Coronavirus outbreak

[HKSR]

19 minutes ago, thedestroyerofworlds said:

We need to reopen, they said.  Kids will be ok, they said.   Maybe its not the kids who we should be worried about.   Teachers are important people too.

 

https://mississippitoday.org/2020/08/06/mississippi-teachers-death-during-first-week-of-school-stokes-covid-19-outbreak-fears/?fbclid=IwAR1q313YrEbBiMQU5y-UVPNljgDhOqOHROVO4BcSO6R52HImTauLStXVP4Y

 

 

Mississippi teacher’s death during first week of school stokes COVID-19 outbreak fears

 

 

Yeah, that's the part I don't fully understand about this.  So ok, the kids MIGHT be ok, but what about their parents and grandparents? 

 

So a cohort of 60 kids are within the 'school bubble', each of those kids has on average 2 parents and maybe 1 sibling.  So now that same bubble is 180 people. But wait, we already extended our bubbles to include a 2nd family.  Let's say that 2nd family only has 2 people.  Now all of a sudden, that 60 kid cohort is a 300 person bubble. 

ONE person gets infected, and now 300 people are potentially exposed.  This is only talking about an elementary cohort.

 

Same numbers for the 120 kid cohort in secondary schools?  It's a 600 person bubble.  If only 10 cases occur in any of the schools across the Province, that means the exposure could be between 3000 to 6000+ people.

 

These numbers go completely against what has been preached for months... to keep the bubbles small.

 

This decision screams prioritization of economy at the health risk of the adults in the education system.  This has nothing to do with the learning outcome of children. 

[stawns]

25 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Yeah, that's the part I don't fully understand about this.  So ok, the kids MIGHT be ok, but what about their parents and grandparents? 

 

So a cohort of 60 kids are within the 'school bubble', each of those kids has on average 2 parents and maybe 1 sibling.  So now that same bubble is 180 people. But wait, we already extended our bubbles to include a 2nd family.  Let's say that 2nd family only has 2 people.  Now all of a sudden, that 60 kid cohort is a 300 person bubble. 

ONE person gets infected, and now 300 people are potentially exposed.  This is only talking about an elementary cohort.

 

Same numbers for the 120 kid cohort in secondary schools?  It's a 600 person bubble.  If only 10 cases occur in any of the schools across the Province, that means the exposure could be between 3000 to 6000+ people.

 

These numbers go completely against what has been preached for months... to keep the bubbles small.

 

This decision screams prioritization of economy at the health risk of the adults in the education system.  This has nothing to do with the learning outcome of children. 

I don't know how it's going to shake out, but I am not feeling good about going back in September for the first time in my career.  Usually I lament the loss of summer, but that's offset with the excitement of a new school year, of seeing the kids again and the stretch from September to Xmas is so much fun in an elementary school.

 

This year it's uncertainty, definitely some fear, and anger that we are just jumping right back in to full time school.  I hate that this government has downloaded responsibilities to the district offices, who then download that to admin who then download that to teachers and we bear the brunt of figuring it out and take 100% of the risk while the bureaucrats sit safely in their offices.  We will have less than two weeks to get in and prep and plan for an unprecedented startup, one that is literally life threatening.

 

Cohorts of 60?  How is that enforceable?  Little Johnny and little Sam are best friends and live next door, but aren't in the same cohort.  At school they can't associate, but after school they hang out everyday.  Doesn't that compromise the premise of the cohort?  What about non-enrolling teachers (tl's, music, resource)?  They say the library will be a place that cohorts can be together........does that mean the teacher librarian is exposed to every cohort?  Doesn't that then compromise the whole thing?  What about TOC's who move between schools? What about resource teachers who deal with coded kids from multiple cohorts?   We have 500 kids in my school and two resource teachers........there's no way they won't be cross contaminating.  What about kids who go to after school day care or programs or sports teams?

 

Prior to this pandemic there was a very serious teacher shortage in BC.  Classes were jammed full and there are not nearly enough TOCs to cover teachers out sick.  Many days admin had to go into classrooms because there were no available toc's in our district.  I guarantee you were going to see teachers taking their banked sick days to stay away from the risk.  We're going to have stress leaves at a scale we've never seen before and how are districts going to deal with that when we're already at critical stage for teacher shortages?  How about when flu season hits and we've got multiple staff members at every school quarantined for 14 days?  How will their classes be covered?

 

Give us more than two weeks to figure this start up out and give us at least the first term to ease back into this new way of delivering education.  

