DeNiro Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 3 minutes ago, hammertime said: As long as were living in hindsight. What if we passed on consensus BPA Virtanen local born PF the likes of which this team and fan base was/is screaming for and he went on to have success somewhere else and we were stuk with puny Ehlers getting pushed around everywhere looking like Mason Raymond. You never know how things are gonna play out. We drafted the guy that fit our biggest need at the time. Virtanen was never the consensus BPA at the time though, not even close. Any GM who has been watching the trend in the NHL would know that with Ehlers speed and hockey IQ he was going to excel in the NHL. They took a gamble on Virtanen because they thought they could shape him into the next Jamie Benn type. There's a reason why those players are so rare though. We didn't draft the guy that fit our biggest need with that pick. Our biggest need with that pick should have been scoring. We've been lacking that just as much as size and toughness. Any GM who is half decent at drafting can address size and toughness in later rounds anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saucypass Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 9 minutes ago, hammertime said: As long as were living in hindsight. What if we passed on consensus BPA Virtanen local born PF the likes of which this team and fan base was/is screaming for and he went on to have success somewhere else and we were stuk with puny Ehlers getting pushed around everywhere looking like Mason Raymond. You never know how things are gonna play out. We drafted the guy that fit our biggest need at the time. I second what @DeNiro said in response to this. If you took the scout's rankings, the 3 forwards that went after him were projected to go after him by a ratio of 9:3 (Ehlers and Nylander) and 8:4 (Ritchie). Some scouts had Jake outside the top ten and I believe one of them didn't even have him in the first round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Just now, DeNiro said: Hansen is a great player, I already said that. You can't be happy taking a player with a career high 39 points 6th overall though. I could care less what the historical 6th overall picks did. Sean Monahan scored 30 goals in his second season and was drafted 6th overall a year before Virtanen. Benning is supposed to be a master scout and he passed on two players that would currently be leading our team in points. That can't be ignored. Sure it can. Tkachuck was clearly closer to making the NHL, that doesn't make him the better player in the long run. Virtanen was, as you said, always projected to a project and be less of a scorer but bring other facets. So let's give him the time to be that project. That's all I'm saying. Short of generational 1st overall players you can also always find players drafted after other players who outperform them. It's not an exact science and it doesn't make the other picks 'bad' either. 6 minutes ago, DeNiro said: We didn't draft the guy that fit our biggest need with that pick. Our biggest need with that pick should have been scoring. We've been lacking that just as much as size and toughness. Any GM who is half decent at drafting can address size and toughness in later rounds anyways. If we were drafting biggest need, we probably should have nabbed Sanheim with our 6th then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saucypass Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 8 minutes ago, Silky mitts said: The problem i had with the pick also at the time is you never saw elite potential in jake , a potential very good player but not elite potential which nylander and ehlers had displayed at the time of the draft , not just in regards to this season. It's true. His projection was based purely on taking it to the next level. Otherwise he wouldn't even be in discussion for the top 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saucypass Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Easiest way to put it, would you trade a 6th overall pick for Jannik Hansen? Would any GM? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ihatetomatoes Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 24 minutes ago, J.R. said: A Hansen with size who can physically intimidate teams I'll take on my team any day, thanks. Expecting anything closely related to Hansen out of Virtanen is about as realistic as expecting Subban to turn into a Tanev type guy. Hansen is probably one of the most hard working guys in the entire league, Virtanen is probably one of the laziest players I've ever seen. For a guy with such amazing wheels and size he floats like he's playing beer league hockey. Sure he had that one game where we all got excited but from all accounts he's gone back to floating around again. Sure he may do a complete 180 and start having a work ethic like Hansen but Subban might all of a sudden learn how to play defense like Tanev as well. Chances is that's not going to happen. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 1 minute ago, suitup said: Easiest way to put it, would you trade a 6th overall pick for Jannik Hansen? Would any GM? Would any GM trade a coming sixth over all pick for Virtanen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saucypass Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Just now, Alflives said: Would any GM trade a coming sixth over all pick for Virtanen? Maybe if they wanted to lose their job lol. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Just now, suitup said: Maybe if they wanted to lose their job lol. I wonder if that Virtanen pick might (eventually) cost JB his job? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilduce39 Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 45 minutes ago, guntrix said: See, this is why hand wringing happens. I don't understand how one can presume Virtanen as a potentially "physically dominant, 2-way winger who can pound opposing defence on the forecheck and score clutch goals with elite speed and a great shot" when he can't even hold his own in the AHL at 20 years old. Heck, considering his play this season, I'm doubtful he'd even be competent in the ECHL. Yes, development happens. But what some posters are expecting is unrealistic, especially when it's been proven time and again that late blooming power forwards like Doan and Bertuzzi had shown glimpses of elite ability early in their careers. You guys are hoping for a Hail Mary that not even Tom Brady can throw. Except, he's shown as a physical, 2-way winger at the NHL level last year post WJC. He also undeniably possesses great speed and an above average shot. I'm just forecasting the clutch goals. Nobody is saying he's a guarantee - but the tools are there and he's finally being given the message of how to put it all together. He's shed weight and he's throwing the puck on net in Utica with an unsustainably low shooting percentage. Give him an off-season to see if it clicks. