189lb enforcers? Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 22 minutes ago, 48MPHSlapShot said: It's hard to say, because TO went through a failed rebuild where they tried to fast track it by selling the farm for Kessel, thus dooming them to several years of mediocrity. Then they lucked out and landed Matthews and now they're off to the races. Honestly, it really isn't a comparable situation. I am curious as to what a fair comparison might be then? For instance, can they be compared by removing all 1st 1st round picks since the Shannaplan started? Then lotto luck is a moot point. Somebody could suggest a way of comparing them and we could go from there. Might be interesting and fun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phat Fingers Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 5 hours ago, GoBoGo53 said: I completely disagree. I think he's a steal. Not saying Liljegren will be Karlsson but they said alot of the same things about Karlsson at the same age. Small, needs to work on defense and decision making. Liljegren has elite skill and elite skating, those are 2 things you can't teach dmen. Nowadays d need to be able to move the pick quick and contribute in the ozone. Liljegren does both. He's the ultimate boom/bust prospect, and for an organization like the Canucks it would have not been worth it because there is bust potential but for a team like Toronto with multiple elite young players already it's worth the risk Replace Liljegren with Pettersson and that's exactly what the Canucks did. I like Liljegren and wanted him for the nucks. Suddenly a TO 1st and Kapannen looks a lot better. A lot of players fell this year. One of the only early predictions that rang true was that JB was taking Pettersson and that Makar was going to be the top dman in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBoGo53 Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 Just now, Eastcoast meets Westcoast said: Replace Liljegren with Pettersson and that's exactly what the Canucks did. I like Liljegren and wanted him for the nucks. Suddenly a TO 1st and Kapannen looks a lot better. A lot of players fell this year. One of the only early predictions that rang true was that JB was taking Pettersson and that Makar was going to be the top dman in the draft. Absolutely that's why I love the Pettersson pick as well, skyhigh potential imo and worst case he ends up a 2nd liner imo. All I am saying is Liljegren at 17 was an incredible value pick. He has #1D Ekman-Larsson potential but at the same time if he doesn't turn it around he could be the next Phillip Larsen. Ultimately worth the risk imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phat Fingers Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 1 minute ago, GoBoGo53 said: Absolutely that's why I love the Pettersson pick as well, skyhigh potential imo and worst case he ends up a 2nd liner imo. All I am saying is Liljegren at 17 was an incredible value pick. He has #1D Ekman-Larsson potential but at the same time if he doesn't turn it around he could be the next Phillip Larsen. Ultimately worth the risk imo. He was derailed with Mono. I don't know why the nucks didn't try and get him and showed no interest. For all the tall about interest in Tanev. I would have been happy with the TO pick (Liljegren) and Kapannen. He could really thrive with that team and Babcock. Holding out for Dahlen next year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bohoforpresident Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 On 5/16/2017 at 1:33 PM, ForsbergTheGreat said: I never said the leaf were done, but you've done nothing but preach doom and gloom about them. They are progressing and have a bright future ahead of them. They have a cupboard full of prospects and drawer full of upcoming picks sick cabinetry reference bro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 1 hour ago, Eastcoast meets Westcoast said: He was derailed with Mono. I don't know why the nucks didn't try and get him and showed no interest. For all the tall about interest in Tanev. I would have been happy with the TO pick (Liljegren) and Kapannen. He could really thrive with that team and Babcock. Holding out for Dahlen next year... Gotta be careful, as far as I'm aware Kapanen and a 1st was never offered to Benning. All just media talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
189lb enforcers? Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 Tree will be back too, you'd think. He must have told them he'd rather tank at home and come back when they were serious about competing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
48MPHSlapShot Posted June 25, 2017 Share Posted June 25, 2017 3 hours ago, 189lb enforcers? said: I am curious as to what a fair comparison might be then? For instance, can they be compared by removing all 1st 1st round picks since the Shannaplan started? Then lotto luck is a moot point. Somebody could suggest a way of comparing them and we could go from there. Might be interesting and fun There really isn't one, considering how the draft rules have changed on account of EDM's talent rape over the last decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Losing With Pride Posted June 26, 2017 Share Posted June 26, 2017 20 hours ago, Wilbur said: Gotta be careful, as far as I'm aware Kapanen and a 1st was never offered to Benning. All just media talk. Gotta love the speculation. The real question is did Benning offer that deal? If it was offered today, Tanev for Lilljegren and Kapanen. Would they take it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
