[Article] 31 Thoughts - Canucks edit

[iceman64]

12 hours ago, Devron44 said:

Pretty sure Benning took calls on Stecher, didn’t “shop” him

 At least that what I made out of the post deadline interview.

People take this stuff to seriously sometimes

That's par for the course on the forum for the most part... (Not everyone though) Even if it's not true...

[iceman64]

4 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

I agree.  The perfect partner for Quinn.  What will it take to get him?

 

Put Train with him...

[Kushman]

11 hours ago, PhillipBlunt said:

If Tanev decides to not re-sign with Vancouver, Benning will be sure to grab a right handed defenseman either through trade or free agency that will compliment Hughes as well or better than Tanev has. It wouldn't hurt to give Quinn a fairly aggressive d-partner who'll punish douches like Domi for taking liberties.

 

When Quinn was slammed to the ice by Domi, watching Tanev skate away wasn't good from an optics point of view.

I was sad to see Luke schenn go.

[Devron]

3 minutes ago, Kushman said:

I was sad to see Luke schenn go.

Although probably not a regular anymore. I would have loved to keep him for depth. Mans a legend in my book

[Grape]

1 hour ago, stawns said:

I say OJ and Rafferty are definitely ahead of him and Lind probably pushed himself into that higher category this year too.

Hmm... I would disagree. Rafferty, as great as he is playing, is a 24 year old guy alongside really good offensive teammates. Tyler Madden is a 1.4 PPG sophomore who is the best player on a really good college team.

 

I found three recent prospect rankings.

 

-Madden was one of the three Canucks TSN's top 40 prospects; Rafferty was in the top 50, so it's definitely close.

-Madden was third in The Hockey Writers' rankings, Rafferty was 8th and Juolevi was 5th.

-Madden was third in the Athletic, and Juolevi was 4th. Don't think Rafferty was considered as a prospect here.

 

The only guy that I would have considered close to Madden is a guy you didn't mention - Jack Rathbone, who is averaging over a PPG as a defenseman and is also 20.

 

I think you might be undervaluing the competitiveness of college hockey. The level of play in the competitive conferences is closer to the AHL than to the CHL. AHL >> NCAA >>> CHL. Somehow college is still being undervalued, despite most of our direct products all being from the pipeline. Within the last decade, If I can think correctly:

 

College guys: Tanev, Stecher, Demko, Boeser, Gaudette, Hughes

Elsewhere: Bo, Jake, Petey (all lottery picks so it's not a surprise they panned out)

 

It's like as soon as the aforementioned guys leave college, people started to see their value. Same thing can be said with Rafferty! I think it might have to do with college not getting as much publicity? Anyway, since Schroeder, all of our high end college guys have done well, while a few low end guys have made it too.

 

Wow I went off topic

Edited February 27, 2020 by Grape

[GhostsOf1994]

12 hours ago, PhillipBlunt said:

If Tanev decides to not re-sign with Vancouver, Benning will be sure to grab a right handed defenseman either through trade or free agency that will compliment Hughes as well or better than Tanev has. It wouldn't hurt to give Quinn a fairly aggressive d-partner who'll punish douches like Domi for taking liberties.

 

When Quinn was slammed to the ice by Domi, watching Tanev skate away wasn't good from an optics point of view.

Domi is just like his daddy.

 

See Domi sucker Ekblad? 

Tie domi vs samuelsson 2.0.

 

Where did max learn that behaviour? His daddy!

 

Tanev did right by skating away.

 

The best punishment for domi is knowing that as long as he is a Montreal canadiens player he will NEVER win a cup.

[Outsiders]

12 hours ago, PhillipBlunt said:

If Tanev decides to not re-sign with Vancouver, Benning will be sure to grab a right handed defenseman either through trade or free agency that will compliment Hughes as well or better than Tanev has. It wouldn't hurt to give Quinn a fairly aggressive d-partner who'll punish douches like Domi for taking liberties.

