We need a sniper

[Freeridebc]

On 7/8/2016 at 9:05 AM, RogersTowell said:

What a lot of people forget is that the Canucks had 248 goals in 2014/2015, rebounding from 196 in Torts last year here.  Last year's 191 can easily rebound back up.  It's not like the roster changed that drastically between the two seasons.  D was weaker and injuries piled up last Season.  D is better, therefore we spend less time in our zone therefore we can apply more pressure at the other end.  Eriksson >> Vrbata even in a good year.  Our younger players are maturing.  Should be a much better year.

Agree. Recall the hype when Vrby was actually producing goals? 

 

I think this year will be much better. 

[Cowardrobertford]

On 7/7/2016 at 0:29 AM, messier's_elbow said:

We should try Jake on the point on the PP next season. Especially if the Russian doesn't work out.  His shot is underrated. 

Jake needs to be smarter with puck possession, he can be very shaky and uncomposed when pressured. In addition he is not very good at cycling and finding position. 

This is not a "developmental league" if the argument is for him to get better at those department when AHL is there for him.

[DownUndaCanuck]

I think we've got a good number of snipers now with the addition of Eriksson and the likely improvement of Baertschi and Horvat. We've finally got a decent playmaker - shooter - powerforward on each line now.

 

Daniel, Eriksson, Horvat, Baertschi and Sutter are all capable of 20 goals next season, with Hansen and Virtanen outside favourites to score 15-20ish if they're lucky. We'll get into trouble if we don't have enough decent passers, playmakers or guys with high hockey IQ who can puck handle and slow the game down. We've got Henrik Sedin obviously but after him we're thin on playmakers and passers.

 

Baertschi has some fantastic vision and may be our best guy outside of the twins. The majority of our bottom-9 players are otherwise very much north-south style of players who skate hard, hit hard and can shoot but don't really make the pretty passing plays. Horvat has a bit of vision but is primarily a drive-to-the-net powerforward type of offensive forward, as is Hansen, and Sutter/Etem/Virtanen are all similar too.

 

This is why Rodin would be a fantastic insertion in the lineup somewhere - bring some real skill and vision to an otherwise north-south type of team.

[coastal1]

9 hours ago, hearditall said:

What's your definition of "stink"? 

If they get into the playoffs next year is that "stink" to U? 

I think they have a good chance of making he playoffs as early as next year.  

Making the playoffs next year would be a big step in the right direction in my eyes. And in 4-5 years we could be a serious contender for the cup again. 

I see us on a slowly but surely upswing from now on & making the playoffs is not out of reach at all next year. Especially when that is our managements goal as well.

The playoffs are out of reach next year, definitely. No chance. But then, without hope it would not be as much fun, just don't get too disappointed.

[hearditall]

3 hours ago, coastal1 said:

The playoffs are out of reach next year, definitely. No chance. But then, without hope it would not be as much fun, just don't get too disappointed.

I wasn't disappointed last year (was totally expected) & I won't next year either. Last year we injected Virtanen, McCann, Hutton, Markstrom, Baer, Etem, Gaunce, Grenier, Tryamkin, Granlund, Hunter, Pedan, etc. & a young (Sophmore) Horvat. (no team in the NHL makes the playoffs ith that much youth injection in one year PLUS the Injuries we had to deal with).

This year we are also Subtracting Higgins, Weber, Bartkowski, Cracknell, Prust, Vrbata, etc. & Adding Eriksson, Gubranson, Rodin, Larsson, etc.

Yes we've all heard this before & the "what if's".  Yes there are always the "what if's" but I'll list a few that are definitely odds on to Improve:

-Sedins with Eriksson.

-Sutter

-Edler

-Horvat

-Baer

-Hutton

-Tryamkin

-Etem

-Virtanen

-Tanev

-Marksrom

 

The above will out weigh any of the players who's odds are to have a worse season than last.

 

-Hansen - still 15 goal man on even the 2nd line & a very effective all around player.

-Burrows - same if not better?

-Miller - Markstrom to fill any slippage

-Dorsett - Dorsett

-Gaunce - same if not better

-Granlund - ?