 

I'm disappointed that this government looks to placate the squeaky wheel, the ones who put profit over our community health.  I want them to make the right decisions, even if they are the hard ones and I want a real plan that errs on the side of extreme caution to start.  I understand school has to start back up, in some way and I want it to, but it has to be done right, not done fast.

 

 

Edited August 7, 2020 by stawns

[HKSR]

1 minute ago, stawns said:

I don't know how it's going to shake out, but I am not feeling good about going back in September for the first time in my career.  Usually I lament the loss of summer, but that's offset with the excitement of a new school year, of seeing the kids again and the stretch from September to Xmas is so much fun in an elementary school.

 

This year it's uncertainty, definitely some fear, and anger that we are just jumping right back in to full time school.  I hate that this government had downloaded responsibilities to the district offices, who then download that to admin who then download that to teachers and we bear the brunt of figuring it out and take 100% of the risk while the bureaucrats sit safely in their offices.  We will have less than two weeks to get in and prep and plan for an unprecedented startup, one that is literally life threatening.

 

Cohorts of 60?  How is that enforceable?  Little Johnny and little Sam are best friends and live next door, but aren't in the same cohort.  At school they can't associate, but after school they hang out everyday.  Doesn't that compromise the premise of the cohort?  What about non-enrolling teachers (tl's, music, resource)?  They say the library will be a place that cohorts can be together........does that mean the teacher librarian is exposed to every cohort?  Doesn't that then compromise the whole thing?  What about TOC's who move between schools? What about resource teachers who deal with coded kids from multiple cohorts?   We have 500 kids in my school and two resource teachers........there's no way they won't be cross contaminating.  What about kids who go to after school day care or programs or sports teams?

 

Prior to this pandemic there was a very serious teacher shortage in BC.  Classes were jammed full and there are not nearly enough TOCs to cover teachers out sick.  Many days admin had to go into classrooms because there were no available toc's in our district.  I guarantee you were going to see teachers taking their banked sick days to stay away from the risk.  We're going to have stress leaves at a scale we've never seen before and how are districts going to deal with that when we're already at critical stage for teacher shortages.  How about when flu season hits and we've got multiple staff members at every school quarantined for 14 days?  How will their classes be covered?

 

Give us more than two weeks to figure this start up out and give us at least the first term to ease back into this new way of delivering education.  

 

I'm disappointed that this government looks to placate the squeaky wheel, the ones who put profit over our community health.  I want them to make the right decisions, even if they are the hard ones and I want a real plan that errs on the side of extreme caution to start.  I understand school has to start back up, in some way and I want it to, but it has to be done right, not done fast.

 

 

I can fully understand where you're coming from.  I'm a senior management member at one of the districts and we (other senior management across the Province) are dumbfounded by this decision.  From what I understand, the superintendents across the Province were told by the government to take this on as a 'leadership challenge'.  In other words, FIGURE IT OUT.  That's the extent of how much the Province is actually getting involved in the actual logistics of all this. 

 

My wife is PVP in our District as well, and she is losing her mind trying to figure out how this is going to work.  There are WAY too many moving variables for this to come together by Sept 8th. 

 

I'm not sure how the government officials can faithfully state that this is going to be a safe environment.  Like I said before, I honestly believe this is an economic prioritization decision veiled as a child learning prioritization.

[stawns]

3 minutes ago, HKSR said:

I can fully understand where you're coming from.  I'm a senior management member at one of the districts and we (other senior management across the Province) are dumbfounded by this decision.  From what I understand, the superintendents across the Province were told by the government to take this on as a 'leadership challenge'.  In other words, FIGURE IT OUT.  That's the extent of how much the Province is actually getting involved in the actual logistics of all this. 

 

My wife is PVP in our District as well, and she is losing her mind trying to figure out how this is going to work.  There are WAY too many moving variables for this to come together by Sept 8th. 

 

I'm not sure how the government officials can faithfully state that this is going to be a safe environment.  Like I said before, I honestly believe this is an economic prioritization decision veiled as a child learning prioritization.

We're not even allowed in the building until the 27th.  That gives us very little time to figure this out.  On one hand, I get letting districts come up with a plan that fits their locality.  On the other hand it feels like they are trying to absolve themselves of any responsibility and are trying to be the "good guys" and avoid taking any responsibility.  

 

Given the "Mrs Doubtfire" approach they've taken to managing this pandemic so far, I think it's much more the latter than the former.

