[SCF] Colorado Avalanche (C1) vs. Tampa Bay Lightning (A3) | Avalanche win 2022 Stanley Cup

[mll]

Can't have 5 guys already in the middle of the ice when the 6th is finally coming off.  

 

 

[Elias Pettersson]

16 hours ago, Jaimito said:

 

 

Tampa’s 4 and 5 came on for 6 and 7. Neither one of them touched the puck so that’s a good line change. 
 

2 (Kadri) replaces (6) MacKinnon. Kadri was already in the play and had the puck before MacKinnon came off the ice. That’s an illegal line change and “too many men”.  
 

Here is the actual rule: 

 

Edited June 23, 2022 by Elias Pettersson

[Coconuts]

 

 

[alt kilgore]

Yeah it was clearly a missed call. They call that sometimes even if the puck hits the skates of a 6th player near the bench let alone allowing him to skate up the ice on a scoring chance.

 

i think the non call was a result of the refs putting their whistles away as a deliberate method late in a playoff game.  Egregious infractions happening all over the ice.  I think it was Kadri who was tripped up on another scoring chance earlier in the period with no call. Other blatant interference happening all over.  
So because of that mindset, the refs were not as diligent. They weren’t looking for penalties to call. They had already decided to only call something if a player was injured or if was automatic like puck over glass. At that point they were just another fan.  They were not going to be hard az about anything including line changes
 

I’m a bit torn on this SCF unique (and denied) ref MO of, “letting the players decide” especially in SCF overtime. On one hand it makes for more intense uninterrupted flow, but on the other hand it makes the refs sleepy and can lead to controversies like this.

[Baggins]

1 hour ago, CanucksJay said:

 

I dunno if I agree... I've watched hockey my entire life. Never have I watched an "onside ruling" like Makar against the Oilers. 

As for Kadri's early change, the guy is taking a pass going full speed at centre ice before McKinnon is off the ice.

Yes there are some leeways given in line change some times but never when the player that is replacing the guy going to the bench plays the puck. They call it even when it's right in front of the bench let alone streaking up the middle of the ice. 

 

This video is pretty conclusive that this should have been a too many men penalty. McKinnon is nowhere near 5 ft from the bench when Kadri steps on

I watched hockey since the early 60's. So what? How often have you seen a play like Makar's? I've never seen one impossibly timed like that. It was a complete fluke that's likely a one in a billion play. It doesn't change the way a delayed offside has worked. All I've ever seen is a delayed offside becoming offside if the puck is touched or a player continues to pursue the puck while he is himself offside. What goes on outside the blueline is immaterial to a delayed offside. Makar was still outside the blueline with one foot placing him onside. Meaning as long as he didn't touch the puck opr put himself offside while the delayed offside is in effect there is no offside to be called. 

 

Sure it should have been too many men. There's many times throughout any game there should be too many men called. But the guys explanation is pretty accurate. It's completely understandable it was missed. So unless you want to slow the game down, and make everything reviewable, you have accept human error. There's no point whining about it. To me the logical rule change is you cannot leave the bench until a player has left the ice. I've never understood why that isn't the rule other than making line changes on the fly a little more difficult. But if you're going the create a discretionary gray area you'll get gray calls as a result.

[Jaimito]

 

 

[Jaimito]

42 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Tampa’s 4 and 5 came on for 6 and 7. Neither one of them touched the puck so that’s a good line change. 
 

2 (Kadri) replaces (6) MacKinnon. Kadri was already in the play and had the puck before MacKinnon came off the ice. That’s an illegal line change and “too many men”.  
 

Here is the actual rule: 

 

Avs won and deserved it. Was a great hockey game.  

It doesn't bother me at all.  A non reviewable play. Refs called it a goal.  Like they didn't prevent a goal when Keumper's mask came off.  The fact Cooper made it an issue is unfortunate, since they scored with too many men in the playoffs and benefited from a non call. 

Edited June 23, 2022 by Jaimito

[Elias Pettersson]

15 minutes ago, Jaimito said:

Avs won and deserved it. Was a great hockey game.  

It doesn't bother me at all.  A non reviewable play. Refs called it a goal.  Like they didn't prevent a goal when Keumper's mask came off.  The fact Cooper made it an issue is unfortunate, since they scored with too many men in the playoffs and benefited from a non call. 

That is true. However my point was it was clearly a too many men penalty. Lots of people seem to be implying that it wasn’t. 

[Bell]

I still can't believe they don't blow the whistle when the goalies mask was off.  That seems kind of reckless to me.

[Jaimito]

22 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

That is true. However my point was it was clearly a too many men penalty. Lots of people seem to be implying that it wasn’t. 