 

When Quinn was slammed to the ice by Domi, watching Tanev skate away wasn't good from an optics point of view.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[iceman64]

30 minutes ago, Grape said:

Hmm... I would disagree. Rafferty, as great as he is playing, is a 24 year old guy alongside really good offensive teammates. Tyler Madden is a 1.4 PPG sophomore who is the best player on a really good college team.

 

I found three recent prospect rankings.

 

-Madden was one of the three Canucks TSN's top 40 prospects; Rafferty was in the top 50, so it's definitely close.

-Madden was third in The Hockey Writers' rankings, Rafferty was 8th and Juolevi was 5th.

-Madden was third in the Athletic, and Juolevi was 4th. Don't think Rafferty was considered as a prospect here.

 

The only guy that I would have considered close to Madden is a guy you didn't mention - Jack Rathbone, who is averaging over a PPG as a defenseman and is also 20.

 

I think you might be undervaluing the competitiveness of college hockey. The level of play in the competitive conferences is closer to the AHL than to the CHL. AHL >> NCAA >>> CHL. Somehow college is still being undervalued, despite most of our direct products all being from the pipeline. Within the last decade, If I can think correctly:

 

College guys: Tanev, Stecher, Demko, Boeser, Gaudette, Hughes

Elsewhere: Bo, Jake, Petey (all lottery picks so it's not a surprise they panned out)

 

It's like as soon as the aforementioned guys leave college, people started to see their value. Same thing can be said with Rafferty! I think it might have to do with college not getting as much publicity?

Nah Rafferty looks amazing and it's got zero to do with who he's playing with, natural ability including great vision and finding open ice, plus we hardly have a dire need for another forward.. have a look at Raff's highlights and you'll see what I mean.. 

Edited February 27, 2020 by iceman64

[iceman64]

13 minutes ago, Outsiders said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

I miss the giant who can level guys with not a lot of effort..  not a lot of guys who have that kind of size who can skate that well with a wingspan that would make an albatross jealous.. can't wait to have him back, wish we had him when Buffy destroyed us almost single handedly and we had no answer for someone that big, hence why Jimbo went after big guys like Myers knowing the playoffs get rough and then size truly matters and especially those who can skate..

 C'mon Jimbo, get Train back here!

[kloubek]

My thoughts on the ramblings:

 

Pettersson will be fine. He is slippery to some degree, is strong on his skates for his size, and has a frame that should see him top out at around 190-195 with extra muscle. Once that happens, he will be hard to get off the puck.

 

Madden looks to be a really good prospect, and I wouldn't be too worried about his size. 5'11 isn't that bad of a height so he should fill out significantly. He's just a boy ffs. In a league that is transitioning to skill over size, he will be fine - especially considering he hasn't exactly show fear so far against much larger competition. My only concern with him was for potential injury until he got bigger. Now that's LA's problem, but I truly think he could end up a solid 2nd line center. With that said, we got a solid 2nd line (now 1st line) guy in return at a critical time, so I think we did very well. We know what we have with TT so there is limited risk. Much less risk than keeping Madden, who didn't really have a spot he could have taken on the team anyway given our depth in that position.

 

Stecher: I was prepared to see him go, but I am glad to see him stay. He bleeds blue and green and it would be a shame to see him traded. He has actually played much better lately - something I can only figure is due to the newfound realization he is expendable. With that said, I would be surprised to see us keeping him. Even with a discount (which I am sure he would entertain) he just doesn't play a strong enough role we could get with an alternative. Plus his size is clearly not ideal for the kind of team Green and Benning want.

 

To finish out the season, I do want to see if we can get Tryamkin on board and put him on the left side - even if that isn't his preferred side. I think he would pair with Stecher nicely:

 

Edler Myers

Hughes Tanev

Tryamkin Stecher

Benn, Fantenberg

 

If Tryamkin works out I would actually like to see this going into next season and let training camp sort out if it sticks. 

[Patel Bure]

Stecher:  
 

One thing I do love about Stech, is his passion and commitment in wanting to win in Vancouver.   I was quite moved by his speech the other day on how it’s his dream to win a cup for us, and how it’s been like that since he grew up in Richmond.

