Is Demko a #1 goalie

[Arrow 1983]

Some of you might recall I was a big fan of Demko prior to the playoffs (maybe even his number 1 fan) . I even made the argument that they should trade Markstrom at the TDL last season or at best just let him walk in the off season (which occurred).  

 

IMHO, the biggest question around Vancouver how I believe; Is Demko as good as he was in the playoffs or at least a top 15 goalie in this league? Worst case scenario we find out he isn't even a starter. 

 

I will state, I believe he is a starter and has a great potential to be a top tier goalie (top 15 or greater) I even believe some time in his career he could be a top 5 goalie at his peak (I have such high regard of his play that I believe Demko not Pettersson Hughes or Horvat will be the reason the Canucks hoist the Stanley cup in the next 5 years). I would also be the first one to say he is not as good as he was in the playoffs. I believe no goalie can maintain that level long term and I also believe his numbers where skewed because of the Defensive game plan that TG and the team implemented. I also believe that Holtby is not the same goalie he was a few years past. I think Holtby is a great backup probably one of the best in the League he might even be a good starting goalie for a bad team. My ranking for Holtby would be between 29-35 I do not think he would make a great long term starter. This is why I believe the question I proposed is the biggest one this year.

 

All this said I'm just wondering where you guys rank Demko compared to the rest of the goalies in the NHL (I am hoping the rational mind of the Canuck fan is back and the poll does not get skewed by Demko's play in playoffs). 

 

 

 

Edited December 27, 2020 by Arrow 1983

[Ballisticsports.]

I think it i much too early to rank him , as his NHL window has been short

 

Markstrom was a good starter at 28?

Demko is 25,  Nobody wanted Marky at 25? when he passed waivers

I think we will see what we have soon as it is too early to say for sure

I don't think he is as bad as he was when thrust into the regular season, or as good when thrust in the Playoffs

I think he will be steady in between those two peaks with more upside games than downside games and will continue to grow and be a better goalie

 

 

[-AJ-]

Way too early to give him a ranking. Need a bigger sample size. Based on how he played against Vegas, he's a Vezina contender. Based on how he ended the regular season, he's a fringe starter.

[Arrow 1983]

1 minute ago, ba;;isticsports said:

I think it i much too early to rank him , as his NHL window has been short

 

Markstrom was a good starter at 28?

Demko is 25,  Nobody wanted Marky at 25? when he passed waivers

I think we will see what we have soon as it is too early to say for sure

I don't think he is as bad as he was when thrust into the regular season, or as good when thrust in the Playoffs

I think he will be steady in between those two peaks with more upside games than downside games and will continue to grow and be a better goalie

 

 

that's why the poll asks where you rank him at this point of his career meaning today.

 

If fans think very low and they are right then the Canucks could have a serious problem

 

If highly and he is then the Canucks should do just fine and make the playoffs in this Canadian division 

[Arrow 1983]

Just now, -AJ- said:

Way too early to give him a ranking. Need a bigger sample size. Based on how he played against Vegas, he's a Vezina contender. Based on how he ended the regular season, he's a fringe starter.

that's why the poll asks where you rank him at this point of his career meaning today.

 

If fans think very low and they are right then the Canucks could have a serious problem

 

If highly and he is then the Canucks should do just fine and make the playoffs in this Canadian division 

[-AJ-]

15 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

that's why the poll asks where you rank him at this point of his career meaning today.

 

If fans think very low and they are right then the Canucks could have a serious problem

 

If highly and he is then the Canucks should do just fine and make the playoffs in this Canadian division 

I can't give him a ranking as of now. The variance is too high to give him a reasonably reliable evaluation. It's like picking a number between 1 and 1000 and then pretending you can stand by the accuracy of that number.

 

Predicting future results implies some uncertainty (due to the fact that none of us are future tellers), so that would be more reasonable. Even still, I expect Holtby to be the starter next year, so then you'd have to break down your question into more specific categories:

 

1. Will Demko be a #1 goalie this coming season? Well given I expect Holtby to be the starter, the answer has to be no.

 

2. Will Demko be of a starting goaltender calibre next season? This is a much more interesting question, but again, sample size really restricts the answer here. If Demko plays 25 games and plays very well, does that make him a good starter? Most starters are playing at least 50 games in a season and history shows that workload has a huge impact on the performance of goaltenders.

