[Signing] Sami Vatanen signs with Geneve-Servette HC (Switzerland)

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[timberz21]

His career fell off a cliff in a hurry.

 

I remember a few years ago when Anaheim supposedly had too many good defenseman  Fowler, Lindholm, Vatanen, Montour, Manson....and a certain Shea Theodore.  Ironically, they let the best one go.

[thundernuts]

Wow.  Surprised he didn't get picked up.  Can't say that I followed his career closely, but I thought he was a pretty decent player.

[Master Mind]

41 minutes ago, timberz21 said:

His career fell off a cliff in a hurry.

No kidding, he looked very promising in Anaheim, and wasn't too bad in his first stint with NJ.

 

He really regressed this past season though, and it appears that was enough to prevent any team from giving him a chance (unless he wanted to go to Europe to play a larger role).

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

Surprising he couldn’t find an NHL league minimum deal somewhere (although it’s possible he’s getting paid pretty close to that much in the NLA).

 

There were definitely worse defencemen than Vatanen getting NHL contracts this year, some even penciled into NHL starting-6’s.

 

I suppose perception plays a role, in that if Vatanen isn’t producing offence, he’s probably viewed as not providing much value. But his defence really isn’t even that bad. Certainly not bad enough that he can’t play as an NHL bottom pairing or spare defender. By some analytics, he’s actually a net positive value on 5v5 defence, which really can’t be said for scores of other current NHL Dmen, and even many that are widely considered to be “defensive defencemen.”

 

Vatanen was never a free agency target for me this off-season, other than possibly as a PTO invite, but now that we’re looking at some uncertainty around Hamonic, I probably would have been fine with a late signing of Vatanen at $750K x 1yr, just for veteran RHD depth and insurance.

 

I’m pretty surprised there weren’t some other teams (where he’s a better potential fit) that were willing to throw Vatanen a cheap one year contract for this year.

[CRAZY_4_NAZZY]

If Travis Hamonic chooses to sit out the season or retire, could see the Canucks knocking on Sami's door for an opportunity.

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

14 minutes ago, CRAZY_4_NAZZY said:

If Travis Hamonic chooses to sit out the season or retire, could see the Canucks knocking on Sami's door for an opportunity.

Or maybe Jason Demers on a $750K one year?

[theo5789]

5 minutes ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

Or maybe Jason Demers on a $750K one year?

I vaguely remember Demers being in some sort of trade rumour coming here and he didn't waive his trade clause or something. If he didn't want to come to Vancouver then, probably doesn't want to now?

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

14 minutes ago, theo5789 said:

I vaguely remember Demers being in some sort of trade rumour coming here and he didn't waive his trade clause or something. If he didn't want to come to Vancouver then, probably doesn't want to now?

I think the situation has changed a lot since then.

 

Right now, Demers can’t even get a contract, and beggars can’t be choosers. He’s just at a different stage in his career now (aka the “survival” stage).

 

The Canucks are also a different team. Hopefully one on a more favourable trajectory.

 

And we just added two of the core players Demers was teammates with in Arizona, including OEL, who had played quite a bit with Demers, and successfully  in the past.

 

Taken all together, I’d say the landscape has shifted enough that I wouldn’t rule out Demers signing a deal with Vancouver, if one was offered.

[theo5789]

4 minutes ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

I think the situation has changed a lot since then.

 

Right now, Demers can’t even get a contract, and beggars can’t be choosers. He’s just at a different stage in his career now (aka the “survival” stage).

 

The Canucks are also a different team. Hopefully one on a more favourable trajectory.

 

And we just added two of the core players Demers was teammates with in Arizona, including OEL, who had played quite a bit with Demers, and successfully  in the past.

 

Taken all together, I’d say the landscape has shifted enough that I wouldn’t rule out Demers signing a deal with Vancouver, if one was offered.

Possibly, but someone like Eric Staal who doesn't have a contract right now either has also stated he's looking to join an American team. So if the situation is not wanting to play in Canada, then I could see that not changing. If it was simply a matter of playing for a potential contender, then I can see his viewpoint changing. However, I feel it's more the former than the latter. Plus I believe he refused to waive when he was in Florida, so not too sure the importance of having OEL and Garland here that would change his mind.

[CRAZY_4_NAZZY]

54 minutes ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

Or maybe Jason Demers on a $750K one year?

Very good possibility, just as long as he isn't paired with OEL.