 

Now having said that, my concern is that Stecher will have arbitration rights this summer........and he’s also spent a lot of time on the first pair with Edler (being carried by Edler, but the arbitrator won’t give a flying monkey fart about that).   
 

If the Canucks commit to Stecher, the price will likely be higher than what we want.   The presence of Stecher would also like spell the end of Brogan Rafferty as a Canuck (Myers and one of Tanev or Barrie will be the other guy on our right side D.......likely Tanev if the Canucks commit to the more expensive Stecher as we likely wouldn’t have money for Barrie).    We would probably have to use Rafferty as a sweetener to get rid of a bad contract if we commit to Stecher.

 

2020-2021
Edler-Stecher

Hughes-Tanev

Tryamkin-Myers

 

2021-2022

Hughes-Tanev

Tryamkin-Stecher

[Rathbone/Juolevi]-Myers

Edited February 27, 2020 by DarkIndianRises

[iceman64]

1 hour ago, DarkIndianRises said:

Stecher:  
 

One thing I do love about Stech, is his passion and commitment in wanting to win in Vancouver.   I was quite moved by his speech the other day on how it’s his dream to win a cup for us, and how it’s been like that since he grew up in Richmond.

 

Now having said that, my concern is that Stecher will have arbitration rights this summer........and he’s also spent a lot of time on the first pair with Edler (being carried by Edler, but the arbitrator won’t give a flying monkey fart about that).   
 

If the Canucks commit to Stecher, the price will likely be higher than what we want.   The presence of Stecher would also like spell the end of Brogan Rafferty as a Canuck (Myers and one of Tanev or Barrie will be the other guy on our right side D.......likely Tanev if the Canucks commit to the more expensive Stecher as we likely wouldn’t have money for Barrie).    We would probably have to use Rafferty as a sweetener to get rid of a bad contract if we commit to Stecher.

 

2020-2021
Edler-Stecher

Hughes-Tanev

Tryamkin-Myers

 

2021-2022

Hughes-Tanev

Tryamkin-Stecher

[Rathbone/Juolevi]-Myers

If you watch the latest Benning interview, JB clearly stated that he wants to give chances to our best farm guys, if Raff makes it, it will be stech gone.

 If your JB and you watch guys like TT step in and gives the team a big lift, then your going to do whatever it takes to keep him even if it means you have to let another piece go and replace it with another that has a strong chance of making it even though it's a risk but can still work things if it doesn't.. 

 Whether that's Raff or Chatfield, could be anyone's guess but until we see where the cap goes, we will end up shedding some cap somehow.. 

Edited February 27, 2020 by iceman64

[c00kies]

18 hours ago, Westcoasting said:

I can't even remember the offers, what were they?

 

I can't remember exactly either, but I think it was a late round pick or something from Dallas.

[BigTramFan]

14 hours ago, aGENT said:

Parayko? 

 

Probably Boeser. 

 

P.S. I would LOVE Parayko.

The Blues have some decisions to make and RD is one of them. Pietrangelo, Faulk and Parayko are a formidable right side, but can the Blues afford to spend around $22m for 3 x RD? I say no.

 

They will want to resign Pietrangelo and that will cost them around $10m+. They have to move out some contracts to afford Piet.

 

They have just resigned Faulk to a $6.5m x 7 year deal. So I think, as long as they can get the Piet deal done, Parayko is on his way out of STL.

 

My sense is that Parayko is available for the right price.

 

However, the Blues will be looking for a high value, low cost return on Parayko. I don't think that is Boeser. I can't think of a package that would be attractive enough to STL to get a deal done.

 

There are other teams better placed to take on Parayko's cap plus another cap dump (e.g. Bozak) in return for some top ELC performers, high end prospects, or picks.

[aGENT]

1 hour ago, BigTramFan said:

The Blues have some decisions to make and RD is one of them. Pietrangelo, Faulk and Parayko are a formidable right side, but can the Blues afford to spend around $22m for 3 x RD? I say no.

