Canadians urged to confront ugly truth of residential schools

[Heretic]

Why are modern Canadians held responsible for what our ancestors did? Yes, the residential schools were bad. Nobody denies that. But how long will we have to give sympathy instead of moving on?

Because, it helps in the healing process for all.

“Above all, we must remember that this is a Canadian story, not an indigenous one,” said Justice Sinclair at Tuesday’s ceremony. “There are many who will put on blinders and pretend that this isn’t their issue, that the fault is not theirs. We are not calling on you to accept the full brunt of the blame for what happened. We are calling on you to open up your mind, to be willing to learn these stories, to be willing to accept that these things happened. Most importantly, we are calling on you to link arms with us, that all Canadians – indigenous or not, young or old, first generation or tenth generation – that we work together to heal and secure a better future.”

[Slegr]

I am not surprised in the least to read a fair amount of naivety, ignorance, and nonchalance when such a serious issue is brought into the CDC forum, but it also nice to see some respond with true awareness, sensitivity and good intentions on here.

I find is interesting how some people get so defensive when the facts are put out there, or they act like it is ancient history that their ancestors caused and they can completely wash their hands of - I guess this is mostly a coping mechanism to push away any possibility of guilt. But the intention of the Reconciliation work is not to point fingers, or place blame. It is to recognize our recent history, recognize how it has impacted generations of people today and continues to do so, and to find ways for all of us to work together to make a better future for all of our children.

This topic is probably the most serious one on CDC. Many families continue to struggle as a result of Canadian policies, legislation, and racism that disadvantaged Aboriginal peoples. Please choose your words carefully in how you respond, and I encourage all of us to continue to educate ourselves on it.

[Standing_Tall#37]

Why are modern Canadians held responsible for what our ancestors did? Yes, the residential schools were bad. Nobody denies that. But how long will we have to give sympathy instead of moving on?

To go one step further Vancouver recently treated an abuser of 8 native children as a hero and probably most still do.

[felixthecat_potvin]

I am not surprised in the least to read a fair amount of naivety, ignorance, and nonchalance when such a serious issue is brought into the CDC forum, but it also nice to see some respond with true awareness, sensitivity and good intentions on here.

I find is interesting how some people get so defensive when the facts are put out there, or they act like it is ancient history that their ancestors caused and they can completely wash their hands of - I guess this is mostly a coping mechanism to push away any possibility of guilt. But the intention of the Reconciliation work is not to point fingers, or place blame. It is to recognize our recent history, recognize how it has impacted generations of people today and continues to do so, and to find ways for all of us to work together to make a better future for all of our children.

This topic is probably the most serious one on CDC. Many families continue to struggle as a result of Canadian policies, legislation, and racism that disadvantaged Aboriginal peoples. Please choose your words carefully in how you respond, and I encourage all of us to continue to educate ourselves on it.

Not my ancestors. My ancestors are Ukrainian and were also discriminated against in World War 1. Yet Ukrainians don't get special privileges from the government.

[-SN-]

We are talking about Canada, not what happened in the U.S.

Thanks for coming out

You're the one who brought up Armenia. Don't derail this thread.

[grandmaster]

You're the one who brought up Armenia. Don't derail this thread.

The comparison was to Aboriginals in Canada. The ones in the U.S. obviously had it way worse

[drummer4now]

Not my ancestors. My ancestors are Ukrainian and were also discriminated against in World War 1. Yet Ukrainians don't get special privileges from the government.

Yes but to the scale of Native Americans? Give me a break. At least there's such thing as Ukraine..

If we focus purely on FN in Canada even with the highest birth rates in the country their population is still well below ethnic Canadians which speaks volumes to how many were slaughtered alone in Canada.

[grandmaster]

You brought it up. Maybe you should read up on history and learn what genocide really is.

Are you kidding me? You brought up that they were starved to death. What are you talking about?

[Heretic]

Are you kidding me? You brought up that they were starved to death. What are you talking about?

