KoreanHockeyFan Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 I'm wondering, is Miller's contract really that rich? I'm inclined to think that Miller would've gotten the contract he has now on the open market, if not more. So with that said, I don't think he should be perceived as a pure cap dump in trade negotiations. He is an asset that should bring in some futures. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R3aL Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 (edited) 6 minutes ago, KoreanHockeyFan said: I'm wondering, is Miller's contract really that rich? I'm inclined to think that Miller would've gotten the contract he has now on the open market, if not more. So with that said, I don't think he should be perceived as a pure cap dump in trade negotiations. He is an asset that should bring in some futures. I don’t think it’s that steep considering what guys have been signing for and he’s basically a top 20 winger in the league that can cover C in a pinch and is a PWF / power play stud. it’s his age and term I think that’s the biggest problem. but unfortunately if we retain it has to be even across the current contract and extension I thought we could retain on the contract ending this year so I think that’s what complicates things the most looks like Pittsburg is a serious option though rn if he does get moved and with Crosby being 35 and maybe there last couple kicks at the can here for them it could make sense Edited February 28, 2023 by R3aL 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoreanHockeyFan Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 Just now, R3aL said: I don’t think it’s that steep considering what guys have been signing for and he’s basically a top 20 singer in the league that can cover C in a pinch and is a PWF / power play stud. it’s his age and term I think that’s the biggest problem. but unfortunately if we retain it has to be even across the current contract and extension I thought we could retain on the contract ending this year so I think that’s what complicates things the most looks like Pittsburg is a serious option though rn if he does get moved I agree, but isn't the term also what Miller would've fetched on the open market? NYI's contract for Horvat is more rich for more years, and this was signed when NYI had exclusive negotiating rights - not on the open market. The way I see it - in a world where Allvin didn't sign Miller to an extension, he was either going to get acquired as a rental or by a team that wanted him long term. I will certainly admit signing him in the summer was short-sighted and has ultimately narrowed down the amount of teams that are interested in him now, but for those teams that were always interested in having Miller for the long-run...the Canucks basically did the contract negotiating work for whoever potentially ends up acquiring Miller. TL;DR - if Miller ultimately gets acquired, you could kind of see the trade as a long-winded sign & trade... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandmaster Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 16 minutes ago, KoreanHockeyFan said: I'm wondering, is Miller's contract really that rich? I'm inclined to think that Miller would've gotten the contract he has now on the open market, if not more. So with that said, I don't think he should be perceived as a pure cap dump in trade negotiations. He is an asset that should bring in some futures. 100% If we were to trade him, I would expect no less than what we got for Bo. Even with a return like that though, I believe he is more valuable keeping for after this Re-tool and helping the development of this team. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boknows08 Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 PA likes POJ, maybe that’s part of the reason we dumped Stillman. To possibly make room for POJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoreanHockeyFan Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 1 minute ago, 6of1_halfdozenofother said: Management made an assumption that we were going to be entering our window of contending for not just the playoffs, but also for the Cup, so the signing of Miller to that extension was a reflection of the expected need of a player of his calibre for the window that we were expecting to see open this season (and continuing on for a number of seasons while he was still expected to be in his prime). Instead, we came out of the gate playing only marginally better than a freshly laid dog turd (and the dog turd probably had better consistency), so his new contract is now a poor fit for the expected timeline of our window of contention, since we need to "re-tool" by tearing out the excess/ill-fitting pieces and finding ones that better fit our timeline. Much like how a poster here has indicated how Myers is an ok D-man, just an ill-fitting one for our team, this contract for Miller is a good contract, but no longer meets the needs based on our expected timeline, since when we're ready to contend, he'll almost certainly be on the downslope of his production and his contract at that point (years from now) will turn into an anchor that we'd most likely need to pay to be rid of. So yes, there's still value in his extension now, and especially for a team that needs the kind of services he can provide while still in his prime who are entering their window of contention for the Cup, and consequently one would expect the return to be much better now than in a few years (and especially much better now at the TDL than during the offseason). I am in complete agreement with how Miller's extension does not fit the needs of our team now and will likely hamper the team's future cap-wise. There is absolutely zero pushback from me on that notion. All I am debating is the way his contract is perceived in trade negotiations by some people here. I don't think we should automatically assume trading Miller would require us to also add on other assets to "get rid" of his contract. He's an asset that should bring in future assets for the Canucks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86Viking Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 Pens G prospect Blomqvist might interest the Canucks as a potential return? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sxqhfeh Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 Owen Pickering 2023 1st Round Pick Do it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostsOf1994 Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 13 minutes ago, Boknows08 said: PA likes POJ, maybe that’s part of the reason we dumped Stillman. To possibly make room for POJ. link to article or quote please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustard Tiger Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 46 minutes ago, qwijibo said: You have to wait a full calendar year to trade a player back to the same team if you’ve retained. Thank you kind sir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kobayashi Maru Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 Miller for Kotkaniemi, Morrow and a 1st or Miller for Zucker, Pickering and a 1st Both work for me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted Lasso Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 34 minutes ago, grandmaster said: 100% If we were to trade him, I would expect no less than what we got for Bo. Even with a return like that though, I believe he is more valuable keeping for after this Re-tool and helping the development of this team. Agreed. Rutherford wants to make the playoffs next year, so the aggregate trade return / subsequent moves would need to improve the team immediately. Penguins prospect pool is worse than ours, and they won’t want to trade roster players. Probably why talks cooled off so quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoreanHockeyFan Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Kenny Powers said: Agreed. Rutherford wants to make the playoffs next year, so the aggregate trade return / subsequent moves would need to improve the team immediately. Penguins prospect pool is worse than ours, and they won’t want to trade roster players. Probably why talks cooled off so quickly. Pens still have most of their draft picks in tact. Hope Rutherford isn't hell bent on turning this team around so quickly and just snags a bunch of those picks. Besides, Bedard can easily replace Miller....right? Edited February 28, 2023 by KoreanHockeyFan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 Wouldn't mind adding Poulin, Ty Smith or Pickering to the prospect pool or possibly adding another 1st in 2024? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted Lasso Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 3 minutes ago, KoreanHockeyFan said: Pens still have most of their draft picks in tact. Hope Rutherford isn't hell bent on turning this team around so quickly and just snags a bunch of those picks. Besides, Bedard can easily replace Miller....right? Jokes aside, if the lottery is held In early May again, and we’re lucky enough to win first or second, a draft day JTM trade would be far more realistic than this TDL 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BureBurrito Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 What does Pittsburgh have we'd even want? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted Lasso Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 Just now, BureBurrito said: What does Pittsburgh have we'd even want? Their prospect pool is depressing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boknows08 Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 41 minutes ago, GhostsOf1994 said: link to article or quote please? It was mentioned few weeks back. Can’t remember which thread. Don’t think there was an article attached. Just another member mentioning it. Same goes for Hallander as well actually. I can be quite gullible at times though lol. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostsOf1994 Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 Just now, Boknows08 said: It was mentioned few weeks back. Can’t remember which thread. Don’t think there was an article attached. Just another member mentioning it. Same goes for Hallander as well actually. I can be quite gullible at times though lol. No worries at all, there's too much incorrect information out there with NHL rumors. You owned it and can laugh about it, cheers! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicklas Bo Hunter Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 To van: Marcus Pettersson+ 1st round pick+ Owen Pickering To Pit: Jt Miller+ Luke Schenn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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