 

They will want to resign Pietrangelo and that will cost them around $10m+. They have to move out some contracts to afford Piet.

 

They have just resigned Faulk to a $6.5m x 7 year deal. So I think, as long as they can get the Piet deal done, Parayko is on his way out of STL.

 

My sense is that Parayko is available for the right price.

 

However, the Blues will be looking for a high value, low cost return on Parayko. I don't think that is Boeser. I can't think of a package that would be attractive enough to STL to get a deal done.

 

There are other teams better placed to take on Parayko's cap plus another cap dump (e.g. Bozak) in return for some top ELC performers, high end prospects, or picks.

It's a fair point. We could also look at something like Virtanen, Stecher and a prospect.

 

Pietra, Faulk and Stecher would still be a pretty damn good right side, Virtanen offers them some young, speedy size to play on their 3rd line and would fit their play style like a glove (though I'd hate playing them even more with him there...).

 

I'd hate to give those guys up but Parayko's don't grow on trees either. It's a tough call.

Edited February 27, 2020 by aGENT

[Devron]

19 hours ago, Crabcakes said:

Tanev is wearing shin guards that were specially designed for him.  They seem to be working.

 

Other than that, perhaps it's luck that he hasn't taken a puck in the yap or hand so far this year

Little less of a load this year as well. I think having Myers is one of the best things to happen for Tanev

[oldnews]

Stecher is a gamer.  Glad he's still here.  Hope he re-signs here. 

Renting Barrie... not something I'd have done.  Hope Benning fully messed with them.

Toronto ran his value down and then tried to sell high.... laughable.   Well done.  

[mll]

17 hours ago, BigTramFan said:

The Blues have some decisions to make and RD is one of them. Pietrangelo, Faulk and Parayko are a formidable right side, but can the Blues afford to spend around $22m for 3 x RD? I say no.

 

They will want to resign Pietrangelo and that will cost them around $10m+. They have to move out some contracts to afford Piet.

 

They have just resigned Faulk to a $6.5m x 7 year deal. So I think, as long as they can get the Piet deal done, Parayko is on his way out of STL.

 

My sense is that Parayko is available for the right price.

 

However, the Blues will be looking for a high value, low cost return on Parayko. I don't think that is Boeser. I can't think of a package that would be attractive enough to STL to get a deal done.

 

There are other teams better placed to take on Parayko's cap plus another cap dump (e.g. Bozak) in return for some top ELC performers, high end prospects, or picks.

 

It's more likely Pietrangelo that they let walk.  He can likely get a fair bit more on the market vs what the Blues are willing to pay him.

 

GM Armstrong listed cap efficiency as one of the 5 reasons the Blues finally won the Cup.  

 

He told LeBrun in the Athletic:  "We believe we have depth up front and depth on the back end. We have a lot of wealthy players but maybe no really rich players? And that’s the way we believe we can stay competitive in this market. I look at a team that I view that has been good for a number of years in Boston. They have their top players that have bought into an organizational outlook and quite honestly, we have too."

 

[aGENT]

Unfortunately (as I'd love to add Parayko), I have to agree with @mll here. The older Pietrangelo is far more likely to sign at a discount, or walk.

[Bissurnette]

On 2/26/2020 at 9:21 PM, Grape said:

We had 2 prospects ahead of him on the depth chart. Pod and Hog. Who else was ahead of him? Madden was a stud and you wouldn't say any of that if he was still here.

 

Also, I'm sure Madden was on the list of no trade prospects - for Barrie. The Madden trade was made for Toffoli, who is of significantly higher value which is why we are fine with it.

3 very young centers who are all well above the 0.5ppg mark. Madden didn't have any room on this roster. Pod and Hog are taking winger spots, and JB saw him as a winger because let's face it there aren't too many 150lb centers in the NHL. I'm just seeing he's probably an NHLer but his projected ceiling is probably a very undersized middle 6 winger. Useful, but nothing irreplaceable. That's why I'm happy with the trade. Toffoli is a gamer, and he doesn't disappear in the playoffs.