Clearly with replay in multiple angles, and it was close, as MacKinnon got off too slow. By the time Kadri was in center ice MacKinnon is at the bench door. But it was fast in real time, and if refs weren't calling penalties much in third and OT, they sure aren't calling at a cheap one.  

 

Don't think Bolts got robbed. They were the inferior team in 3rd and OT.  Kadri was 1 on 2 for heaven sakes. 

 

Brett Hull goal with foot in crease was more unacceptable given that year's rule. 

 

Hoping for a good game 5. Both teams definitely deserve to be in SCF. 

 

 

 

Edited June 24, 2022 by Jaimito

[Baggins]

3 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

That is true. However my point was it was clearly a too many men penalty. Lots of people seem to be implying that it wasn’t. 

Did you know that when it occured or only after a review? 

[IBatch]

18 hours ago, VancouverHabitant said:

4 years!?!  Yikes, if that was the case then I think JR and Allvin would be coming in and declaring a rebuild.  

 

Hockey is a game of bounces and has way more luck involved then other sports.  I consider any of the top 8 teams in the league contenders, and I see the Canucks as presently constructed in the murky middle that goes from 12th best to 20th best in the league.  

 

We'll have to agree to disagree on our view of our team as I believe that getting a legitimate top 4 RHD that can play 22 mins/night and a couple of bigger cheap forwards would push us into the top 10.  We can get checkmarks next to all those requirements next summer IMO.  

I read four years off from contending as realistic best case too.    That won't happen rebuilding, and agree that it takes teams time and often quite a lot of it to get over the playoff hump of first and second round exits.   At least the core has had one playoffs already which for sure counts.   It also shown them how hard it is to even make it to the playoffs.   Hopefully Bruce can have them playing like they did down the stretch throughout the entire season ... and JR/Allvin can make the right trades with the eye to the future.    It's extremely difficult to build a contender like COL and TB.   St. Louis is a good goal for us given our tax bracket and the value that can be found in those mid range guys.   Four years from now the majority of our core will be in their peak prime ... and some guys coming up behind them as well, how they deal with Miller, Horvat and Brock will definitely play into that. 

[Herberts Vasiljevs]

I think the refs want the Bruins to win this series...

[DeNiro]

7 minutes ago, Herberts Vasiljevs said:

I think the refs want the Bruins to win this series...

It’s quite sad that year after year the NHL basically says Kelly Sutherland is the best the league has to offer in terms of officials.

 

His whole style of reffing is basically to call everything up until a certain point in the game (which only he knows) and then call nothing the rest of the way. You could pretty much put anyone out there to do that. 
 

The league will continue to have these controversial games as long as you leave them in the hands of these incompetent referees. They really need to take as much influence on the game away from them as they can. I say almost everything should be challengeable.

 

 

 

[Cromeslab]

Concistancy,players have been saying it for decades,in regards to reffing

Edited June 24, 2022 by Cromeslab

[Baggins]

3 minutes ago, Cromeslab said:

Consistently,players have been saying it for decades,in regards to reffing

Just as they constantly argue getting called when they actually commit a penalty. The whining will never stop.

[Baggins]

25 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

It’s quite sad that year after year the NHL basically says Kelly Sutherland is the best the league has to offer in terms of officials.

 

His whole style of reffing is basically to call everything up until a certain point in the game (which only he knows) and then call nothing the rest of the way. You could pretty much put anyone out there to do that. 
 

The league will continue to have these controversial games as long as you leave them in the hands of these incompetent referees. They really need to take as much influence on the game away from them as they can. I say almost everything should be challengeable.

 

 

 

Human error will always be part a of the game. Unless of course they make everything reviewable. Which would really slow games down. Refs have one view from ice level in real time. We get multiple angles and slow motion. Refs will miss things and get calls wrong. I accept that as part of the game.

[Elias Pettersson]

1 hour ago, Baggins said:

Did you know that when it occured or only after a review? 

Well I’m not a referee so it’s not my job to pay attention to those details. Kadri had the puck and was skating into the zone before MacKinnon even came off. MacKinnon didn’t come off until 5 seconds after Kadri jumped on. If you were a referre or a linesmen and were actually paying attention it was an easy call. 
 

There have been alot of missed calls in these playoffs. This one was one of the more obvious ones along with Kuemper’s mask coming off. 

[Nucker 67]

My gosh that Jon Cooper is a whiney baby

 

Deal with it dude, you lost

 

Hope Colorado destroys them later

[Alflives]

22 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

My gosh that Jon Cooper is a whiney baby

 

Deal with it dude, you lost

 

Hope Colorado destroys them later

John “Pooper Scooper” had an easy road to the Cup.  They played the choking Leafs.  The overrated Panthers.  And a team that was all goalie.  Now against a good team they are being destroyed.