PhillipBlunt Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 Just now, NewbieCanuckFan said: That should've been the first thing that was done. Well, yes. Drafting is truly key to maintaining a competitive team. There was a age gap that was pretty noticeable though, and that Benning addressed pretty adequately, especially on defense. While hearing him say that he won't attempt to trade any of the vets irks me, his statement about keeping all his picks, and possibly acquiring more, is music to the ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewbieCanuckFan Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 Just now, PhillipBlunt said: Well, yes. Drafting is truly key to maintaining a competitive team. There was a age gap that was pretty noticeable though, and that Benning addressed pretty adequately, especially on defense. Was there really that big an age gap on the blueline (no argument about forwards - bad drafting under Gillis really made this noticeable)? How old was Tanev & Hutton when Benning was hired? I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 20 minutes ago, NewbieCanuckFan said: That should've been the first thing that was done. disagree completely. The organization now has a staggered lineup that will have expensive expiring contracts, guys in their prime needing to be paid and young, entry level deals for players that can contribute. He has set the team up quite well for now and into the future. The Leafs and the Oilers will have to make some tough decisions when all their young stars are wanting a payday at the same time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 24 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said: Well, yes. Drafting is truly key to maintaining a competitive team. There was a age gap that was pretty noticeable though, and that Benning addressed pretty adequately, especially on defense. I don't really see this age gap. I've pointed it out before that we already had players in that exact same age range that we let walk away. And the high risk players we brought in haven't really provided more to this team in the now or future. On defense sure, but all JB has brought in on our current D core is Gudbranson and Guddy wasn't a reclamation project. Larsen, didn't work out, Clendening didn't work out, Pedan hasn't even been given opportunity to work out. He should stick to areas he's been good at, like drafting, Juolevi, Tryamkin, Neill, Brisebois and signing free agent like Stecher. I'm ok with other moves, just not in trading picks for reclamation projects that require waivers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 24 minutes ago, NewbieCanuckFan said: Was there really that big an age gap on the blueline (no argument about forwards - bad drafting under Gillis really made this noticeable)? How old was Tanev & Hutton when Benning was hired? I Hutton wasn't with the team in Benning's first year. When Benning took over, half the d-core was either near thirty or over - Bieksa, Hamhuis, and Edler, with Tanev, Weber, and ? (I have no idea who the sixth defenseman was). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewbieCanuckFan Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 11 minutes ago, stawns said: disagree completely. The organization now has a staggered lineup that will have expensive expiring contracts, guys in their prime needing to be paid and young, entry level deals for players that can contribute. He has set the team up quite well for now and into the future. The Leafs and the Oilers will have to make some tough decisions when all their young stars are wanting a payday at the same time IMHO, not enough of an attempt was made to acquire more picks (if for nothing else, to take advantage of the skills this management team does have). No excuse to be going to this upcoming draft with actually LESS picks than a team by default would have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 1 hour ago, PhillipBlunt said: Because Tortorella is a coach with experience. He knows what he's doing . Won a Stanley Cup with Tampa. Fact is, while it's fashionable to bash the coach (I should know) when the team isn't doing well, what is crystal clear about the situation here is that there have been three coaches now, that have been unable to get this team back into the postseason in a meaningful way. Vigneault is clearly a successful coach in how he has been able to New York maintain a consistency, and Tortorella is proving to be able to motivate a younger team like Columbus to a pretty favorable place in the standings. Maybe, just maybe, the leftovers from the previous core just aren't good enough anymore, and haven't really been since 2012. The team folded like a cheap suit against every playoff opponent they've faced since 2011, and that can't all come down to coincidence. What really can young players learn from delusions of grandeur? In my opinion, it would be a much better idea to part with the remaining members of the old core, with the exception of Hansen, and start acquiring the type of veteran players that can help support the young emerging core, rather than try to prop up a waning first line that can longer maintain a competitive edge over the course of an 82 game season. Totally agree. This was always going to be the problem with bringing TL in as PHO. He is too close to these guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 15 hours ago, NewbieCanuckFan said: Funny how the Blue Jackets are doing better under Torts (on he was on pace for a better record than us last season) than Willie is with the Canucks.... You need more hockey homework if you think both coaches took on the same type of team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 On 12/10/2016 at 5:20 PM, CanadianRugby said: You could have signed placeholders in free agency and kept your draft picks. Maybe we'd have Matthews or McDavid (plus more prospects by keeping picks) if we did that. What has Pedan & Baertschi done for this team. Team would be awful without them, it's awful with them and will continue to be awful unless we get way more quality forward prospects than Boeser. Yeah and maybe we would be at the beginning of 10 years of life in the hockey abyss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 7 minutes ago, alfstonker said: Totally agree. This was always going to be the problem with bringing TL in as PHO. He is too close to these guys. FWIW, both the Sedins and Linden would LOVE to have some players step up and take over 1st line duty. People seem to confuse not tearing everything down and rebuilding around them while they're still here as 'propping them up'. That's not what I see as happening here. I think all parties would far prefer the Sedins were the one's 'propping up' a new core as support players, not the other way around. It's a small but important distinction IMO. Patience, we're not quite there yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewbieCanuckFan Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 Just now, alfstonker said: You need more hockey homework if you think both coaches took on the same type of team. Perhaps...I just find it interesting (Blue Jackets must have been in some kind of a mess before Torts was hired to necessitate firing their previous coach). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 20 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said: Hutton wasn't with the team in Benning's first year. When Benning took over, half the d-core was either near thirty or over - Bieksa, Hamhuis, and Edler, with Tanev, Weber, and ? (I have no idea who the sixth defenseman was). Garrison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 3 minutes ago, alfstonker said: Totally agree. This was always going to be the problem with bringing TL in as PHO. He is too close to these guys. The situation is sticky in that regard. Trevor wants to honor the Sedins legacy with the Canucks, which is a good idea in theory. Let's face it, this team hasn't built up a very great legacy in it's 40+ years of existence. Look at the Ring of Honour and the 4 numbers hanging from the rafters, and it's obvious that the Canucks have spent half their existence as a competitive team, and the other half sucking wind. The Sedins have maintained a high level of play for the majority of their careers, which the team and organization should celebrate. It helps to build a legacy that can be added onto. Standard bearers like Luongo, Kesler, Bieksa, and Hamhuis are all gone, and only Burrows, Edler, and Hansen remain. Out of those three. Burrows is the only one who could honestly be considered a legend. That being said, there is hopefully a transitional action plan in place for roster turnover, as the Sedins are looking like father time hasn't just caught up, but is right in step with them now. To go into another season trying to pass them off as first line players is a mistake. They physically can't muster what first line players need to bring these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 1 minute ago, J.R. said: FWIW, both the Sedins and Linden would LOVE to have some players step up and take over 1st line duty. People seem to confuse not tearing everything down and rebuilding around them while they're still here as 'propping them up'. That's not what I see as happening here. I think all parties would far prefer the Sedins were the one's 'propping up a new core' as support players, not the other way around. It's a small but important distinction IMO. Well I'm ok with that for now but I do think you overestimate what they bring now. However I don't want their contracts renewed after this one. We need to move on even if it means a dip (which I actually doubt) I didn't think this way until this season but I am now wondering if their downside doesn't outweigh what they bring in skill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 3 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said: Garrison. No wonder I forgot....hahahaha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 2 minutes ago, alfstonker said: Well I'm ok with that for now but I do think you overestimate what they bring now. However I don't want their contracts renewed after this one. We need to move on even if it means a dip (which I actually doubt) I didn't think this way until this season but I am now wondering if their downside doesn't outweigh what they bring in skill. I don't think I'm underestimating anything. They'd be a capable offensive support line with either Hansen or Sutter on their wing to bring speed, forecheck etc to compliment them. Problem is, Horvat's the only young guy remotely ready or capable of supplanting them at this point. IMO, this is one of the biggest reasons Eriksson was also brought in. He can hopefully fill in one of those winger roles until Boeser (or another prospect) are ready to take it and then can slide down to the middle 6 as a capable winger there post-Sedin. It's also why I see Tanev+ going for a solid winger this summer. Next year, something like : 'Tanev winger', Horvat, Eriksson Sedin, Sedin, Hansen Granlund, Sutter, Boeser ???, Gaunce, Dorsett Then ideally we find a top 6 C with our first round pick this summer who can hopefully come in the following year or shortly thereafter to fill the post-Sedin top 6 hole. Though I suppose one of Granlund/Sutter might be able to fill in there in what would likely be another middling-poor season if there isn't a ready and capable prospect there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 4 minutes ago, J.R. said: I don't think I'm underestimating anything. They'd be a capable offensive support line with either Hansen or Sutter on their wing to bring speed, forecheck etc to compliment them. Problem is, Horvat's the only young guy remotely ready or capable of supplanting them at this point. IMO, this is one of the biggest reasons Eriksson was also brought in. He can hopefully fill in one of those winger roles until Boeser (or another prospect) are ready to take it and then can slide down to the middle 6 as a capable winger there post-Sedin. Nah...Eriksson was brought in because he's got the dankest bud, man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocksterh8 Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 1 minute ago, PhillipBlunt said: Nah...Eriksson was brought in because he's got the dankest bud, man. Ahhh where am I man..... ehhh peace man..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 31 minutes ago, alfstonker said: Yeah and maybe we would be at the beginning of 10 years of life in the hockey abyss. It's looking like the first 30 years of abyss. Sure there will be the odd up turns, but (UNLESS) we get two elite forwards to replace the Twins.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 15 minutes ago, J.R. said: I don't think I'm underestimating anything. They'd be a capable offensive support line with either Hansen or Sutter on their wing to bring speed, forecheck etc to compliment them. Problem is, Horvat's the only young guy remotely ready or capable of supplanting them at this point. IMO, this is one of the biggest reasons Eriksson was also brought in. He can hopefully fill in one of those winger roles until Boeser (or another prospect) are ready to take it and then can slide down to the middle 6 as a capable winger there post-Sedin. It's also why I see Tanev+ going for a solid winger this summer. Next year, something like : 'Tanev winger', Horvat, Eriksson Sedin, Sedin, Hansen Granlund, Sutter, Boeser ???, Gaunce, Dorsett Then ideally we find a top 6 C with our first round pick this summer who can hopefully come in the following year or shortly thereafter to fill the post-Sedin top 6 hole. Though I suppose one of Granlund/Sutter might be able to fill in there in what would likely be another middling-poor season if there isn't a ready and capable prospect there. Herchier and Patrick are both centres? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.