5Fivehole0 Posted September 19, 2013 Share Posted September 19, 2013 Absolutely but one must admit that we have far too many expectations on our prospects. Thus This thread Nailed it. Zomg Nich scored one in the preseason, Horvats a bust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanford Posted September 19, 2013 Share Posted September 19, 2013 Screw comparing Horvat to Niskuchin, all the comparisson is going to be between Scheider and Horvat... what happens when Luongo struggles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Surfer Posted September 19, 2013 Share Posted September 19, 2013 Horvat is a sure pick. While nichuskin may be better offensively, horvat is better in every other aspect of the game. He will play in the nhl. Nichuskin could bolt to the k So too could have Datsyuk have bolted to the KHL? Someone else posted following the safe Detroit model. But of course they have developed and paid the appropriate respects ($'s) to this Russian and carved what is probably a hall of fame career. We as Canucks have Kassian who has yet to exhibit the balls and belt em Canadian style of hockey on our team. I supposed thats being discussed in a different context, but? Nichuschkin, less the fighting, might be that same guy we want In Kassian but with more skills and brute athleticism. Considering their playing style plus skill set, and draft position, maybe these guys would be a better comparison in determining who wins a Russian / Canadian war of machismo? Nichushkin is boom or bust. Could be an elite winger or he could be the next Nikita Filatov/Nikolai Zherdev/Alex Radulov/countless others. Horvat will almost certainly be a solid NHLer, the only question is whether it will be as a 3rd liner or a solid 2-way 1st liner. Honestly, I don't think picking either could be considered a "right" or a "wrong" pick. Both bring a different element and a different risk factor, and we chose to take the safer pick. This is not a bad comparison. The conclusion is opinion though. Ultimately it might just be that Nichishkin will have a harder time controlling his own destiny? Not being the puck control guy, offensively anyway, the big Russian will rely on line mates in part to get dynamic results. But Dallas just traded for a young center with dazzling puck skills and speed. What he lacks in two way skills, again with the right mates, could be made up for because he can offer brute power in hits, on the boards, and in front of the net. Nichushkin is not necessarily boom or bust so much as an opportunity to deploy a particular athlete in a manner consistent with his skills. You have effectively characterized Horvat as a sure thing, because he has the playing style and Canadian heritage of say a Bob Gainey, or Patrice Bergeron. Well Nichushkin sort of reminds me of Brendan Shanahan. Not that either Nichushkin or Horvat is destined for the HHOF at this stage. The point is both will have the responsibility of carving a career but similar skill sets have done so in the past. In reality, Gillis bought someone who has displayed a particular edge in being a winner. He was the playoff MVP. He picked that over a bit higher level of brute athleticism and speed, but a less rounded game. I'm guessing both will have great careers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theminister Posted September 19, 2013 Share Posted September 19, 2013 Screw comparing Horvat to Niskuchin, all the comparisson is going to be between Scheider and Horvat... what happens when Luongo struggles? The correct comparison is Schneider for the 9th overall pick in the 2013 NHL draft. Schneider was not dealt for Horvat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 How is this different then people hyping up Nichushkin? 20 years and captain of the Stanley cup team? The kid hasn't even had 5 preseason shots on goal? Practice what you preach brotha Except one is me posing a question while the other is a direct statement that Nichushkin is better than Radulov. If you're gonna call someone out, don't just cherry pick comments without understanding the context in which they were made. That was me comparing the best possible outcome for Horvat to the best possible outcome for Schneider. Nowhere did I say that he would achieve that or anything close to it. I was simply saying that Horvat's career trajectory could just as easily equal Schneider's and therefore the trade would be a win-win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herberts Vasiljevs Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Honestly, seeing the way that Shinkaruk has played thus far, I don't even mind that we didn't pick Nich. IMO, I preferred the Horvat pick anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tortorella's Rant Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Do you really want to make this comparison?'It's not like Kesler is an obvious selection over Richards. Richards has no Selke; but has had the better career to date. 425 points in 575 games, a cup and a cup final plus team Canada performances. Kesler's is 350 points in 578 games. Really its quite close, the edge to Richards because he did not effectively lose 2 prime of career years to nagging injuries. Its like the Hodgson versus Kassian debate. Diehard CDCérs are convinced Hodgson is a worthless bum. Recent poll on HF boards had more than 90% voting Buffalo as the trade winner. Richards would also wins such a comparison, although not so resoundingly. Yeah, that's kind of the reason why I said he was better early in their careers. The last few years Kesler has been a better offensive player. Point being which I already stated is that people judged way too quick and are doing it here as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyril Sneer Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Except one is me posing a question while the other is a direct statement that Nichushkin is better than Radulov. If you're gonna