Sbisa - should be better not playing above his responsibilities 

 

Hamhuis gone but replaced by Gubranson & Larsson.

Plus the unknowns of Rodin, Stretcher, Subban, Yuolevi, Zalewski, TRADES, etc.

 

Looks like the PLUSES out weigh the losses by quite a few in my eyes & the odds...

 

 

[coastal1]

9 hours ago, hearditall said:

I wasn't disappointed last year (was totally expected) & I won't next year either. Last year we injected Virtanen, McCann, Hutton, Markstrom, Baer, Etem, Gaunce, Grenier, Tryamkin, Granlund, Hunter, Pedan, etc. & a young (Sophmore) Horvat. (no team in the NHL makes the playoffs ith that much youth injection in one year PLUS the Injuries we had to deal with).

This year we are also Subtracting Higgins, Weber, Bartkowski, Cracknell, Prust, Vrbata, etc. & Adding Eriksson, Gubranson, Rodin, Larsson, etc.

Yes we've all heard this before & the "what if's".  Yes there are always the "what if's" but I'll list a few that are definitely odds on to Improve:

-Sedins with Eriksson.

-Sutter

-Edler

-Horvat

-Baer

-Hutton

-Tryamkin

-Etem

-Virtanen

-Tanev

-Marksrom

 

The above will out weigh any of the players who's odds are to have a worse season than last.

 

-Hansen - still 15 goal man on even the 2nd line & a very effective all around player.

-Burrows - same if not better?

-Miller - Markstrom to fill any slippage

-Dorsett - Dorsett

-Gaunce - same if not better

-Granlund - ?

Sbisa - should be better not playing above his responsibilities 

 

Hamhuis gone but replaced by Gubranson & Larsson.

Plus the unknowns of Rodin, Stretcher, Subban, Yuolevi, Zalewski, TRADES, etc.

 

Looks like the PLUSES out weigh the losses by quite a few in my eyes & the odds...

 

 

I don't want to be overly critical here but first of all the team was very bad last year so it would take a big improvement to get to playoff level. Second, let's look quickly at the possible 'pluses' that you listed:

-Sedins with Eriksson--> the Sedins are trending down, nothing will offset that, maybe Erickson slows the drop off but that's all

-Sutter--> certainly more contribution but the net effect wil be offset by someone else being injured

-Edler--> has plateaued long ago

-Horvat--> possible improvement, yes

-Baer--> maybe, slight, yes

-Hutton-->bigger role may lead to step back

-Tryamkin--> who knows??

-Etem--> very limited upside

-Virtanen--> who knows, could even be in Utica

-Tanev--> good but getting better? unlikely

-Marksrom--> can he really be better??

 

Net impact: ?? This is still a team with decent goaltending, no stud on defence (some decent D men and others with limited potential) and very limited offensive talent. Result: many losses.

 

[Pete M]

DO YOU BELIEVE ME NOW!!

[smokes]

On 7/2/2016 at 6:19 AM, Pete M said:

Our top line just got older for a long time...

We need and always have needed secondary scoring...

We still need a true sniper on the second line...similar to Kessel on the Pens 3rd line (now that is scoring depth).

 

A team plays against the Canucks' top line and lets them play on the perimeter thereby shutting them down. 

Top line shut down...who is going to score?...we need speed, skill and a sniper on the 2nd line to compliment the top line.

 

I don't see the defence adding to the offence.

 

Right now...it sucks to be a Canuck fan.

 

Thank you Captain Obvious

[Pete M]

24 minutes ago, smokes said:

Thank you Captain Obvious

Feel free to pass on to Canuck management lol

[smokes]

3 minutes ago, Pete M said:

Feel free to pass on to Canuck management lol

The question isn't weather we need a sniper, it's who is available and at what price? This isn't a video game, the other teams are also looking after thier own best interest.

[hlinkas wrister]

26 minutes ago, Pete M said:

DO YOU BELIEVE ME NOW!!

