is taking away or they get so desperate they take bad angle or unscreened shots that are easily stopped. You want to screw with their heads and be unpredictable? Have our first line actually shoot the puck, including Henrik, within 5 seconds of gaining the zone. Then everyone will be like "wtf? did Hank just shoot the puck?"


It's all about gaining entry into the zone. The Canucks' PP has never been one that scored a lot off the rush. They set up in the zone and work the puck around.

It hasn't been producing much because the twins have been a bit off and the point men aren't getting as many shots through as they were early in the season.

It's got nothing to do with the drop pass.
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Orland Kurtenbach and Dennis Kearns had just been torched 8-1 by the Habs, but they still took time to come out to meet us, some fellow BC boys who were playing hockey in Montreal. THAT"S what being a Canuck is!

#46 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 01:51 PM

I think it was kassian who faked a drop pass and got a quality scoring chance with a rebound. Maybe since the teams are accustomed to the play, try faking it, make them commit, then get it to the net.


I mentioned early on in this thread that Edler had done just that, several games ago.

And you are correct. It gives the Canucks another option on the play and makes the PK play it honestly, instead of selling out to the back pass.
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Orland Kurtenbach and Dennis Kearns had just been torched 8-1 by the Habs, but they still took time to come out to meet us, some fellow BC boys who were playing hockey in Montreal. THAT"S what being a Canuck is!

#47 supermanbieksa

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:40 PM

The problem is not the drop pass, if done correctly it's a good way to enter the zone. But right now the 1st pp unit does it everytime, an other reason why it's not effective at the moment is that the player receiving the puck isn't Kesler. You need speed, skill and "power" to enter the zone like that.
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#48 pwnstar

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:55 PM

I mentioned early on in this thread that Edler had done just that, several games ago.

And you are correct. It gives the Canucks another option on the play and makes the PK play it honestly, instead of selling out to the back pass.


Yah, it makes the defence try to rush the carrier and poke check. A little fake and boom! You got one defensemen out of the zone resulting in a momentary 5 on 3. Even if the defensemen hangs back, the PP unit will have separated the box or triangle that the opposing team is trying to kill with. It seems that the canucks automatically start cycling it passing it from corner to corner. All it takes is one player to pinch and send it in the canucks zone.
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#49 adniel_g

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 03:00 PM

We should have a triple drop pass, Edler to Bieksa, then Bieksa to Luongo/Schnieder who drop it back into the net. Then we don't have to watch other players look like studs scoring SH goals, we'll just getRdone ourselves.



ahha aaha ah ha hahahahahahaha, thought you were serious at first trying to improve the drop pass strategy LOL
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#50 adniel_g

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 03:05 PM

If coatches read these boards they would useless..death by laughter.

:picard:

On the same note though, would love to see Burrows shoot off his patented deke, instead of going backhand all the time.

Edited by adniel_g, 05 February 2013 - 03:05 PM.

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#51 Captain Can

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 03:13 PM

If was a terrible idea, other teams wouldn't be copying it, which they are. I see more and more teams use this for gaining entry on the PP. The idea of it makes sense. You push back the defenders and once you've made the drop pass the puck carrying is facing a bunch of guys who are for the most part caught flat footed.

Yes, the Canucks went through a period of time where they did it way to often and it became predictable. Yes it can back fire when not executed properly, but you can say the same about many set plays. The threat of it alone has caused teams to leave room for a straight entry. I think the most telling thing is the fact that more and more teams have started using this the Canucks had success with it.
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#52 Maniwaki Canuck

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:44 PM

Absolutely right. It generally requires speed to be effective, because that opens up some ice for the trailer who receives it. The clip of Edler screwing up is a good example of what happens when you're not going fast enough to turn the defender who's on you- he anticipates the drop pass and goes for the puck instead. This is why good hockey players can't be completely stupid- they have to make rapid judgements in context. The other part of the story is that you have to have more than one way to get things done, different ways of supporting the puck-carrier. When we look bad or predictable, a lot of it is lazy puck support.

P/P Regardless if the opposition know what's going to happen it still wrong foots them. The opposition must back up at the speed of the first puck carrier ... if they don't he blows passed them. When the drop pass is made the opposition has to react by stopping up and in doing so give up the blue line for a clean entry. It's a good move that just needs to be practised again and again. Another point is it helps the second unit because they rarely use it and the opposition are expecting it.

No problem from me


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#53 OniMaster

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 07:40 PM

People are missing that the drop pass is an option.

If the D isn't backing up with speed, the drop pass option shouldn't be taken. The fact that the canucks have in the past managed to execute the play horribly (see the drop pass in our own zone on a relatively stationary defender) doesn't reflect on the play itself.
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#54 Bure1994Mclean

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 10:07 PM

The only thing worse than that is that one time we dumped the puck in like 6 consecutive times into the stars zone and each and every time Turco would just come out and shoot it back out.
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