Jake Virtanen | #18 | RW

[Salmonberries]

I tried to catch a replay of this game but TSN but all the replays on their eastern channels.

[Toews]

3 minutes ago, Salmonberries said:

I would guess Jake would be around the average age-wise across all rosters. He's a very young nineteen year old in a nineteen year old's tournament.

Although I haven't looked it up, I am guessing the average age will be less than 19. I have noticed the worse the team is, the more likely that there are younger players on the roster. And while this won't apply to the same extent to the big 5, teams like Slovakia, Czech Republic, Belarus, Swiss will probably have a number of players much younger.

[ice orca]

This is the Jake i have wanted to see for awhile now. You can see the weight of high expectations on the Canucks just lifted off his shoulders and just go out and have fun. I imagine the Canuck's brain trust will keep a close eye on this as well, it will be interesting to see what they do with him after the WJC's. Do they send him to juniors to get 20+ minutes per game or back to the Canuck's at 10 per game? Should be lot's of discussion pro or con on this over the next 2 weeks.

[JeremyCuddles]

3 minutes ago, ice orca said:

This is the Jake i have wanted to see for awhile now. You can see the weight of high expectations on the Canucks just lifted off his shoulders and just go out and have fun. I imagine the Canuck's brain trust will keep a close eye on this as well, it will be interesting to see what they do with him after the WJC's. Do they send him to juniors to get 20+ minutes per game or back to the Canuck's at 10 per game? Should be lot's of discussion pro or con on this over the next 2 weeks.

I think Benning said he plans on keeping Jake on the big club after the WJC. I guess if he completely melts down he might not comeback. Doubt that happens though.

[MJDDawg]

The microscope our young prospects are under is unbelievable. Especially a hometown kid who not only is trying to make the jump to the pro's, but trying to do it in front of family and especially friends on a team he grew up cheering for. He reads the local rags and listens to the talking mouths at the Province who are in his face about his play. The fact that the Canucks aren't that good and actually need him to develop quickly doesn't help either.

This is where US teams probably have an advantage in prospect development. They can keep their kids in junior hockey then move them to their farm teams where they can take their time developing them outside of the public eye without any of the pressure from local sports media and social media spotlight created by rabid fans who have their own opinions on how the team should develop the prospect.

I really hope Jake can overcome this pressure to develop into the player we all think he can be. As others in this thread have already mentioned, you can certainly see the weight of expectation lifted from his shoulders in this tournament already and I hope he has a great tourney and comes back renewed and rejuvenated. 

My biggest fear is that he crumbles under the weight of expectation and in a few years we're talking about another potential Cam Neely trade.

 

Edited December 24, 2015 by MJDDawg
Reason for edit: Gooseberries!

[73 Percent]

7 minutes ago, MJDDawg said:

I feel a bit sorry for Jake quite honestly.

The microscope our young prospects are under is unbelievable. Especially a hometown kid who not only is trying to make the jump to the pro's, but trying to do it in front of family and especially friends on a team he grew up cheering for. He reads the local rags and listens to the talking mouths at the Province who are in his face about his play. The fact that the Canucks aren't that good and actually need him to develop quickly doesn't help either.

This is where US teams probably have an advantage in prospect development. They can keep their kids in junior hockey then move them to their farm teams where they can take their time developing them outside of the public eye without any of the pressure from local sports media and social media spotlight created by rabid fans who have their own opinions on how the team should develop the prospect.

I really hope Jake can overcome this pressure to develop into the player we all think he can be. As others in this thread have already mentioned, you can certainly see the weight of expectation lifted from his shoulders in this tournament already and I hope he has a great tourney and comes back renewed and rejuvenated. 

My biggest fear is that he crumbles under the weight of expectation and in a few years we're talking about another potential Cam Neely trade.

 

Lol I wonder if he could be compensated some how. Like maybe the life of a millionaire before the age of 20. 