call someone out, don't just cherry pick comments without understanding the context in which they were made. That was me comparing the best possible outcome for Horvat to the best possible outcome for Schneider. Nowhere did I say that he would achieve that or anything close to it. I was simply saying that Horvat's career trajectory could just as easily equal Schneider's and therefore the trade would be a win-win. You said he could play 20 years and be the captain of a cup winning team. To even utter that in your mind is crazy. How many players have done that? None! Stevie Y was the captain of the redwings for 19 seasons. The longest reign as captain in any North American professional sport. That's how silly that comment was and I just wanted to point out an example of many where you grossly overvalue prospects in the Vancouver Canucks system. It's people like yourself that generate pressure on these guys with unrealistic expectations. He is projected to be a grit top 6, or a career 3c. There is no publication anywhere in the universe that projects him to be a 1st line centre, or better than Steve Y. Could he exceed expectations? sure, but that shouldn't be an expectation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthNinja Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 It's way to early to tell anything so you're all just wasting your breath! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cromeslab Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Who cares about Bo Horvat when you have Brendan Gaunce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 You said he could play 20 years and be the captain of a cup winning team. To even utter that in your mind is crazy. Again you fail to recognize the context in which I made that statement. It was a direct response to someone saying Schneider will win multiple cups in New Jersey. And I responded with saying that "what if" Horvat plays 20 years and wins a cup. Nowhere did I put those expectations on him. You're really grasping at straws here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amitriptyline Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 What happened to Horvat since the first game or so in the Young Stars tourney? He's pulled a disappearing act and getting outplayed by Shink and Gaunce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronadian Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Did we pick the wrong player again? While Horvat looked impressive in the young guns tournament, he wasn't very noticeable in his first pre-season action, while Nichushkin... scored 2 goals and had 9 O.o shots, a hit, and 2 blocked shots in his first game. I realize it's incredibly early, but what a way to make a first impression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absent Canuck Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Did we pick the wrong player again? While Horvat looked impressive in the young guns tournament, he wasn't very noticeable in his first pre-season action, while Nichushkin... scored 2 goals and had 9 O.o shots, a hit, and 2 blocked shots in his first game. I realize it's incredibly early, but what a way to make a first impression. You created your ID just to make this thread!!! Congrats! Everyone knows Nishuskin is one of the most skilled guys in the draft -and it was a draft full of franchise guys. What was questioned was his work ethic, his range of style, and his loyalty to the KHL and to Russian hockey. Certainly the Canucks have had 2 very famous cases of Russians not happy in Vancouver. One due to the fans loving him too much, and one because he wasnt good enough to stick right away (Koltov) There was even a third kid who came here just recently but we did not have the time or space to develop him (Shirokov) so he bolted back . We could not afford to spend a highly controversial trade for a player who could be playing along side Kovalchuk, Burmistrov and others within a few years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jigsaw99 Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Ill take a heart and soul Canadian Centre over a flashy Russian 9 out of 10 times. And I don't think this is one of those times I go Russia yeah good old canadian kids like Cody Hodgson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jigsaw99 Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Who cares about Bo Horvat when you have Brendan Gaunce. yeah he is our future offensive 1st liner with his 2 goals in the preseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyLow_ Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 They are both going to be good players. The question is Nichushkin vs Horvat for this team and this roster, and a game breaking winger with elite scoring ability and size is absolutely 100% the pick that should have been made. It's only the need we've had for 10 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyril Sneer Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 yeah good old canadian kids like Cody Hodgson To be honest, with what Gary Roberts said and the deal he just signed in Buffalo I'm not really sure who to believe. Gillis' word is losing value with me every day Q will Roberto be a Vancouver Canuck next season? A No As an example Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jejejester Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 yeah good old canadian kids like Cody Hodgson Toews.... crosby...... Bergeron.... staal.... all good old canadian boys and all have one think in common, can you guess what it is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gustavo Fring Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Honestly when I saw us trade cory I for sure thought we were gonna draft nichuskin. With bure as our ambassador I didn't think drafting a russian would be that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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