 

So, in sum:

 

1. I think the question of whether or not Demko is a #1 goalie right now can't be reasonably answered. There's just not enough evidence to go off of.

2. The question as to whether or not Demko will be a #1 goalie next year is more reasonable, but even then, he'll likely play the backup or 1B role to Holtby, so the sample size still won't be there.

 

The better question might be more general:

 

How good of a goaltender is Demko? This removes the "starter" aspect of the question and is less restrictive.

 

To answer that, all I can say is I've seen him as a backup and he looks to be a solid backup. Generally struggles with heavy workloads over extended periods of time and excels with spot time playing periodic games.

[Arrow 1983]

2 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

I can't give him a ranking as of now. The variance is too high to give him a reasonably reliable evaluation. It's like picking a number between 1 and 1000 and then pretending you can stand by the accuracy of that number.

 

Predicting future results implies some uncertainty (due to the fact that none of us are future tellers), so that would be more reasonable. Even still, I expect Holtby to be the starter next year, so then you'd have to break down your question into more specific categories:

 

1. Will Demko be a #1 goalie this coming season? Well given I expect Holtby to be the starter, the answer has to be no.

 

2. Will Demko be of a starting goaltender calibre next season? This is a much more interesting question, but again, sample size really restricts the answer here. If Demko plays 25 games and plays very well, does that make him a good starter? Most starters are playing at least 50 games in a season and history shows that workload has a huge impact on the performance of goaltenders.

 

So, in sum:

 

1. I think the question of whether or not Demko is a #1 goalie right now can't be reasonably answered. There's just not enough evidence to go off of.

2. The question as to whether or not Demko will be a #1 goalie next year is more reasonable, but even then, he'll likely play the backup or 1B role to Holtby, so the sample size still won't be there.

Do you think, assuming you are right and Holtby is our starter (I pray this is not true of Benning and Greens thinking) that the Canucks are in a good position to make the playoffs.

[-AJ-]

Just now, Arrow 1983 said:

Do you think, assuming you are right and Holtby is our starter (I pray this is not true of Benning and Greens thinking) that the Canucks are in a good position to make the playoffs.

I think the team will struggle and will either finish just outside at 5th or barely make the show at 4th in the North division. I expect Demko and Holtby to be a decent tandem, but I feel as though our defensive depth will be our kryptonite. Outside of our top four, we sorely lack experience and depth and when inevitable injuries hit, we could be decimated defensively.

[Arrow 1983]

7 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

I think the team will struggle and will either finish just outside at 5th or barely make the show at 4th in the North division. I expect Demko and Holtby to be a decent tandem, but I feel as though our defensive depth will be our kryptonite. Outside of our top four, we sorely lack experience and depth and when inevitable injuries hit, we could be decimated defensively.

I actually like our Defense, I do think we need a defensive defenseman but all around I like the unpredictability of our defense the depth of our youth on defense and most importantly the young defensemen we have, had much time to develop these are not 18-19 year old kids. They have actually had time to develop their defensive game

Edited December 27, 2020 by Arrow 1983

[Arrow 1983]

14 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

I can't give him a ranking as of now. The variance is too high to give him a reasonably reliable evaluation. It's like picking a number between 1 and 1000 and then pretending you can stand by the accuracy of that number.

 

Predicting future results implies some uncertainty (due to the fact that none of us are future tellers), so that would be more reasonable. Even still, I expect Holtby to be the starter next year, so then you'd have to break down your question into more specific categories:

 

1. Will Demko be a #1 goalie this coming season? Well given I expect Holtby to be the starter, the answer has to be no.

 

2. Will Demko be of a starting goaltender calibre next season? This is a much more interesting question, but again, sample size really restricts the answer here. If Demko plays 25 games and plays very well, does that make him a good starter? Most starters are playing at least 50 games in a season and history shows that workload has a huge impact on the performance of goaltenders.

 

So, in sum:

 

1. I think the question of whether or not Demko is a #1 goalie right now can't be reasonably answered. There's just not enough evidence to go off of.

2. The question as to whether or not Demko will be a #1 goalie next year is more reasonable, but even then, he'll likely play the backup or 1B role to Holtby, so the sample size still won't be there.