Dont get me wrong i get what you're saying. No ones job is easy. And the pressureon teens is huge in todays nhl with the media and stuff. But i wont go to as far as saying I feel sorry for any nhler with a healthy family. 

Do you feel sorry for Nicolas cage?

[MJDDawg]

30 minutes ago, Gooseberries said:

Lol I wonder if he could be compensated some how. Like maybe the life of a millionaire before the age of 20. 

Dont get me wrong i get what you're saying. No ones job is easy. And the pressureon teens is huge in todays nhl with the media and stuff. But i wont go to as far as saying I feel sorry for any nhler with a healthy family. 

Do you feel sorry for Nicolas cage?

Haha...yeah maybe feel sorry is the wrong choice of words.

[73 Percent]

12 minutes ago, MJDDawg said:

Haha...yeah maybe feel sorry is the wrong choice of words.

But I do agree that the pressure is just enormous on some of these kids.

[McCannon]

17 hours ago, N4ZZY said:

might be good news for Jake then. pretty sure he would be happy to hear that. when he returns to the team. he needs to assert himself even more. don't be afraid of making mistakes. just go out there and play his game. learn from his mistakes and continue to grow. 

i think also that Benning and management may not trust the Hitmen organization to further Virtanen's development. which is why Benning and Co. are saying he goes back to the Canucks to develop. 

same point i made but much more succinctly lol! the word 'assert' is definitely the right term. He needs to start 'driving the bus' vs waiting around to just support. Bear was playing that way early in the year, and since he started scoring we are seeing his confidence and skill emerge as he is holding on to the puck, making plays, scoring etc. I think assertiveness comes with maturity and confidence.

Young players when they enter the league are usually not like Bo, they are star struck, they are 'happy to be there'...few and far between have the confidence to just say I am as good as these guys (Bo, Gaudreau, etc)...he's learning and when he learns to force his games on other teams (not just physically with hits but his speed, tenacity and hands), he will be a force...

In my view his priorities (mentally) entering his first season were probably

1. Get my 9 games

2. Don't get sent back to Junior prior to 9

3. Hopefully stick but if not WJC and then the decision

4. Hopefully back to the Nucks post WJC

The result of that mentality is playing 'tentative' - minimize errors and do EXACTLY as the coaches ask and don't stray from it. Take a risk, stray from their directive, make an error and maybe I end up back in junior.

Once he KNOWS he's here to stay I think we may see him take the next step by trying to be a bit more assertive in the offensive end.

I like Jake and he will be a great player for us, people just need to realize, as much of a man he is physically, he still is a kid playing in a man's league. Nerves are there, confidence takes time to develop, as does swagger. Swagger comes from success and to have success offensively you have to take some risks...until he feels comfortable that taking risks offensively isn't going to staple him to the bench or worse send him back, we won't see it. But there's alot of talent there we can all see it.

Personally I can't wait to see this crop in 5 years at 23-25 years old...watch out!

Bo, McCann, Virt, Baer, Hutton, Demko, Boeser - I'd take that group over Edmonton any day actually - size, heart, speed.

Edited December 24, 2015 by McCannon

[TOMapleLaughs]

1 hour ago, MJDDawg said:

The microscope our young prospects are under is unbelievable. Especially a hometown kid who not only is trying to make the jump to the pro's, but trying to do it in front of family and especially friends on a team he grew up cheering for. He reads the local rags and listens to the talking mouths at the Province who are in his face about his play. The fact that the Canucks aren't that good and actually need him to develop quickly doesn't help either.

This is where US teams probably have an advantage in prospect development. They can keep their kids in junior hockey then move them to their farm teams where they can take their time developing them outside of the public eye without any of the pressure from local sports media and social media spotlight created by rabid fans who have their own opinions on how the team should develop the prospect.

I really hope Jake can overcome this pressure to develop into the player we all think he can be. As others in this thread have already mentioned, you can certainly see the weight of expectation lifted from his shoulders in this tournament already and I hope he has a great tourney and comes back renewed and rejuvenated. 

