Time To Jettison Aging Vets?

[Nuxfanabroad]

For ease of thread topic, suggesting we define aging vets as 30 yrs, or having already reached about 500 career, gp.

 

Personally feel a rising number of our youth are of an age that they can help(incoming ELC types), as opposed to being helped themselves.

 

Q1.. Is it high time to transition our core of key players into a range of young to mid-20's? Guys like Nils Hoglander often appear to be playing the most "vet" style, of whatever roster we're running.

Our average age has ranged around 27-28, but hard to nail this down precisely, with all the turnover. Would this be a good time to aim for the 26-ish range, assembling a young roster(perhaps in youngest third of all NHL squads)?

 

Keep only 1 of Benn/Ham

Goodbye to Eddie

Return the Bfg from Siberia

Buyout for LouiE

Maybe another for AR

 

Perhaps never give more than 2 yrs(future signings) to any such vets in FAgency?

 

or, Q2.. Might it be a tad early to aggressively transition to a younger roster(in 2021-22, of course)?

 

Which do you prefer? Any specific moves come to mind?..

[J.I.A.H.N]

Our Vets (age 28 to 35) will not be here, when we are competitive, so I think this is the year and time to move them. I know I get some opposition when I say this, but IMO, our list should be big, and Benning should be active right now (Like right now!)

 

With teams back east having players injured on a pretty regular basis, and needing short term and long term replacements.............

 

IMO, Horvat and Miller are the oldest untouchables..............both Myers and Schmidt, will be getting up there by the time we are there, and will be replaceable by then.

 

Holtby

Edler*, Schmidt, Myers, Hamomic, Benn, Rafferty and Chatfield

Pearson, Sutter, Beagle, Roussel, Veasy, Boyd, Baertschi, Michaels, Bailey, and Graovac

 

IMO all should be on the block, if the right offer is tenured. Of course, not every one will move, but all should be considered.

 

* yes, every body knows Alex Edler has said he will not waive, but until that offer comes in, there is no use worrying about it............Imagine Tampa phoning Alex, and saying hey, we only want you for the playoff run, and we understand you will go back to Vancouver after our run.............until that happens, never say never.

 

And I would gladly retain 50% of any outgoing UFA contract, if it gets us a better pick

 

 

Edited March 31, 2021 by janisahockeynut

[Elias Pettersson]

Most of our vets are UFA's, so they can be gone in the summer.  Edler, Benn, Sutter, Baertschi, Pearson.  If Aquilini approves then we can also buyout Eriksson and Holtby.  That would leave only Roussel and Beagle.  Beagle is still useful as a 4C for one more year, while Roussel can sit in the press box for a year as an injury fill in.  That leaves us with plenty of spots for the young guys.  Podkolzin, Lind, Gadjovich, Tryamkin, Juolevi and Rathbone should all be given the chance to make the team right out of camp next year.

 

Schmidt and Myers still have a role on this team as well as Beagle, you can't rid of everybody.  Hamonic could be re-signed based on the dollars to play with Hughes for another year or two, so they are pretty much the only 4 I'd want to see in the lineup next year that are 30+.

[J.I.A.H.N]

10 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Most of our vets are UFA's, so they can be gone in the summer.  Edler, Benn, Sutter, Baertschi, Pearson.  If Aquilini approves then we can also buyout Eriksson and Holtby.  That would leave only Roussel and Beagle.  Beagle is still useful as a 4C for one more year, while Roussel can sit in the press box for a year as an injury fill in.  That leaves us with plenty of spots for the young guys.  Podkolzin, Lind, Gadjovich, Tryamkin, Juolevi and Rathbone should all be given the chance to make the team right out of camp next year.

 

Schmidt and Myers still have a role on this team as well as Beagle, you can't rid of everybody.  Hamonic could be re-signed based on the dollars to play with Hughes for another year or two, so they are pretty much the only 4 I'd want to see in the lineup next year that are 30+.

Pettie

 

I think you miss understand the timing..............""IF"" the Canucks were to collect picks, that were to come up while our Core is in their prime, it has to be in the next 2 years, so the push should be now, at the 2022 and 2023 draft. Just look at what we are facing with Horvat being a UFA right when our window opens. You have to have those ELC's enter the team, as our Core ages into UFA years, as it is the only way you can keep the average down, and be able to re-sign them. 

 

But more importantly, you do not move everyone, but that does not mean you exclude them from the list......aka Schmidt, etc. (If Florida offers a 1st, you take it, if they offer a young prospect (Tippett) you run, if they offer you a 3 and a 4th you hang up the phone, but you have to be open to the possibility.

[Nuxfanabroad]

14 minutes ago, 6of1_halfdozenofother said:

Jettison... like this?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah..now you're using yer melon!