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 4 minutes ago, Alflives said: Would any GM trade a coming sixth over all pick for Virtanen? And then ask what a team would be willing to give up to acquire Ehlers right now. It's okay to be against the selection but still root for Virtanen. What's done is done. I only hope they don't fall into the same trap next time they get a high pick (next draft?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny in Vancouver Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 17 minutes ago, Alflives said: Would any GM trade a coming sixth over all pick for Virtanen? I'd be curious to see you asking this same question 2 years from now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saucypass Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 11 minutes ago, Alflives said: I wonder if that Virtanen pick might (eventually) cost JB his job? Nope. If he gets fired it won't be because he fanned on a pick (albeit a high profile pick). When it comes to firing a GM it's typically because of how the team itself is doing and the direction of where the GM is steering the ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 6 minutes ago, suitup said: Nope. If he gets fired it won't be because he fanned on a pick (albeit a high profile pick). When it comes to firing a GM it's typically because of how the team itself is doing and the direction of where the GM is steering the ship. As Gillis showed though, you miss on too many drafts and you won't be able to fill the team with enough talent to compete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b3. Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 @DeNiro it's not like Ehlers is top 20 in league scoring right now or anything. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, ilduce39 said: Except, he's shown as a physical, 2-way winger at the NHL level last year post WJC. He also undeniably possesses great speed and an above average shot. I'm just forecasting the clutch goals. Nobody is saying he's a guarantee - but the tools are there and he's finally being given the message of how to put it all together. He's shed weight and he's throwing the puck on net in Utica with an unsustainably low shooting percentage. Give him an off-season to see if it clicks. Preaching patience = Homer. Not like we have any choice anyway, unless one of these guys had a time machine. In which case I hope we draft Sanheim instead and watch CDC really freak out! Edited February 8, 2017 by J.R. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilduce39 Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 1 minute ago, J.R. said: Preaching patience = Homer. Not like we have any choice anyway, unless one of these guys had a time machine. In which case I hope we draft Sanheim instead and watch CDC really freak out! Cheers that kool aid JR! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snizzle_ Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 I watched the Utica game tonight against the Marlies, and because of the praise Green gave Virtanen after the Penguins game last week, I thought I was going to see a different Jake all together. To my disappointment I saw the same things that plagued him in Vancouver to star the season. While it was just one game, I just wanted to see some type of salvation that would in still some confidence in me that he'll find his way. He still looks lost. Now, a lot of it isn't his fault. The Canucks have been trying to make the playoffs all year, and in doing so, they've stripped Utica of many players who should be the Veteran drivers of that Comets team. Guys like Megna, Chaput and Skille should be in the minors insulating our picks, but they're up here while the Comets are one of the lowest scoring teams in the AHL. However, Virtanen is not off the hook, because he doesn't look to be doing his part (at least not tonight). He took those quick shifts where he would change on the backcheck and still looks a little disengaged. The biggest issue I had with him tonight was his boardplay, something that management has been trying to work with him for awhile. He loses way too any puck battles for his size and speed, it's very frustrating to watch. He's now on the first PP unit, sometimes hovering around that left side one-timer spot, but he's never in position or reading the play well enough to get open... He's on the powerplay and he can't get open... I'll be watching more Utica games in the future, so hopefully this one is just a one-off, but considering his very poor production in the minors, it could be exactly where he is. For those who want to watch games as well, I found a really good link to watch most games: http://onhockey.tv/ 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckledraggin Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 3 hours ago, The 5th Line said: Tkatchuk, Monahan, H. Lindholm, Zibanejd, Ekman-Larsson in recent years. Two of which went to our biggest rival I'll take one of them. 2014 was a decent draft and we could of picked a gem Could have. The conjunction could've sounds like could of and many people make this common grammatical error. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 2 hours ago, Alflives said: I wonder if that Virtanen pick might (eventually) cost JB his job? Get the f**k over it No it won't. Why? Because Demko Tryamkin Stewart and Pettit will save that draft. Ironically while everyone is whining about Virtanen those other 4 picks have all the showings of solid nhl players Might be time to just get the hell over it and ease off Virtanen because the other 4 look pretty damned good in comparator their draft positions Or...sit and whine about Virtanen for the next 2 decades like this fan base always does 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now