[HKSR]

8 minutes ago, stawns said:

We're not even allowed in the building until the 27th.  That gives us very little time to figure this out.  On one hand, I get letting districts come up with a plan that fits their locality.  On the other hand it feels like they are trying to absolve themselves of any responsibility and are trying to be the "good guys" and avoid taking any responsibility.  

 

Given the "Mrs Doubtfire" approach they've taken to managing this pandemic so far, I think it's much more the latter than the former.

Yeah, the Province has requested District plans for reopening be sent to them by the 26th.  Hence not allowed in the building until the 27th.  I think it's important that each of the Districts work together as much as possible.  I know for a fact that your senior admin and PVP teams are working really hard right now trying to figure out how this will work best for your District.  We're all on the same side working towards the same goal... to get the schools open, but to do it safely... for EVERYONE.

[stawns]

1 minute ago, HKSR said:

Yeah, the Province has requested District plans for reopening be sent to them by the 26th.  Hence not allowed in the building until the 27th.  I think it's important that each of the Districts work together as much as possible.  I know for a fact that your senior admin and PVP teams are working really hard right now trying to figure out how this will work best for your District.  We're all on the same side working towards the same goal... to get the schools open, but to do it safely... for EVERYONE.

No argument here andI was pleasantly surprised by my districts overly cautious approach in June.  I hope to see the same now.  I'd liketo know what "full time" means.  Does it mean 30 kids in a classroom, plus two adults?  Does it mean, split classes with low numbers coming in shifts?  As I'm sure you know, schools run smoothly because those who work inside them are planners and painstakingly plan out every detail of the days, down to the minute........and that's in normal times.  My hope is the press release put out by the Principals/Vice Principals association will carry some weight.  I'd very much like to hear from CUPE as well.

[Russ]

16 minutes ago, stawns said:

We're not even allowed in the building until the 27th.  That gives us very little time to figure this out.  On one hand, I get letting districts come up with a plan that fits their locality.  On the other hand it feels like they are trying to absolve themselves of any responsibility and are trying to be the "good guys" and avoid taking any responsibility.  

 

Given the "Mrs Doubtfire" approach they've taken to managing this pandemic so far, I think it's much more the latter than the former.

They don't let you back in the school until then?  Geeze I grew up spending weeks at my dads high schools in the summer.

[stawns]

1 minute ago, Russ said:

They don't let you back in the school until then?  Geeze I grew up spending weeks at my dads high schools in the summer.

normally we can come in anytime after early august.  Obviously this year is special circumstances........every school is getting a deep clean and there are very strict protocols about who is allowed in and when

[RUPERTKBD]

From now on @stawns is going to have to take one of these showers, before he can enter the school:

[stawns]

Just now, RUPERTKBD said:

From now on @stawns is going to have to take one of these showers, before he can enter the school:

I know you'll get this movie reference, as you're old too!

 

 

[kingofsurrey]

One-third of Americans say they would refuse to be vaccinated, a new survey released Friday reveals.

The Gallup poll asked 7,632 respondents the following question: “If an FDA-approved vaccine to prevent coronavirus/COVID-19 was available right now at no cost, would you agree to be vaccinated?”

 

The results showed that only 65 percent of respondents said they would get a federally approved vaccine if it were ready today — leaving 35 percent admitting they would not.

 

https://nypost.com/2020/08/07/one-third-of-americans-would-refuse-a-covid-19-vaccine-poll/

[RUPERTKBD]

1 minute ago, stawns said:

I know you'll get this movie reference, as you're old too!

 

 

Very. Only a few CDCers who are my senior.

 

I figured you'd be old enough to catch the Andromeda Strain reference. Very well done, IMO, considering when it was released.

[RUPERTKBD]

1 minute ago, kingofsurrey said:

One-third of Americans say they would refuse to be vaccinated, a new survey released Friday reveals.

The Gallup poll asked 7,632 respondents the following question: “If an FDA-approved vaccine to prevent coronavirus/COVID-19 was available right now at no cost, would you agree to be vaccinated?”

 

The results showed that only 65 percent of respondents said they would get a federally approved vaccine if it were ready today — leaving 35 percent admitting they would not.

 

https://nypost.com/2020/08/07/one-third-of-americans-would-refuse-a-covid-19-vaccine-poll/

Hmmmm......

 

.....Gates will have to figure out another way to microchip the other 35%.....