My biggest fear is that he crumbles under the weight of expectation and in a few years we're talking about another potential Cam Neely trade.

 

A lot of people here know him, but it hasn't added much pressure.  This pressure exists wherever you play pro sports.  If you don't feel this pressure to perform, then you're not in pro sports.  He's a pretty chill guy actually.  At age 19 being brought in slowly to the NHL it's more important to set the pro path down for him to follow.  His parents are solid, the Canucks have solid role models, from the top dog Linden (who we'd also consider a local guy) on down, so he should be good to go.

We as fans like to consider ourselves to be able to affect things on the team through online commentary, but that isn't the case at all.  This thread for example has been nothing but twitter-like white noise for years now.  If you think that whatever the media says or what bloggers have to say affects Jake personally, you'd be mistaken.  This also applies to the rest of the pros on the team.  In pro sports with fans and media attention, you learn right away how to deal with this white noise.  You ignore it.

If Jake or any other great prospect we have doesn't become all that he can be here, then that's a failure by our franchise.  The only way I see it happening is if they don't add the proper level of support for them throughout their careers and overwhelm them with too high a workload.  The soul-crushing 30 minute per game WCE days are history.

Edited December 24, 2015 by TOMapleLaughs

[Rush17]

Crouse over Virtanen for the A. lamesauce.  Hicketts is a given but even point as captain seems ugh.  oh wells he can lead by example and show his leadership.

[McCannon]

1 hour ago, MJDDawg said:

The microscope our young prospects are under is unbelievable. Especially a hometown kid who not only is trying to make the jump to the pro's, but trying to do it in front of family and especially friends on a team he grew up cheering for. He reads the local rags and listens to the talking mouths at the Province who are in his face about his play. The fact that the Canucks aren't that good and actually need him to develop quickly doesn't help either.

This is where US teams probably have an advantage in prospect development. They can keep their kids in junior hockey then move them to their farm teams where they can take their time developing them outside of the public eye without any of the pressure from local sports media and social media spotlight created by rabid fans who have their own opinions on how the team should develop the prospect.

I really hope Jake can overcome this pressure to develop into the player we all think he can be. As others in this thread have already mentioned, you can certainly see the weight of expectation lifted from his shoulders in this tournament already and I hope he has a great tourney and comes back renewed and rejuvenated. 

My biggest fear is that he crumbles under the weight of expectation and in a few years we're talking about another potential Cam Neely trade.

 

1 hour ago, MJDDawg said:

 

Another reason why keeping players like the Twins (outside of their ageless wonders), Burr, Miller, Hammer matter. Many people here think its so 'easy' to step into any professional environment, perhaps its a generational thing over overestimating the value of eagerness and youth and underestimating the value of experience, knowledge and more importantly how to handle pressure and stress.

I can't even imagine the level of pressure faced by young athletes in a city like Vancouver, where as you rightly state, we have a media that thrives on creating controversy and many fans with unrealistic expectations (as per the reasons above).

I think Jake will be fine, but fans who are calling to gut the team and sell off all the vets should understand that players like Jake won't develop properly without those players above him. The twins were third liners in their first 2 seasons and were 1-2 overall, and people were calling them Busts, then sisters, and now...Likely Hall of Famers. It should be a lesson to all that trusting people like Benning is probably the smart thing to do and they will develop Jake the way he needs to be developed. (Remember all those barking about Kassian? Well we see it now don't we?).

Alot of hubris amongst fans thinking they know better, we don't just look at the big picture and enjoy what comes. Linden, Benning and Acquilinis want to succeed and win a cup as badly if not more than us. I think a core of Bo, Boeser, McCann, Shink, Virt, Hutton, Demko at 23-25 is going to be pleasure to watch for a decade or more.