[Nucksownyou]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Most of our vets are UFA's, so they can be gone in the summer.  Edler, Benn, Sutter, Baertschi, Pearson.  If Aquilini approves then we can also buyout Eriksson and Holtby.  That would leave only Roussel and Beagle.  Beagle is still useful as a 4C for one more year, while Roussel can sit in the press box for a year as an injury fill in.  That leaves us with plenty of spots for the young guys.  Podkolzin, Lind, Gadjovich, Tryamkin, Juolevi and Rathbone should all be given the chance to make the team right out of camp next year.

 

Schmidt and Myers still have a role on this team as well as Beagle, you can't rid of everybody.  Hamonic could be re-signed based on the dollars to play with Hughes for another year or two, so they are pretty much the only 4 I'd want to see in the lineup next year that are 30+.

Why the hell would we buyout Holtby?

[Provost]

6 minutes ago, Nucksownyou said:

Why the hell would we buyout Holtby?

Because we could save $3.8 million in cap next year when we are in a terrible cap crunch and replace him for a back up at less than half that cost?

We get a deferred $2.4 million cap hit the year after that, but we have a lot of money coming off the books that year and can't really spend it because we have a bunch of extensions that will be coming up due in the consecutive seasons after that.

Edited March 31, 2021 by Provost

[Nucksownyou]

4 minutes ago, Provost said:

Because we could save $3.8 million in cap next year when we are in a terrible cap crunch and replace him for a back up at less than half that cost?

We get a deferred $2.4 million cap hit the year after that, but we have a lot of money coming off the books that year and can't really spend it because we have a bunch of extensions that will be coming up due in the consecutive seasons after that.

Or, you know, we can keep Holtby because he is a serviceable backup, and we don't need his caphit on the books beyond next season. A cheaper backup's caphit plus Holtby's buyout caphit isn't actually that much of a savings.

 

Our cap crunch is right now. We can afford to keep Holtby next season.

Edited March 31, 2021 by Nucksownyou

[Nuxfanabroad]

I think we also need Holtby's contract for 1 'tender, ED-exposure..do we not?

 

Maybe afterwards we can retain rubles & flip him like a hotcake?

[Elias Pettersson]

45 minutes ago, Nucksownyou said:

Why the hell would we buyout Holtby?

Because we could get a backup in the UFA market for a quarter of the price.  His buyout would save is $3.8 million in cap space next year, as his cap hit would only be $500,000.  You can get a serviceable backup in free agency for $1 million.  That's $2.8 million in cap space that we can use to sign Hamonic or some other Dman to play with Hughes.  We don't have any cap space without buying out some contracts after we sign Petey and Hughes to extensions.  

 

Benning signed Holtby because he didn't know if Demko was going to become a true starter.  Now that Demko is playing like a Vezina trophy candidate we can let Holtby go and just get a cheap backup who can play 25 games.

[Provost]

34 minutes ago, Nuxfanabroad said:

I think we also need Holtby's contract for 1 'tender, ED-exposure..do we not?

 

Maybe afterwards we can retain rubles & flip him like a hotcake?

A buyout window wouldn't start until after expansion.

[Elias Pettersson]

1 hour ago, janisahockeynut said:

Pettie

 

I think you miss understand the timing..............""IF"" the Canucks were to collect picks, that were to come up while our Core is in their prime, it has to be in the next 2 years, so the push should be now, at the 2022 and 2023 draft. Just look at what we are facing with Horvat being a UFA right when our window opens. You have to have those ELC's enter the team, as our Core ages into UFA years, as it is the only way you can keep the average down, and be able to re-sign them. 

 

But more importantly, you do not move everyone, but that does not mean you exclude them from the list......aka Schmidt, etc. (If Florida offers a 1st, you take it, if they offer a young prospect (Tippett) you run, if they offer you a 3 and a 4th you hang up the phone, but you have to be open to the possibility.

You can't time our window to the exact date.  We may be contenders in 2 years or it may take 4 years, or it may take longer.  Tampa won the Cup last year when Hedman and Stamkos were pushing 30, so BO still has lots of time.  Heck even Miller at 31 or 32 may still be a decent player.

 

We have lots of young kids on the way that need to play.  I agree if we get a crazy offer for Schmidt you trade him, but you still need some veterans around to win.  Not every team is going to peak at the exact same time.  Posters always use Chicago as an example of needing to win a Cup when your star players are in their ELC years, but the reality is most teams don't win a Cup until their stars are in their mid to late 20's.

[Nucksownyou]

2 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Because we could get a backup in the UFA market for a quarter of the price.  His buyout would save is $3.8 million in cap space next year, as his cap hit would only be $500,000.  You can get a serviceable backup in free agency for $1 million.  That's $2.8 million in cap space that we can use to sign Hamonic or some other Dman to play with Hughes.  We don't have any cap space without buying out some contracts after we sign Petey and Hughes to extensions.  

 

Benning signed Holtby because he didn't know if Demko was going to become a true starter.  Now that Demko is playing like a Vezina trophy candidate we can let Holtby go and just get a cheap backup who can play 25 games.