[kingofsurrey]

Walmart has a stronger opinion of masks   than Dr B  and Horgan do  ..... LOL

 

 

 

Walmart Canada has announced it is making masks or face coverings mandatory in all stores starting Aug. 12.

 

In a statement, the company said this will apply in every store, regardless of whether there is a local government mandate in place.

The company says Health Canada has identified that when worn properly, a person wearing a mask or face covering can help reduce the spread of respiratory droplets.

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/7255942/walmart-canada-mandatory-masks-august-12/

Edited August 7, 2020 by kingofsurrey

[Fanuck]

6 hours ago, stawns said:

 My hope is the press release put out by the Principals/Vice Principals association will carry some weight.  I'd very much like to hear from CUPE as well.

Administrators lost any 'weight' they had when they ceased to be members of the BCTF bargaining unit.   Even with the covid measures, they have zero 'weight' in the sense that they cannot make independent decisions unless they comply with the provincial health officer's (PHO) directives and WorkSafe BC guidelines (which are essentially based on the PHO's directives) and their Superintendent's directives (which again, come directly from the PHO). 

 

Parents organizing 'en masse' and being very, very vocal about it, to not send their children back unless a very detailed plan was presented for EVERY district in the province would be about the only thing that, imo, would make the PHO/Premier's office/MoE take pause and reassess their 100% return to school stance.  Problem is, I suspect FAR more parents care more about their kids going back to school under any conditions rather than if the conditions are actually safe for EVERY person in the building. 

[Jaimito]

[kingofsurrey]

1 hour ago, Fanuck said:

Administrators lost any 'weight' they had when they ceased to be members of the BCTF bargaining unit.   Even with the covid measures, they have zero 'weight' in the sense that they cannot make independent decisions unless they comply with the provincial health officer's (PHO) directives and WorkSafe BC guidelines (which are essentially based on the PHO's directives) and their Superintendent's directives (which again, come directly from the PHO). 

 

Parents organizing 'en masse' and being very, very vocal about it, to not send their children back unless a very detailed plan was presented for EVERY district in the province would be about the only thing that, imo, would make the PHO/Premier's office/MoE take pause and reassess their 100% return to school stance.  Problem is, I suspect FAR more parents care more about their kids going back to school under any conditions rather than if the conditions are actually safe for EVERY person in the building. 

Apparently right now a record number of parents are signing up their kids to online learning for Sept.

Now massive waitlists starting to form.

 

Online petitions now against Horgan/Dr B 's plan... - 27,000 signatures and quickly growing.

 

https://www.burnabynow.com/news/parents-start-petition-against-full-b-c-school-return-1.24180524

 

Really seems like citizens of BC have lost faith in Horgan and Dr. B 's lack of  a clear plan for BC schools reopening....

Edited August 8, 2020 by kingofsurrey

[stawns]

1 hour ago, Fanuck said:

Administrators lost any 'weight' they had when they ceased to be members of the BCTF bargaining unit.   Even with the covid measures, they have zero 'weight' in the sense that they cannot make independent decisions unless they comply with the provincial health officer's (PHO) directives and WorkSafe BC guidelines (which are essentially based on the PHO's directives) and their Superintendent's directives (which again, come directly from the PHO). 

 

Parents organizing 'en masse' and being very, very vocal about it, to not send their children back unless a very detailed plan was presented for EVERY district in the province would be about the only thing that, imo, would make the PHO/Premier's office/MoE take pause and reassess their 100% return to school stance.  Problem is, I suspect FAR more parents care more about their kids going back to school under any conditions rather than if the conditions are actually safe for EVERY person in the building. 

That is true, but their opinions hold plenty of weight at the district level, especially in a time like this.

 

I disagree about parents.  I know many that do not or will not send their kids back to school with numbers going up.

Edited August 8, 2020 by stawns

[kingofsurrey]

BC stands for Bring Covid.....

 

At least when Horgan had the great idea to  invite  all of Alberta to come summer vacation here......

 

Alberta covid cases per thoussand are catching up to Quebec.....

 

WE  need a premier with an acual plan how to limit this pandemic in our province. 

Edited August 8, 2020 by kingofsurrey

[Russ]

22 hours ago, stawns said:

normally we can come in anytime after early august.  Obviously this year is special circumstances........every school is getting a deep clean and there are very strict protocols about who is allowed in and when

Ah gotcha.  I litterally grew up in the summers playing basketball in the high school gym while my dad did work haha