We were lucky enough to see Bure, Nazzy, Bert, Linden, the Twins, and now we are in transition, all of us should be patient and in a few years we'll have another group (likely as strong as the Nazzy years) to compete with and Virt will be a big part of it.

 

 

[Rush17]

hope they keep virt and barzal as a duo.  maybe add point too the line instead of splitting them up.

 

wowzor what a kick to the face.

 

"These three players have set a tremendous example for the rest of our team from the start of our camp," Canada coach Dave Lowry said. "The leadership, work ethic and attention to detail shown by Brayden, Lawson and Joe are the standard for their teammates."

If you don't already know this the coach and team canada very rarely ever say these 3 of 4 returning players have shown great leadership.  They singled out virtanen after giving the other 3 praise.  

Maybe im diggin into it too deep but Crouse?.... c'mon... jake looked so good but im sure he will still represent.  maybe he will display leadership in the offensive side of the rink.

Maybe I'm just sour but too me seems like he is singling out virt.

Edited December 24, 2015 by Rush17

[Toews]

32 minutes ago, TOMapleLaughs said:

A lot of people here know him, but it hasn't added much pressure.  This pressure exists wherever you play pro sports.  If you don't feel this pressure to perform, then you're not in pro sports.  He's a pretty chill guy actually.  At age 19 being brought in slowly to the NHL it's more important to set the pro path down for him to follow.  His parents are solid, the Canucks have solid role models, from the top dog Linden (who we'd also consider a local guy) on down, so he should be good to go.

We as fans like to consider ourselves to be able to affect things on the team through online commentary, but that isn't the case at all.  This thread for example has been nothing but twitter-like white noise for years now.  If you think that whatever the media says or what bloggers have to say affects Jake personally, you'd be mistaken.  This also applies to the rest of the pros on the team.  In pro sports with fans and media attention, you learn right away how to deal with this white noise.  You ignore it.

All players have pressure to perform but it's not even arguable that some have much more weight on their shoulders. It's silly to suggest that he would have the same amount of pressure he does in Vancouver than if he were in Florida. To me it has always taken an extra degree of mettle to play in a Canadian market especially when fans can be so obsessive that they will track your every shift.

You only have to ask a guy like Roberto Luongo or Phil Kessel whether tuning out was as easier as it sounded. In the end these players are humans and they are going to be influenced by outside forces like the fans and the media. The ones that are able to handle the pressure best, they stick around. The rest of them end up south of the border where they can go for a walk outside and not be recognized and asked about their play.

That celebrity like status that players get in Canadian markets can sometimes be a huge curse if you are struggling to perform. There are accounts by players on how it is like to play in a Canadian market and almost universally the opinion seems to be, its really good when its good and really really awful when it is bad. You would have to be a robot to be unaffected by it. 

[TOMapleLaughs]

Just now, Toews said:

All players have pressure to perform but it's not even arguable that some have much more weight on their shoulders. It's silly to suggest that he would have the same amount of pressure he does in Vancouver than if he were in Florida. To me it has always taken an extra degree of mettle to play in a Canadian market especially when fans can be so obsessive that they will track your every shift.

You only have to ask a guy like Roberto Luongo or Phil Kessel whether tuning out was as easier as it sounded. In the end these players are humans and they are going to be influenced by outside forces like the fans and the media. The ones that are able to handle the pressure best, they stick around. The rest of them end up south of the border where they can go for a walk outside and not be recognized and asked about their play.

That celebrity like status that players get in Canadian markets can sometimes be a huge curse if you are struggling to perform. There are accounts by players on how it is like to play in a Canadian market and almost universally the opinion seems to be, its really good when its good and really really awful when it is bad. You would have to be a robot to be unaffected by it. 

All i'm saying is that this white noise is tuned out, so it doesn't make a lick worth of difference to the players.  We seriously overestimate the affect we have on their psyche.

Luongo started a professional life in Florida.  Phil Kessel started his in the US.  Both are guys who were traded to Canada, and both realize it's a business.  Are they affected by Canadian media and fans?  Perhaps, but not to the degree we think, and frankly media and fan pressure is just used as part of the 'trade justification' talk.  It's a process.