You brought up that what Canada did wasn't "true genocide".

Please try to keep up will you and please re-read the United Nations Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide.

Oh, you also said "thanks for coming out" - so I corrected you on that as well.

You brought up Armenia and slammed me for talking about North American indigenous people - last I checked Canada is part of North America - always has been. The colonists in what was to become "Canada" were no different than the colonists in what became the US.

The "starving to death" was a policy by Canada's first prime minister - check your history.

[grandmaster]

You brought up that what Canada did wasn't "true genocide".

Please try to keep up will you and please re-read the United Nations Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide.

Oh, you also said "thanks for coming out" - so I corrected you on that as well.

You brought up Armenia and slammed me for talking about North American indigenous people - last I checked Canada is part of North America - always has been. The colonists in what was to become "Canada" were no different than the colonists in what became the US.

The "starving to death" was a policy by Canada's first prime minister - check your history.

Again, this thread is based on Canadian Aboriginals and their treatment, not in the U.S. Comparable of the Aboriginals here should not be mixed with those down south.

Just read about this policy...essentially they used food aid as a source to convince tribes to move to appointed areas and control

[Heretic]

Again, this thread is based on Canadian Aboriginals and their treatment, not in the U.S. Comparable of the Aboriginals here should not be mixed with those down south.

Just read about this policy...essentially they used food aid as a source to convince tribes to move to appointed areas and control

Again, this thread isn't about what happened to Armenians.

Again, what happened in the USA was a lot similar than what happened in the Ottoman Empire.

Then again, it is about genocide, as long as you accept that - then we are good - just don't try to sweep it under the carpet again.

Here, read this:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/what-canada-committed-against-first-nations-was-genocide-the-un-should-recognize-it/article14853747/

[Jester13]

I am too close and too passionate about this topic to have rational debate, so I'm officially out. I will clarify my position because it was in response to you, therefore you deserve it.

In my opinion that is a useless statement. Canada is not a White Supremacist country and that argument is just the extreme pendulum example to those who negatively stereotype First Nations. It is divisive and unhelpful, that's my point.

FYI, white supremacy means much more than just skin heads and white-sheet wearing monsters, so I hope you didn't take what I said and connote those images into your response. If you didn't then I instantly apologize; however, if you didn't take my post as such then maybe you could explain further?

To give you an example, though, a moderator--who I will not mention directly--once noted in a thread on the increased use of Chinese signs in Richmond how they were really upset how their neighbourhood in Richmond is not the same as it once was years ago now that people from across the world are finding new homes in our beloved country. The hidden racism behind that person's comment was not visible to them, but to me it very much was. This is a small example of what I mean when I say that Canada is a white supremacist country.

Edit: FTR, this paragraph above is not to say that the person who made the comment is a bad person, just that they are unaware of their hidden preconceived notions of what Canada 'should' be like. It's just an example of why we need more education in Canada on such subjects.

And for the record, I studied political science in university with a focus on issues in politics, such as courses on the topic of racism and politics as well as Indigenous politics, so trust me when I say that there is lots of literature on this subject. This is not just me talking out my arse.

Ever heard the phrase "Great White North"? It's not merely meant to depict our winter season.

This is a topic that I am also passionate about. The difference is, I guess, is that I am able and willing to have a rational debate about it because Canadians need to wake up and admit that we are a racist country that needs to start correcting the wrongs that we are all guilty of. And before someone starts using the excuse that "I wasn't directly a part of the residential schools" blah blah blah, we are ALL guilty by association and inaction.

My comment is not divisive; it's the responses by those who deny the reality of our country that are.

[Jester13]

We are talking about Canada, not what happened in the U.S.

Thanks for coming out

Did you ever learn in school how small pox wiped out 65-90 per cent of Indigenous peoples in Canada? Probably not. But when you do the math it adds up to similar numbers to that of the US.