 

I was listening to Craig Morgan on Sportsnet 650 when they had first acquired OEL and Garland, he shared that Demers (OEL's regular partner in Arz) did not compliment OEL's game very well, as both were prone to defensive lapses together, but when split apart they played quite well but Tocchet some reason felt married to that pair.

Edited September 27, 2021 by CRAZY_4_NAZZY

[Patel Bure]

1 hour ago, CRAZY_4_NAZZY said:

If Travis Hamonic chooses to sit out the season or retire, could see the Canucks knocking on Sami's door for an opportunity.

Was just thinking the same thing.  Or like another poster said, Jason Demers.

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

1 hour ago, theo5789 said:

Possibly, but someone like Eric Staal who doesn't have a contract right now either has also stated he's looking to join an American team. So if the situation is not wanting to play in Canada, then I could see that not changing. If it was simply a matter of playing for a potential contender, then I can see his viewpoint changing. However, I feel it's more the former than the latter. Plus I believe he refused to waive when he was in Florida, so not too sure the importance of having OEL and Garland here that would change his mind.

If I were to speculate on Demers’ reasons for not waiving his NTC for the Canucks (in 2017), I’d say taxes were the #1 factor.

 

He had four years left on a $4.5M AAV contract. Had he accepted the trade to Vancouver, he’d have ~$2M less money in the bank today.
 

It’s not surprising he chose to go to Arizona (low tax) from Florida (low tax).

 

I’d expect his 8 team no trade list was mostly made up of the highest taxed NHL teams.

 

Today, however, we’re probably talking about a $750K one year deal. I doubt saving ~$75K on his taxes is going to be much of a factor (at least compared to $2M).

 

EDIT: Canucks could also just step up to $825K to offset any issues.

Edited September 27, 2021 by SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME

[theo5789]

13 minutes ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

If I were to speculate on Demers’ reasons for not waiving his NTC for the Canucks (in 2017), I’d say taxes were the #1 factor.

 

He had four years left on a $4.5M AAV contract. Had he accepted the trade to Vancouver, he’d have ~$2M less money in the bank today.
 

It’s not surprising he chose to go to Arizona (low tax) from Florida (low tax).

 

I’d expect his 8 team no trade list was mostly made up of the highest taxed NHL teams.

 

Today, however, we’re probably talking about a $750K one year deal. I doubt saving ~$75K on his taxes is going to be much of a factor (at least compared to $2M).

Fair enough. Will be interesting to see how it plays out.

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

1 minute ago, theo5789 said:

Fair enough. Will be interesting to see how it plays out.

Yeah, we’ll see. And I’m definitely not saying “Demers to Van E5” , just that I’d look at Demers on a cheap one year, if indeed there’s uncertainty around whether or not Hamonic will even play this season.

 

Not that Demers is a clean replacement option for Hamonic either. But he’s at least a capable depth RHD and he does have some size and physicality, plus veteran presence. Could do worse.

 

And if Hamonic ends up not playing, the cap savings (from replacing him with Demers or similar) could prove useful.

 

If we could cobble together the defence for one year, with a RHD of Myers, Poolman, Schenn, Demers, plus the depth guys, and have an additional $2M+ to throw at Petey and Hughes, it wouldn’t be the worst result. Might even be able to lock up both with term.

[iinatcc]

14 hours ago, thundernuts said:

Wow.  Surprised he didn't get picked up.  Can't say that I followed his career closely, but I thought he was a pretty decent player.

Maybe he had an offer but preferred to play in Switzerland? Thinking about it if the Swiss league world be option 2 for most hockey players considering that travel wouldn't be an issue, Switzerland is a great place to live and the pay should be very good there. 

[King Heffy]

20 hours ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

If I were to speculate on Demers’ reasons for not waiving his NTC for the Canucks (in 2017), I’d say taxes were the #1 factor.

 

He had four years left on a $4.5M AAV contract. Had he accepted the trade to Vancouver, he’d have ~$2M less money in the bank today.
 

It’s not surprising he chose to go to Arizona (low tax) from Florida (low tax).

 

I’d expect his 8 team no trade list was mostly made up of the highest taxed NHL teams.

 

Today, however, we’re probably talking about a $750K one year deal. I doubt saving ~$75K on his taxes is going to be much of a factor (at least compared to $2M).

 

EDIT: Canucks could also just step up to $825K to offset any issues.

Even if tax is an issue, his net pay will still be more than if he is sitting on his couch.