[Proposal] Trade prior to Expansion Draft to improve our RHD

[BigTramFan]

Just thinking about this one and not sure how it looks yet...

 

It appears that VAN will need a 3C and a few Dmen to complete our roster next season. If Beagle is going to stay on LTIR this actually means we have some cap space, which could be put to good use in a trade with Tampa Bay, who are going to struggle to clear cap prior to next season. It's an opportunity to get a young RHD. The proposal is:

 

To VAN: Cernak + Killorn

To TBL: A 2021 pick (not sure which one?)

 

Trading Cernak before the ED means that TBL only need to protect 3 Dmen (Hedman, Sergachev, Foote) and allows them to use 7 protection spots for forwards (Stamkos, Kucherov, Point, Cirelli, Joseph, Barre-Boulet, Colton) plus goalie, Vas. This strategy really only leaves their higher contract guys exposed: Palat, Johnson, Gourde, McDonagh. It sort of forces Seattle to select one of these guys, as the remaining options are not good, and ensures that TBL clears even more cap. TBL can also offer a sweetener of a 1st rounder for SEA to take Johnson.

 

If they can do that with Seattle, their cap issues are solved for another year and the TBL roster could easily fit under $81.5m, their top 5 D is Hedman, Sergachev, McDonagh, Foote, Rutta. They could sign some cheaper vets to fill in #6 and #7. They have good depth at forward and will likely sign some bottom 6 guys for cheap to complete their roster.

 

Why does VAN do this trade?

 

Clearly it is to get a big, young Dman in Cernak who I believe would mesh well with Hughes and could be a core piece for VAN.

 

Which pick would we be willing to send to TBL? 

 

Killorn is a BIG cap dump (4.45m) and cap space is a precious commodity right now, taking this cap hit over 2 years must be equivalent to a 1st rounder, perhaps even more to a team like TBL in the situation that they are in. Cernak has a more positive value than Killorn's negative value, so I am not sure, maybe a 2021 2nd round pick would do it? What do you think?

 

Another option is to trade Gadjovich to TBL instead of the pick. He could be selected in the ED since we likely cannot protect him, in this way we wouldn't lose the pick and Gadjovich, we would just lose Gadjovich. VAN protects: EP40, Horvat, Boeser, Miller, Pearson, Motte, Lind, Schmidt, Juolevi, Cernak, Demko. I think Seattle most likely selects Virtanen (Myers and Holtby too expensive).

 

What do we do with Killorn?

 

He is actually a very serviceable LW and could be used in our top 9. Pettersson, Horvat and Miller could center our 3 top lines (3 scoring lines), and Lind could be used in a sheltered 4C role. Eriksson is bought out. Roussel is waived. Resign Petterson (7), Hughes (6), Vesey (1), Lind (1), Juolevi (1), Tryamkin (2).

 

Our roster for next season with total cap hit of $81m could be:

 

Killorn Pettersson Boeser

Pearson Horvat Hoglander

Vesey Miller Podkolzin

Motte Lind Highmore

(MacEwen)

 

Hughes Cernak

Juolevi Schmidt

Tryamkin Myers

(Rathbone)

 

Demko

(Holtby)

[elvis15]

OP: "Tampa does this because this guy is a big cap dump"

 

Also OP: "Very serviceable player *puts him on top line*"

 

And if we think we'll lose Gadjovich because we can't protect him, why would Tampa want him instead of a pick?

[timberz21]

Funny how every year, everyone wants to rip off the Lightning because they are in cap hell.  Somehow, they are always fine.  Killorn is not a cap dump, he's a decent player with a decent contract.  He's a consistent 0.5PPG, not bad for a middle 6 player who can move up and down the lineup.  

 

If they want cap space, they could trade Ondrej Palat and his 5.3M$ who has 1 more year left on his deal and is currently having a career year.  He could be a cap dump and return decent asset for them.  Losing him won't really hurt them.

 

I actually see tampa protecting only 8 players  Stamkos, Point, Kucherov, Cirelli, Hedman, Sergachev, Cernak and Foote.

 

That leaves guys like Johnson, Mcdonough, Gourde, Killorn, Joseph, Stephens and Palat.  I mean, there are some decent players in there, but I don't think Tampa is going to lose any sleep by losing one of these guys.  If Seattle takes any guys with term, Tampa is probably happy, while Joseph and Stephens a cheap decent prospect, they are 24 years old and have yet to make a huge impact on this roster.    I don't see Tampa paying too much for them to take a specific guy.  