[Violator]

I am Armenian and we were victims to the genocide inflicked by Turkey in 1915. A real genocide where 1.5 million of my people were killed off in torturous ways. They still refuse to apologize or even acknowledge it, regardless of the obvious evidence in which most of the world, including Canada has confirmed.

I'm not talking about children being taken away and forced into a different culture. We were victims to a real genocide. It bothers me that these people can use this word like they do.

So as a non native, I have more of a right to speak for what I think is fair based on my Armenian heritage. If Turkey had done half of what Canada has done in terms of making amends and acknowledgment, I would be satisfied. Let us move on

As it appears after you wrote this comment nobody should give a flying fudge about armenia

[Standing_Tall#37]

Does John Furlong get a free pass for all the horrible things he did to FN at the residential school in burns lake? He was instrumental in bringing the Olympics to Vancouver so for most lower mainland folk, that's worth looking past what he did to the Babine Nation. F'n creep.

[RUPERTKBD]

I am Armenian and we were victims to the genocide inflicked by Turkey in 1915. A real genocide where 1.5 million of my people were killed off in torturous ways. They still refuse to apologize or even acknowledge it, regardless of the obvious evidence in which most of the world, including Canada has confirmed.

I'm not talking about children being taken away and forced into a different culture. We were victims to a real genocide. It bothers me that these people can use this word like they do.

So as a non native, I have more of a right to speak for what I think is fair based on my Armenian heritage. If Turkey had done half of what Canada has done in terms of making amends and acknowledgment, I would be satisfied. Let us move on

Personally, I think it solves very little, comparing genocide numbers. Whether the Armenian genocide was worse than the North american one, or the Holocaust was worse than the Slavic one...

It really doesn't present a strong argument when one characterizes an atrocity as less of an issue, because there has been a worse one at some point in history.

Telling the First Nations community that they're lucky they're not Armenian or Jewish and that they should just "move on", is insensitive in the extreme, especially coming from someone who claims similar persecution to his/her own ancestors.

BTW: The first nations community doesn't have to think of what happened to their ancestors. These atrocities happened to their parents and grandparents.

[riffraff]

FYI, white supremacy means much more than just skin heads and white-sheet wearing monsters, so I hope you didn't take what I said and connote those images into your response. If you didn't then I instantly apologize; however, if you didn't take my post as such then maybe you could explain further?

To give you an example, though, a moderator--who I will not mention directly--once noted in a thread on the increased use of Chinese signs in Richmond how they were really upset how their neighbourhood in Richmond is not the same as it once was years ago now that people from across the world are finding new homes in our beloved country. The hidden racism behind that person's comment was not visible to them, but to me it very much was. This is a small example of what I mean when I say that Canada is a white supremacist country.

Edit: FTR, this paragraph above is not to say that the person who made the comment is a bad person, just that they are unaware of their hidden preconceived notions of what Canada 'should' be like. It's just an example of why we need more education in Canada on such subjects.

And for the record, I studied political science in university with a focus on issues in politics, such as courses on the topic of racism and politics as well as Indigenous politics, so trust me when I say that there is lots of literature on this subject. This is not just me talking out my arse.

Ever heard the phrase "Great White North"? It's not merely meant to depict our winter season.

This is a topic that I am also passionate about. The difference is, I guess, is that I am able and willing to have a rational debate about it because Canadians need to wake up and admit that we are a racist country that needs to start correcting the wrongs that we are all guilty of. And before someone starts using the excuse that "I wasn't directly a part of the residential schools" blah blah blah, we are ALL guilty by association and inaction.

My comment is not divisive; it's the responses by those who deny the reality of our country that are.

Every country is racist collectively. Not to be dismissive.

People coming to Canada from other countries are racist.

Racism is global. Considering how open Canada is to immigration, imo, white supremist, is a bit of a harsh broad stroke.

[Heretic]

FYI, white supremacy means much more than just skin heads and white-sheet wearing monsters, so I hope you didn't take what I said and connote those images into your response. If you didn't then I instantly apologize; however, if you didn't take my post as such then maybe you could explain further?

