Warhippy Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 I ask yet again the following two questions 1. Does anyone really think that Johansen has value knowing all of this, at least the value some are proposing? IN the ball park of multiple players blue chips and or picks? 2. Does anyone really see Johansen staying in Columbus as a UFA now? GM's around the league are as articles noted, paying very close attention as are other players and draft picks. As stated it looks like he is terming himself via contract length or at least pricing himself right out of Columbus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Money Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 I ask yet again the following two questions 1. Does anyone really think that Johansen has value knowing all of this, at least the value some are proposing? IN the ball park of multiple players blue chips and or picks? 2. Does anyone really see Johansen staying in Columbus as a UFA now? GM's around the league are as articles noted, paying very close attention as are other players and draft picks. As stated it looks like he is terming himself via contract length or at least pricing himself right out of Columbus. This situation is remarkably similar to when Phil Kessel and the Bruins couldn't reach a deal. Both former 4th overalls too. Kessel had performed better for longer, but did not (and never will) have the coveted size and defensive ability RJ does. Kessel went for two 1st rounders and a 2nd. Now, nobody thought that one of them would be #2 overall, but given the previous performance of the Leafs it was likely they would still be a non-playoff team, and that the picks would be somewhere in the 5-15 (and 35-45) range. Not only that, but the other part of the Kessel deal was that the Bruins took zero dollars in cap space back. For a cap spending team, this is an important facet. That no doubt lowered the price for Kessel in terms of pure asset value. (Just like when we were willing to take Ehrhoff off SJ's hands, and when Tampa took Garrison off of ours - shedding cap dollars was part of the return.) And lastly, given the make-up of the Bruins and Kessel's skillset, Phil was merely a complimentary piece to an already skilled core. But RJ is definitely the centerpiece of the BJ's going forward. So all things considered, if you want to come up with a package that could pry Johansen out of Columbus, start with two high 1st rounders and a 2nd, and start adding to it. If that is too much, well then, you can't afford him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magikal Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 It's not going to happen but if Benning could find a way to get rights to RJo from Columbus I would gladly see up sign him for 4-5M per. He is a local kid with a special set of talents and size. I understand where the Bluejackets are coming from but this is the kind fo player that can push Vancouver back into serious contenders and would be the ideal replacement for when the Sedins start to decline heavily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salmonberries Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 4.7 does seem very reasonable for that player. Davidson comes across as a bit of a douche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Kneel Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 gimmegimmegimme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuxfanabroad Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 This situation is remarkably similar to when Phil Kessel and the Bruins couldn't reach a deal. Both former 4th overalls too. Kessel had performed better for longer, but did not (and never will) have the coveted size and defensive ability RJ does. Kessel went for two 1st rounders and a 2nd. Now, nobody thought that one of them would be #2 overall, but given the previous performance of the Leafs it was likely they would still be a non-playoff team, and that the picks would be somewhere in the 5-15 (and 35-45) range. Not only that, but the other part of the Kessel deal was that the Bruins took zero dollars in cap space back. For a cap spending team, this is an important facet. That no doubt lowered the price for Kessel in terms of pure asset value. (Just like when we were willing to take Ehrhoff off SJ's hands, and when Tampa took Garrison off of ours - shedding cap dollars was part of the return.) And lastly, given the make-up of the Bruins and Kessel's skillset, Phil was merely a complimentary piece to an already skilled core. But RJ is definitely the centerpiece of the BJ's going forward. So all things considered, if you want to come up with a package that could pry Johansen out of Columbus, start with two high 1st rounders and a 2nd, and start adding to it. If that is too much, well then, you can't afford him. Interesting comparison here. Completely different players, yet the situations certainly are worth analysis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis15 Posted September 25, 2014 Author Share Posted September 25, 2014 And here's where I get extra confused by CBJ's motivations: Mike Halford @HalfordPHT 4m Jackets say Horton has ‘degenerative’ back problem, no timetable for return http://wp.me/p14QU5-9Po2 They signed Horton to a 7 year, $37.1M contract knowing he would need extensive time to recover from shoulder surgery. $5.3M per year for Horton would be pretty decent if he were healthy, but with all the risk in his recovery the first year and now with his back (considering he only played 35 games starting in January last season and is out again right now with an unknown timetable) that certainly brought the price down. Then to tell your 1st line center, leading goal scorer and points getter, who played the toughest minutes often starting outside the offensive zone - all mostly without the 1st line winger they signed to help him - that they'll only offer $3M per year for two years is a bit of a slap in the face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Money Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 /\ Difference #1 is Horton has proven year after year to be a solid player. RJ has overcome questions of laziness for just the one season...a contract year at that. Difference #2 is Horton was a UFA that had to be convinced to sign in Columbus. Johansen as an RFA is still at his team's mercy. I see Columbus wanting to handle this like Montreal did with PK Subban. In the long run it cost Montreal more money. With the cap no doubt going up further in the next year or two, and Johansen continuing to build a body of work, the price on his next deal is only going to go up. But I guess those questions of laziness and