[Provost]

There is no world where we can fit those cap hits on our roster.  The cost of exiting enough money to make it work would be horrific.

 

There is no world where Tampa gives away Cernak for nothing.

 

Tampa is better off letting expansion in play out and seeing who Seattle takes.

 

Gadjovich isn’t likely ever to become an NHLer, why would anyone trade for him?

[Nucker 67]

We got Bowey, it's all good 

[JM_]

4 hours ago, BigTramFan said:

 

 

To VAN: Cernak + Killorn

To TBL: A 2021 pick (not sure which one?)

 

if we're taking Killorn, then we shouldn't be moving much of a pick at all, since we'd be doing them a big favour. 

 

I'd rather move a higher pick or a prospect back for Cernak since they can't / won't protect him and keep it simpler that way. Seattle likely takes some salary off their hands anyway.

 

I'd offer Rathbone for Cernak and see what shakes. 

[Rick Blight]

Tampa is in the worst cap hell I have ever seen. They are $3.5M OVER the cap for next season with only 15 players under contract. Unless they plan to have Kucherov on LTIR for the entire season AGAIN they are going to have to dump a lot of contracts and there are not a lot of teams that can absorb those contracts. I suspect you may see a lot of Tampa's current roster playing in Seattle next year as they are the one team that will have cap space.

[mll]

7 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

if we're taking Killorn, then we shouldn't be moving much of a pick at all, since we'd be doing them a big favour. 

 

I'd rather move a higher pick or a prospect back for Cernak since they can't / won't protect him and keep it simpler that way. Seattle likely takes some salary off their hands anyway.

 

I'd offer Rathbone for Cernak and see what shakes. 

Why wouldn’t they protect him?  McKenzie lists him among their untouchable players.  They can either go 7F + 3D or  4F + 4 D without exposing any of their untouchables. 

 

Kucherov  Cirelli   Point   Stamkos (NMC)

Hedman  Cernak  Sergachev

 

They’ve looked into moving everyone else last off-season. 

 

[JM_]

9 minutes ago, mll said:

Why wouldn’t they protect him?  McKenzie lists him among their untouchable players.  They can either go 7F + 3D or  4F + 4 D without exposing any of their untouchables. 

 

Kucherov  Cirelli   Point   Stamkos (NMC)

Hedman  Cernak  Sergachev

 

They’ve looked into moving everyone else last off-season. 

 

depends if they want to keep and bring up Foote to replace him. 

[NewbieCanuckFan]

21 minutes ago, Rick Blight said:

Tampa is in the worst cap hell I have ever seen. They are $3.5M OVER the cap for next season with only 15 players under contract. Unless they plan to have Kucherov on LTIR for the entire season AGAIN they are going to have to dump a lot of contracts and there are not a lot of teams that can absorb those contracts. I suspect you may see a lot of Tampa's current roster playing in Seattle next year as they are the one team that will have cap space.

True but it looks like theyre competing for the Cup (or at the very least, defending the Cup they just won last season).  If you think you have a legit chance to win (in their case, win yet again), screw next year; play for today.  

[Rick Blight]

3 minutes ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

True but it looks like theyre competing for the Cup (or at the very least, defending the Cup they just won last season).  If you think you have a legit chance to win (in their case, win yet again), screw next year; play for today.  

I am not disputing that philosophy at all as winning the cup would always be the priority. Having said that, they are still in the worst cap hell I have ever seen for next season and it would have been much the same for this year had Kucherov not been placed on LTIR for the entire season.

I fully expect them to win the cup again this year, particularly if Kucherov is back, and I applaud them for being in a position to do so.

[mll]

24 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

depends if they want to keep and bring up Foote to replace him. 

They can protect 4 Ds too.  

 

Kind of expect them to make a deal for Seattle to pick Johnson.  With how Brisebois talked about how they’ve never considered trading Cernak, Cirelli, Sergachev, says they need them if they want to win again, just can’t see them being exposed or traded.

[JM_]

Just now, mll said:

They can protect 4 Ds too.  

 

Kind of expect them to make a deal for Seattle to pick Johnson.  With how Brisebois talked about how they’ve never considered trading Cernak, Cirelli, Sergachev, says they need them if they want to win again, just can’t see them being exposed or traded.

true enough. I was going off the 3d protection model. I wasn't up on the talk out of Tampa, so based on what you're saying a Cernak deal is clearly unlikely. 