189lb enforcers? Posted June 26, 2017 Share Posted June 26, 2017 11 minutes ago, Losing With Pride said: Gotta love the speculation. The real question is did Benning offer that deal? If it was offered today, Tanev for Lilljegren and Kapanen. Would they take it? OJ and Boeser for Hamonic? Nearly the s ame differe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudette Celly Posted June 26, 2017 Share Posted June 26, 2017 22 hours ago, Eastcoast meets Westcoast said: He was derailed with Mono. I don't know why the nucks didn't try and get him and showed no interest. From Benning's comments about wanting to get back into the first round but the player they wanted being gone, could well have been referring to Liljegren. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudette Celly Posted June 26, 2017 Share Posted June 26, 2017 So much for accumulating picks and buying rentals on a supposedly "done rebuild." Now that's what's called #mixedmessages #twodirectionsatonce. Quote Brian Boyle calls signing with Lightning ‘a huge option’ “We love Tampa,” Boyle said on Sunday. “If Tampa wanted to work out a deal, that’s definitely a huge option for us. That’s something that I’ve kind of always thought about. I haven’t closed the door on anything.” http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/brian-boyle-calls-signing-lightning-huge-option/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur Posted June 26, 2017 Share Posted June 26, 2017 1 hour ago, Losing With Pride said: Gotta love the speculation. The real question is did Benning offer that deal? If it was offered today, Tanev for Lilljegren and Kapanen. Would they take it? Nothing wrong with speculation, just can't judge Benning based on speculation. I would think Benning would take Kapanen and Lilljegren for Tanev (provided a UFA signing to replace Tanev happens). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 So.... that Marleau signing. Quite the 'rebuild' move there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
73 Percent Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 8 minutes ago, J.R. said: So.... that Marleau signing. Quite the 'rebuild' move there. It was clear that they were abandoning their rebuild once they traded for Boyle last year. It's all fine and dandy because they're a playoff team now but it's going to be hard to be a contending team with that defence. They never really picked the kind of defender it takes to win a cup. It's nearly impossible to trade for one and it takes too much time to develop one if they do happen to find one on the draft. What you see is what you get with them now. A high scoring team wth big defensive problems that will be in contention and might get lucky but I don't see them being a favorite very often due to them being a one trick pony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianRugby Posted July 4, 2017 Author Share Posted July 4, 2017 2 hours ago, J.R. said: So.... that Marleau signing. Quite the 'rebuild' move there. That rebuild was over last year. Now they're trying to build a contender around their already elite and up and coming youngsters, if you don't see that you're blind. This move however looks just terrible to me. Marleau has gotten just 40+ points the last two seasons and he's so old, now he's getting big money for 3 years? 2 years would have been an ok gamble but now they can't add anyone next year (unless some big contracts are coming off the books?) and in the last year they'll have to dump salary to resign Matthews and others unless the cap balloons. Babcock defended this move by saying "Have you seen him skate?" but you can add a great skater for hella cheap compared to Marleau. Babcock is arguably the best coach in the league so maybe he sees something I don't but this looks like a huge mistake to me. See JR? That's called an objective opinion. I praised the Leafs for their good moves and trashed them for their bad ones. It's hard to take anything you say seriously because of your endless praise of Benning and trashing of the Leafs even though their rebuilds have gone in opposite directions. If someone didn't know anything about hockey and just looked at your posts they'd think the Canucks are defending champs and the Leafs are about to be relegated to the AHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 2 minutes ago, CanadianRugby said: That rebuild was over last year. Their D disagrees with that assessment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianRugby Posted July 4, 2017 Author Share Posted July 4, 2017 2 hours ago, 73 Percent said: It was clear that they were abandoning their rebuild once they traded for Boyle last year. It's all fine and dandy because they're a playoff team now but it's going to be hard to be a contending team with that defence. They never really picked the kind of defender it takes to win a cup. It's nearly impossible to trade for one and it takes too much time to develop one if they do happen to find one on the draft. What you see is what you get with them now. A high scoring team wth big defensive problems that will be in contention and might get lucky but I don't see them being a favorite very often due to them being a one trick pony. Look at the Pen's D last year. Brian Dumoulin and Ron Hainsey led them in ice time. You don't need a great D man if your team plays good D and always has the puck because of your elite forwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
73 Percent Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 2 minutes ago, CanadianRugby said: Look at the Pen's D last year. Brian Dumoulin and Ron Hainsey led them in ice time. You don't need a great D man if your team plays good D and always has the puck because of your elite forwards. That works if you have elite forwards. Is Mathews as good as Crosby? Nylander-kessel Marner-malkin Plus on top of that they don't have the goalie under a cheap contract. Or the crazy young forward depth. Toronto may get lucky and win a cup. Anything can happen. I just see them stuck in no man's land right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianRugby Posted July 4, 2017 Author Share Posted July 4, 2017 8 minutes ago, J.R. said: Their D disagrees with that assessment. They have a decent D, that needs to be improved. If you look at the Penguins D on paper that's a D that needs improvement too, I guess in your eyes their rebuild isn't over either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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