Benning signed Holtby because he didn't want to put too much on Demko's shoulders right away. Demko was alway going to be the starter going forward. I don't know why that is so hard for people to figure out.

 

And stop acting like Pettersson and Hughes are getting $10+ million on their next contracts. They're NOT getting that much. We will have over $20 million in cap space this off season, and even after Pettersson, Hughes and Demko re-sign, there will still be a bit left over to get some depth pieces. So no, we do not need to buyout Holtby. If anyone is getting bought out, it will be Eriksson, not Holtby.

[Elias Pettersson]

2 minutes ago, Nucksownyou said:

Benning signed Holtby because he didn't want to put too much on Demko's shoulders right away. Demko was alway going to be the starter going forward. I don't know why that is so hard for people to figure out.

 

And stop acting like Pettersson and Hughes are getting $10+ million on their next contracts. They're NOT getting that much. We will have over $20 million in cap space this off season, and even after Pettersson, Hughes and Demko re-sign, there will still be a bit left over to get some depth pieces. So no, we do not need to buyout Holtby. If anyone is getting bought out, it will be Eriksson, not Holtby.

If you look at CapFriendly we don't have much left after Petey, Hughes and Demko re-sign.  Who said anything about $10+ million contracts?  $6.5 million each plus $4.5 million for Demko is already close to $18 million.  What exactly are we going to do with the $2 million left over?  That won't even cover the re-signing of Hamonic or an equivalent, nevermind some of the other players.  Buying out Eriksson is also an option, I'm hoping Benning buys out both Eriksson and Holtby.  Then we can actually go shopping for a true 3C and maybe an upgrade on Hamonic.

[24K PureCool]

Isn't father time already taking care of this?

Edited March 31, 2021 by 24K PureCool

[mll]

16 minutes ago, Provost said:

A buyout window wouldn't start until after expansion.

The buyout period opens before expansion but there is a freeze during the process.  Teams could use a buyout on players who wont waive their NMCs.

 

15 July (or 24 hour after the final game if later)   Buyout window opens

17 July expansion freeze - no waivers, trades, buyouts etc

21 July expansion

22 July expansion freeze lifted

27 July buyout window closes

 

 

[24K PureCool]

5 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

If you look at CapFriendly we don't have much left after Petey, Hughes and Demko re-sign.  Who said anything about $10+ million contracts?  $6.5 million each plus $4.5 million for Demko is already close to $18 million.  What exactly are we going to do with the $2 million left over?  That won't even cover the re-signing of Hamonic or an equivalent, nevermind some of the other players.  Buying out Eriksson is also an option, I'm hoping Benning buys out both Eriksson and Holtby.  Then we can actually go shopping for a true 3C and maybe an upgrade on Hamonic.

Per cap friendly we have north of 25 million in cap space next year, take 3 mill out from bonuses, we have around around 22 million in cap of which the golden trio will eat around 17 million leaving is with about 5 million. Buying out Erickson is a no brainer unless Aqua wants to be cheap so with his 2 million off the books, we have 7 million to play around. More than enough to add to the roaster without buying out Holtby and that is without the potential of Seattle taking a roaster player for whatever reason rather than going for our UFA or prospects. 

[Elias Pettersson]

10 minutes ago, 24K PureCool said:

Per cap friendly we have north of 25 million in cap space next year, take 3 mill out from bonuses, we have around around 22 million in cap of which the golden trio will eat around 17 million leaving is with about 5 million. Buying out Erickson is a no brainer unless Aqua wants to be cheap so with his 2 million off the books, we have 7 million to play around. More than enough to add to the roaster without buying out Holtby and that is without the potential of Seattle taking a roaster player for whatever reason rather than going for our UFA or prospects. 

That $25 million includes only 12 players and also includes the contract of Ferland.  Are you saying we can sign another 7 players (minus Petey, Hughes and Demko) for only $7 million?

Edited March 31, 2021 by Elias Pettersson

[Hockey God]

We should all know by now the following:

1. Benning doesn't trade vets out of "loyalty";

2. Because of the above, we are stuck with albatross contracts until they either retire or come to end of contract;

3. Because of both of the above, the team will always have needs, but will never be able to get what it needs the most; 

4. Because of the above three points, the coaching staff and Benning are safe, as the "process" can never be completed due to circumstances beyond their control, aka other teams not being willing to pay anything for our junk;

5. Finally, because of the above 4 points, being a Canucks fan is one of the most excruciating things you can be.  I know, because I've been one since the mid 1970s.

[24K PureCool]

3 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

That $25 million includes only 12 players and also includes the contract of Ferland.  Are you saying we can sign another 7 players (minus Petey, Hughes and Demko) for only $7 million?

Right so 10 million for 7 players. 

Very doable considering at least 2 of them will he on elc (Podz, Lind, OJ?) Unless you want another expensive bottom 6 player? Think we all got off that boat.