The Sedins have been here forever and have received buckets of fan and media criticism here throughout their careers.  Yet, the remain dedicated to this city and team.  They're pros.  All these guys are.

The argument that Canada somehow presents a tougher environment for these pro athletes is complete bunk. They're pro athletes.  If they let pressure get to them, then they're just not effective pro athletes.  It's other factors that are to blame for a drop in performance, mostly related to the rest of the team/franchise.

[Gstank29]

Most hockey players pay little attention to the media and are taught to turn them out. Sure it might get the some players but the majority of them know that it's the Medias job to be controversial, which is why most players don't talk to the media on a regular bases.

 

[ice orca]

52 minutes ago, Rush17 said:

hope they keep virt and barzal as a duo.  maybe add point too the line instead of splitting them up.

 

wowzor what a kick to the face.

 

"These three players have set a tremendous example for the rest of our team from the start of our camp," Canada coach Dave Lowry said. "The leadership, work ethic and attention to detail shown by Brayden, Lawson and Joe are the standard for their teammates."

If you don't already know this the coach and team canada very rarely ever say these 3 of 4 returning players have shown great leadership.  They singled out virtanen after giving the other 3 praise.  

Maybe im diggin into it too deep but Crouse?.... c'mon... jake looked so good but im sure he will still represent.  maybe he will display leadership in the offensive side of the rink.

Maybe I'm just sour but too me seems like he is singling out virt.

Yeah i think you are looking at it a little too deep, he never singled out Jake. Maybe just maybe those guys have more leadership qualities than Jake.

[Toews]

3 minutes ago, TOMapleLaughs said:

All i'm saying is that this white noise is tuned out, so it doesn't make a lick worth of difference to the players.  We seriously overestimate the affect we have on their psyche.

Luongo started a professional life in Florida.  Phil Kessel started his in the US.  Both are guys who were traded to Canada, and both realize it's a business.  Are they affected by Canadian media and fans?  Perhaps, but not to the degree we think, and frankly media and fan pressure is just used as part of the 'trade justification' talk.  It's a process.

The Sedins have been here forever and have received buckets of fan and media criticism here throughout their careers.  Yet, the remain dedicated to this city and team.  They're pros.  All these guys are.

The argument that Canada somehow presents a tougher environment for these pro athletes is complete bunk. They're pro athletes.  If they let pressure get to them, then they're just not effective pro athletes.  It's other factors that are to blame for a drop in performance, mostly related to the rest of the team/franchise.

Well I disagree, I think the "white noise" is pretty damn loud. To say that all players are able to tune it out is IMO not at all true. There have been quotes from players about how different playing in a Canadian city is. Some go as far as making sure they never sign in their home town as they prefer the relative anonymity that comes from playing in a US market. Like I said some players are better than others at tuning it out. If that weren't the case we wouldn't be watching coaches and players getting testy with the media after a dumb question. 

[TOMapleLaughs]

Just now, Toews said:

Well I disagree, I think the "white noise" is pretty damn loud. To say that all players are able to tune it out is IMO not at all true. There have been quotes from players about how different playing in a Canadian city is. Some go as far as making sure they never sign in their home town as they prefer the relative anonymity that comes from playing in a US market. Like I said some players are better than others at tuning it out. If that weren't the case we wouldn't be watching coaches and players getting testy with the media after a dumb question. 

What this is doesn't affect on-ice performance however, clearly.

[Toews]

12 minutes ago, TOMapleLaughs said:

What this is doesn't affect on-ice performance however, clearly.

I am not sure how you can definitely say it doesn't. If your home crowd is booing, is that white noise that players tune out as well? If so I guess we just see things completely differently.

Edit: I guess we will just agree to disagree as I don't want this thread to go off topic.

Edited December 24, 2015 by Toews