 

The better question might be more general:

 

How good of a goaltender is Demko? This removes the "starter" aspect of the question and is less restrictive.

 

To answer that, all I can say is I've seen him as a backup and he looks to be a solid backup. Generally struggles with heavy workloads over extended periods of time and excels with spot time playing periodic games.

We do agree then if Demko is not a starter then the Canucks have serious problems

[BowtieCanuck]

Demko is a money goalie. He's going to tear the league up in one way or another by design.

[theo5789]

35 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

Do you think, assuming you are right and Holtby is our starter (I pray this is not true of Benning and Greens thinking) that the Canucks are in a good position to make the playoffs.

I think Holtby is the designated starter. This is to challenge and push Demko for that starting spot rather than handing it to him by default. We did this with Markstrom by bringing in Ryan Miller and look where that has taken Markstrom. I don't view it as a negative if this is how it plays out. This has been the mentality even amongst the forwards and defense where the challenge the young players and if they indeed win the spot, they will be given it. Forcing that competition pushes both goalies which hopefully means a higher level of play in that position to help get us to the playoffs.

 

In a normal season, we likely see Demko be the backup in this situation, but he would see about 30-35% of the games. I think we more likely see Demko play about 40% of the games this year and depending on his play, we could possibly see an even split with this compressed schedule.

[ImConfused]

Does a bear poop in the woods?

 

If a tree falls in the forest and nobody around to hear it, does it make a sound?

 

Is this thread clickbait?

 

Edited December 27, 2020 by ImConfused

[-AJ-]

2 hours ago, Arrow 1983 said:

We do agree then if Demko is not a starter then the Canucks have serious problems

I disagree. I think Hotlby is capable of holding a starting job, especially if he only plays around 60% of the games. I think Demko will play well with 40% or fewer games.

[iceman64]

Demko has 2 years to show he can play well consistently, and it doesn't matter if it takes 2 more seasons because Holtby can steal games and a proven Vez performer but needs and will hone his game back to that, that shouldn't be difficult since we have one of the best goalie coaches on the planet, I hardly see this as an issue, his job is to help win games and push Demko as he raises the bar as Markstrom did but at the end of the day, if we have to rely on our goalies as much as previously, we're in trouble.

 However, and mark my words, we might need some of that as we begin the season but 5-10 games in I see our D as a huge upgrade on last year where we let our goalies hung out to dry. THAT was painful to watch 

[oldnews]

if it's 'rational' responses you seek:

 

ask yourself whether "ranking" a rookie goaltender with 34 careers starts is a 'good' question or not.

[Patel Bure]

After having watched the playoffs, I am of the belief that Demko is an elite goalie and that these past playoffs was his coming out party.

 

I am of the belief that it was more than just a good stretch of play based on the technique and positioning that he displayed.  This was unlike Billington and Pittsburgh’s goalie when they had their respective hot streaks.   Demko is for real in my opinion.   Even before the initial Covid lockdown, Demko was startling to look really good after having had a slow start post Markstrom injury.

[IBatch]

Demko is the perfect guy to take over the reigns as our number one as of right now.   It’s anyone’s guess as to whether or not he will succeed in this role - but he’s been given every opportunity to do that. That said don’t be surprised if TG starts with Holtby and manages the two goalies based on the hot hand and how they play.   It’s not a foregone conclusion yet as to whether he’s just another Boucher or Elliot or even Talbot.   Just another very good goalie that has hot streaks.   Boucher had what?  Five shutouts in a row for the league record ... but wasn’t really a true number one. 

Edited December 29, 2020 by IBatch

[IBatch]

On 12/27/2020 at 5:34 PM, DarkIndianRises said:

After having watched the playoffs, I am of the belief that Demko is an elite goalie and that these past playoffs was his coming out party.

 

I am of the belief that it was more than just a good stretch of play based on the technique and positioning that he displayed.  This was unlike Billington and Pittsburgh’s goalie when they had their respective hot streaks.   Demko is for real in my opinion.   Even before the initial Covid lockdown, Demko was startling to look really good after having had a slow start post Markstrom injury.

This is what the entire fan base hopes.   Don’t have the same optimism given how fickle the position is,  that said Demko will be given ever opportunity to show he can do it...

[Devron]

How do you rank a goaltender that was a rookie last year