I hate biting when people bump their own threads to prove themselves right, but here goes. Do you know what we really need? Patience. It's a rebuild/retool/whatever you want to call it and it's going to get worse before it gets better. Our problems run deeper than just being short a second or third line sniper, we need 2 more elite forwards to be drafted and Juolevi and Boeser to be 3 years older. Should take, ummm, about 3 years, and that's not even taking into account how long its going to take for all of those players to become effective pro's. Yah, the more I think of it, it's patience that we really need.   

[coastal1]

31 minutes ago, Pete M said:

DO YOU BELIEVE ME NOW!!

NO! This team is not a sniper short of being a good offensive team. The problem was and still is the defence, and adding Grud juts made it worse. Tanev, Edler, Gud, Tryamkin, Hutton, Larssen, none of them can launch an effective attack. It is like saying a football team need better receivers when it has no quarterback. Offence starts with the defence. This is our need. This is why JB passed on Tkachuck, he knows our need is on defence.

[Pete M]

6 minutes ago, smokes said:

The question isn't weather we need a sniper, it's who is available and at what price? This isn't a video game, the other teams are also looking after thier own best interest.

Yeah...so sign a 31 year old for 6 years at 6 million...with the expiring contracts we had the assets to do this.

stupid is as stupid does

[Ronaldoescobar]

This team is way way more than a sniper away from being decent. On top of that they also dont have the assets to pick up that sniper without losing one of our own (Boeser) or pretty much one of the only forwards trying these days in Horvat.

[smokes]

1 minute ago, Pete M said:

Yeah...so sign a 31 year old for 6 years at 6 million...with the expiring contracts we had the assets to do this.

stupid is as stupid does

I don't really blame them for that . The NHL these days make it so that it is rare for superstars to truly be on the market. Eriksson was part of the best of the bunch this year. Lucic was pretty much a done deal, seriously even though we are Canucks fans, if you had a chance to be on the wing of Sedin or McDavid, who would you pick?

[Roger Neilsons Towel]

[JM_]

We have good shooters, what we need is a net presence. We have some guys that can fill that role too but Willie can't pull it together. 

[Pete M]

1 minute ago, smokes said:

I don't really blame them for that . The NHL these days make it so that it is rare for superstars to truly be on the market. Eriksson was part of the best of the bunch this year. Lucic was pretty much a done deal, seriously even though we are Canucks fans, if you had a chance to be on the wing of Sedin or McDavid, who would you pick?

Could have easily have passed on both...signing one is the opposite direction that management wanted to go...but they still signed Eriksson, who if you have not noticed (Captain obvious) is on the decline.

 

Things that seem obvious to some is not obvious to others.

[Pete M]

17 minutes ago, hlinkas wrister said:

I hate biting when people bump their own threads to prove themselves right, but here goes. Do you know what we really need? Patience. It's a rebuild/retool/whatever you want to call it and it's going to get worse before it gets better. Our problems run deeper than just being short a second or third line sniper, we need 2 more elite forwards to be drafted and Juolevi and Boeser to be 3 years older. Should take, ummm, about 3 years, and that's not even taking into account how long its going to take for all of those players to become effective pro's. Yah, the more I think of it, it's patience that we really need.   

Sorry...you cannot be patient with a 31 year old at $6M for 6 years...He does not fit into a rebuild that makes sense. If anything, he should be producing immediately because that is what they are paying him to do (because of his experience).

 

Opportunity cost (simple economic concept )...what you do today will cost you new opportunities now and in the future.

 

Is LE a good signing...obviously not!

 

Bottom line, management does not know how to rebuild...this should be obvious by now. 

[Pete M]

3 minutes ago, Pete M said:

Sorry...you cannot be patient with a 31 year old at $6M for 6 years...He does not fit into a rebuild that makes sense. If anything, he should be producing immediately because that is what they are paying him to do (because of his experience).

 

Opportunity cost (simple economic concept )...what you do today will cost you new opportunities now and in the future.

 

Is LE a good signing...obviously not!

 

Bottom line, management does not know how to rebuild...this should be obvious by now. 

Or do I have to revisit this 3 years from now when it is obvious.