To give you an example, though, a moderator--who I will not mention directly--once noted in a thread on the increased use of Chinese signs in Richmond how they were really upset how their neighbourhood in Richmond is not the same as it once was years ago now that people from across the world are finding new homes in our beloved country. The hidden racism behind that person's comment was not visible to them, but to me it very much was. This is a small example of what I mean when I say that Canada is a white supremacist country.

Edit: FTR, this paragraph above is not to say that the person who made the comment is a bad person, just that they are unaware of their hidden preconceived notions of what Canada 'should' be like. It's just an example of why we need more education in Canada on such subjects.

And for the record, I studied political science in university with a focus on issues in politics, such as courses on the topic of racism and politics as well as Indigenous politics, so trust me when I say that there is lots of literature on this subject. This is not just me talking out my arse.

Ever heard the phrase "Great White North"? It's not merely meant to depict our winter season.

This is a topic that I am also passionate about. The difference is, I guess, is that I am able and willing to have a rational debate about it because Canadians need to wake up and admit that we are a racist country that needs to start correcting the wrongs that we are all guilty of. And before someone starts using the excuse that "I wasn't directly a part of the residential schools" blah blah blah, we are ALL guilty by association and inaction.

My comment is not divisive; it's the responses by those who deny the reality of our country that are.

Well said but I thought the "Great White North" was because Americans thought Canadians lived in igloos as it was always winter up here eh?

Here's an article from Macleans about our racism problem:

The racial mess in the United States looks pretty grim and is painful to watch. We can be forgiven for being quietly thankful for Canada’s more inclusive society, which has avoided dramas like that in Ferguson, Mo. We are not the only ones to think this. In the recently released Social Progress Index, Canada is ranked second amongst all nations for its tolerance and inclusion.

Unfortunately, the truth is we have a far worse race problem than the United States. We just can’t see it very easily.

Terry Glavin, recently writing in the Ottawa Citizen, mocked the idea that the United States could learn from Canada’s example when it comes to racial harmony. To illustrate his point, he compared the conditions of the African-American community to Canada’s First Nations. If you judge a society by how it treats its most disadvantaged, Glavin found us wanting. Consider the accompanying table. By almost every measurable indicator, the Aboriginal population in Canada is treated worse and lives with more hardship than the African-American population. All these facts tell us one thing: Canada has a race problem, too.

How are we not choking on these numbers? For a country so self-satisfied with its image of progressive tolerance, how is this not a national crisis? Why are governments not falling on this issue?

More here:

http://www.macleans.ca/news/canada/out-of-sight-out-of-mind-2/

[John Tortorella]

I am Armenian and we were victims to the genocide inflicked by Turkey in 1915. A real genocide where 1.5 million of my people were killed off in torturous ways. They still refuse to apologize or even acknowledge it, regardless of the obvious evidence in which most of the world, including Canada has confirmed.

I'm not talking about children being taken away and forced into a different culture. We were victims to a real genocide. It bothers me that these people can use this word like they do.

So as a non native, I have more of a right to speak for what I think is fair based on my Armenian heritage. If Turkey had done half of what Canada has done in terms of making amends and acknowledgment, I would be satisfied. Let us move on

This. Every other culture is destroyed when an invading culture attacks. However the english spared the french and native people and ever sense their compassion has been a tool for the other parties to bitch and demand more.

[etsen3]

Why are modern Canadians held responsible for what our ancestors did? Yes, the residential schools were bad. Nobody denies that. But how long will we have to give sympathy instead of moving on?

Unfortunately the residential schools were recent enough that those responsible are not always "ancestors". However no one is going around and saying that every single white person walking around is responsible for what happened. It's more about systematic oppression by those in power. Additionally, even though residential school no longer exist, the damage does, so it's important for the rest of society to help them and prevent such things from happening in the future.

And you'd be naive to think that racism doesn't exist at all today. It's just not as overt as your average KKK member or skinhead.