 

I wonder if they'd consider a deal 1:1 for Rathbone for Foote? they can't protect Foote under either protection model, and we do need more RHD prospects. 

[A.A.A]

I heard somewhere that Kucherov doesn't need to be protected for the ED since he missed the season and will likely only be back for the playoffs. Not sure if this is true, trying to find more info on this... Anyone else able to shed more light?

 

 

[NewbieCanuckFan]

45 minutes ago, Rick Blight said:

I am not disputing that philosophy at all as winning the cup would always be the priority. Having said that, they are still in the worst cap hell I have ever seen for next season and it would have been much the same for this year had Kucherov not been placed on LTIR for the entire season.

I fully expect them to win the cup again this year, particularly if Kucherov is back, and I applaud them for being in a position to do so.

I don’t especially follow the Bolts that closely but they must be fairly deep to lose a legit 1st line forward (who can play center or wing) like Miller and still win a Cup.  Sure at some point you’d think the house of cards will fall...but oh what a ride they had.

[Drakrami]

lol. Good luck trying to pry Cernak from TB. Just signed a bridge 2.9mil/year contract playing 23 minutes a game. 

[Rick Blight]

1 minute ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

I don’t especially follow the Bolts that closely but they must be fairly deep to lose a legit 1st line forward (who can play center or wing) like Miller and still win a Cup.  Sure at some point you’d think the house of cards will fall...but oh what a ride they had.

Yup, they are having quite the ride.

Even without Miller they have 8 forwards making more than $4.5M and two of them make $8.5M or more. By comparison, the Canucks top paid forward is Eriksson (yuk) at $6M and we only have a total of 4 forwards making $4.5M or more. Long way of saying, yup, they are pretty deep at forward.

And even with that, they can still have a goalie making $9.5M.

[billabong]

I wouldn't put too much hype around poaching other teams players who are at risk to lose someone of value. Especially not TB, they always find ways to weasel out of cap hell.

 

I just don't know how much of an apatite teams will have to spend so much time and energy to trade a good player for a pick then go on to lose the next player in line for nothing 

 

Now you're down 2 players instead of 1 and you have to go find a replacement in trade or free agency when the no.2 guy you lost to Seattle would have been no.1's replacement if you left your no.1 guy exposed 

 

[BigTramFan]

5 hours ago, elvis15 said:

OP: "Tampa does this because this guy is a big cap dump"

 

Also OP: "Very serviceable player *puts him on top line*"

 

And if we think we'll lose Gadjovich because we can't protect him, why would Tampa want him instead of a pick?

Killorn is a good player, it's just that the TBL cap situation is dire and they have to clear two of their higher paid players to be compliant. He is one with a m-NTC. He could absolutely play on VAN's top line.

 

TBL may prefer Gadjovich over a 2nd round pick because is basically a developed 2nd round pick already (drafted 2017, currently running at 11 goals in 13 AHL games) and could be ready to contribute to their team within 12 months, which is a lot sooner than a 2nd round pick. However, since TBL are pretty much spending all their picks to remain competitive, they may prefer the pick.

 

[BigTramFan]

5 hours ago, timberz21 said:

Funny how every year, everyone wants to rip off the Lightning because they are in cap hell.  Somehow, they are always fine.  Killorn is not a cap dump, he's a decent player with a decent contract.  He's a consistent 0.5PPG, not bad for a middle 6 player who can move up and down the lineup.  

 

If they want cap space, they could trade Ondrej Palat and his 5.3M$ who has 1 more year left on his deal and is currently having a career year.  He could be a cap dump and return decent asset for them.  Losing him won't really hurt them.

 

I actually see tampa protecting only 8 players  Stamkos, Point, Kucherov, Cirelli, Hedman, Sergachev, Cernak and Foote.

 

That leaves guys like Johnson, Mcdonough, Gourde, Killorn, Joseph, Stephens and Palat.  I mean, there are some decent players in there, but I don't think Tampa is going to lose any sleep by losing one of these guys.  If Seattle takes any guys with term, Tampa is probably happy, while Joseph and Stephens a cheap decent prospect, they are 24 years old and have yet to make a huge impact on this roster.    I don't see Tampa paying too much for them to take a specific guy.  

I think if TBL protect Stamkos, Point, Kucherov, Cirelli, Hedman, Sergachev, Cernak and Foote, then there is a real risk that Seattle selects Joseph. This is a problem for TBL because they actually NEED to get rid of two of their larger contracts. That is why they will lose sleep on making sure SEA selects one of their bigger contracts.