motivation are still hanging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis15 Posted September 25, 2014 Author Share Posted September 25, 2014 But my point is just that. Just like there were questions about Horton's health prior to signing the contract there are questions right now about Johansen being able to repeat or better last year's stats. The difference there is CBJ was happy to offer Horton a deal and commit longer term as a UFA that had no connection to their team despite those worries yet they won't offer something more generous than $3M per year on a 2 year deal for a top draft pick and young star they've taken time to develop and market to fans. There's something for that side of the argument as well, since we're seeing Horton still struggling with injury as the gun for hire UFA while the prospect who made it big isn't getting the time of day. I've said many times in this thread and others I hate how the lockout seemingly had no effect and the contracts being handed out now are more than they reasonably should be for the top end players (and even a lot of the middle tier players), but that's the reality currently and Johansen has a right to bargain in that range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis15 Posted September 26, 2014 Author Share Posted September 26, 2014 Ken Campbell @THNKenCampbell 1h Spoke with Clbs GM J Kekalainen. Asked if anything to report on Johansen situation. "Absolutely nothing." Haven't spoken, no talks planned. Cutting it close... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 Cutting it close... Come on CBJ, just trade him to us.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theminister Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 Come on CBJ, just trade him to us.... How about Bonino, Hansen, Stanton, 1st for Johansen and Erixon? RJ for 5 @ $5.5 mil Sedins-Vrbata Burrows-RJ-Jensen Higgins-Horvat-Kassian Matthias-Richie-Dorsett Sestito-Archie Hammer-Bieksa Edler-Tanev Sbisa-Erixon Weber Miller Lack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHitman Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 How about Bonino, Hansen, Stanton, 1st for Johansen and Erixon? RJ for 5 @ $5.5 mil Sedins-Vrbata Burrows-RJ-Jensen Higgins-Horvat-Kassian Matthias-Richie-Dorsett Sestito-Archie Hammer-Bieksa Edler-Tanev Sbisa-Erixon Weber Miller Lack I don't think CBJ takes that deal. How great would a Shinkaruk-Johansen-Kassian line be though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renelsisc Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 Can we just throw an offer sheet at him for $5.5? That would firmly seal this non sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William_Clarkson Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 Can we just throw an offer sheet at him for $5.5? That would firmly seal this non sense. No because the Canucks don't have the cap space or all the picks required for a $5.5M offer sheet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis15 Posted September 27, 2014 Author Share Posted September 27, 2014 How about Bonino, Hansen, Stanton, 1st for Johansen and Erixon? RJ for 5 @ $5.5 mil Sedins-Vrbata Burrows-RJ-Jensen Higgins-Horvat-Kassian Matthias-Richie-Dorsett Sestito-Archie Hammer-Bieksa Edler-Tanev Sbisa-Erixon Weber Miller Lack Bonino would pretty much have to be involved as an NHL ready player to replace (at least partially) what Johansen brings for CBJ. Whether the rest suits what they want I don't know, but I'd wonder if they couldn't get something better. I know warhippy talks about his trade value right now, but unless we're the only team offering that'll bring the price back up in a hurry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 Bonino would pretty much have to be involved as an NHL ready player to replace (at least partially) what Johansen brings for CBJ. Whether the rest suits what they want I don't know, but I'd wonder if they couldn't get something better. I know warhippy talks about his trade value right now, but unless we're the only team offering that'll bring the price back up in a hurry. Hey you're right. And I have stated numerous times that if he was available 24 other teams could outbid us in a moment. He's a valuable commodity and a solid player not even close to reaching his potential. But again, his value at this time is not what it could have or would have been. It's gonna be close to or comparable to Turris I would think. Either way, the only way we have a chance is via offer sheet and that only happens if we can regain our 3rd round pick back from Anaheim. Honestly, that is the only route i'd take to get him. Who cares if the offer sheet is so hated if we can obtain Johansen for 3 picks. Do it. Then we can concentrate on the season and stop worrying about the he said she said in columbus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis15 Posted September 27, 2014 Author Share Posted September 27, 2014 Technically the Canucks can concentrate on the season at any point. We, on the other hand, might be a bit distracted... An offer sheet is a very low possibility though. We'd have to get that pick back and also make cap space, then there's the slim to none chance Columbus doesn't match. Do we want to move away pieces to get that cap space that are here and want to play now, just to find we don't get Johansen anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pears Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 Technically the Canucks can concentrate on the season at any point. We, on the other hand, might be a bit distracted... An offer sheet is a very low possibility though. We'd have to get that pick back and also make cap space, then there's the slim to none chance Columbus doesn't match. Do we want to move away pieces to get that cap space that are here and want to play now, just to find we don't get Johansen anyway? Well the most logical way (if it'll work) is offer a future pick (2016 2nd), or a combo of 2015 or 2016 picks not including a 1st, sign Johansen to an offer sheet, then see if we get him or not. That way if we do get him we'll know who we have to move to make room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuxfanabroad Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 At this point, I'd say we should stay back from this publicity car wreck. If we could have engineered a deal, early summer-woulda' been dandy . Now I sense the US media will be itching for this guy to fail, especially if he were playing lights-out in his hometown. The league really wants to control this 'bridge-thing'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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