[Rumour] Bo Horvat Trade/Contract Talks

[Elias Pettersson]

Just now, HOFsedins said:

Highly doubt the consequences will be that bad. Horvat couldn't do anything with this team since he began playing here. Not a knock on him, absolutely the managements fault. But just saying, what's the worst that can happen that we haven't seen yet? Bottom 3 in NHL standings? Sure, I think most might even welcome it.

Didn’t we finish 2nd last in the NHL back in 2017?  I guess we could finish last. That would be worse…

[Devron]

Just now, Elias Pettersson said:

99 points is almost double from 52 points. No sane GM in the league is going to prioritize signing a 52 point player over a 99 point player. 

Well in age is a factor as well you probably could have gotten Bo cheaper at the time. Makes more sense to prioritize Bo especially when Miller just doesn’t fit here. The extra couple year we would have gotten of Bo’s prime is the difference. Now we are looking at rebuilding with Miller as an anchor.

 

Whats really insane is not trading Miller because if he is That Good of a player we should have gotten a super return for him no? 

[Devron]

2 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Horvat’s contract is an issue every time. So not sure what you mean. This is the second go around with him and it’s distracting the team cause we are in the middle of a season and he doesn’t care. Like I said if Petey pulls the same stunt 2 years from now then we can talk. 

Pretty weak reasoning tbh 

[Coconuts]

3 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

99 points is almost double from 52 points. No sane GM in the league is going to prioritize signing a 52 point player over a 99 point player. 

A onetime 99 point player, he was closer to point per game the two seasons prior and there's no guarantee he breaks 85 points again let alone 90. Let's not pretend 99 points is somehow his standard level of production, it hasn't been thus far over the course of his career. 

 

Plus, he gives up some of what he produces via his being a liability defensively which has repeatedly resulted in goals against. 

[stawns]

5 minutes ago, HOFsedins said:

I'll give you that but I'm sorry, they are in a results based profession. You are worth what you are producing. Before this season started, Horvat was not a 8M dollar player and JT simply is. I can argue that I still don't think Bo is a 8M dollar player.

Actually, from February on he was one of the most prolific scorers in the league, on top of being a top face off guy.  Call it what it is, a massive blunder by management

[Darius]

5 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

99 points is almost double from 52 points. No sane GM in the league is going to prioritize signing a 52 point player over a 99 point player. 

If im in game 7 in any round of the stanley cup i cant think of a situation where id want Miller on the ice over Bo.  Not one.  Whether they are up by one, down by one, or tied.  Miller and his brain farts would make me highly nervous.  

 

In a way its the same reason flames fans think a guy like Kadri is an upgrade over gaudreau.  Little johnny will rack up more points but who would you rather have out there when the screws are being put down and the game / series is on the line.

 

 

[Elias Pettersson]

3 minutes ago, Devron said:

Well in age is a factor as well you probably could have gotten Bo cheaper at the time. Makes more sense to prioritize Bo especially when Miller just doesn’t fit here. The extra couple year we would have gotten of Bo’s prime is the difference. Now we are looking at rebuilding with Miller as an anchor.

 

Whats really insane is not trading Miller because if he is That Good of a player we should have gotten a super return for him no? 

They offered BO a contract in the summer based on his 52 point season and he refused. Miller accepted his contract and he signed. It’s pretty simple. Not sure what is confusing about that. Miller being an anchor moving forward is only your opinion, it’s not fact. For all we know once BO is traded he can become that 99 point centre again. At least we know he is capable of that. 

 

Just because he is having a slower start to this season doesn’t mean we will never see a 99 point season from him again. Look at Erik Karlsson.  Did anyone expect him to be a Norris trophy candidate again at 32?

[ilduce39]

Management tried 7x8 .. would 8x8 get it done?  I wouldn’t go any higher than that but I could see us making one last push before the deadline.

[DownUndaCanuck]

1 hour ago, -Vintage Canuck- said:

 

Absolute insult if they didn't offer him 8M and gave Miller 8M for a once off 99 point season.

 

I said it before, this new management will be judged by how they deal with Miller-Bo, nothing else. That is their big task. JB messed up a lot of situations and was judged for them, PA and JR so far haven't dealt with the situation well.

[rekker]

37 minutes ago, HOFsedins said:

Curious why you think if JT got 8 then Bo deserves 8

Respect. Also, one could argue the plus and minuses of both players, but they are pretty equal. I prefer Bo. It's one of those things if you asked ten fans Bo or JT, it would probably go 50 50. Lots or factors, age, position, faceoffs, emotions, PP. In the end from a pure hockey view they are neck and neck. Like I said though, I prefer Bo. Centers like him are tough to find and it was a big mistake by management to extend JT and not Bo. Should of been done in tandem.

[Elias Pettersson]

10 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

A onetime 99 point player, he was closer to point per game the two seasons prior and there's no guarantee he breaks 85 points again let alone 90. Let's not pretend 99 points is somehow his standard level of production, it hasn't been thus far over the course of his career. 

 

Plus, he gives up some of what he produces via his being a liability defensively which has repeatedly resulted in goals against. 

Well let’s not pretend that Horvat is a 50 goal scorer either based on his last 7 seasons. So why did he turn down a 7x8 offer which is the same total money Miller accepted? 

 

Is a 55 point player on average over the last 7 years worth $8 million? 

Edited December 13, 2022 by Elias Pettersson

[BobbyClarke]

Just now, DownUndaCanuck said:

Absolute insult if they didn't offer him 8M and gave Miller 8M for a once off 99 point season.

 

I said it before, this new management will be judged by how they deal with Miller-Bo, nothing else. That is their big task. JB messed up a lot of situations and was judged for them, PA and JR so far haven't dealt with the situation well.

I would definitely give Bo up to 8.2m X 7. Just need to shed garland and Pearson. 

[rekker]

1 minute ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

Absolute insult if they didn't offer him 8M and gave Miller 8M for a once off 99 point season.

 

I said it before, this new management will be judged by how they deal with Miller-Bo, nothing else. That is their big task. JB messed up a lot of situations and was judged for them, PA and JR so far haven't dealt with the situation well.

Agreed, insult and a huge mistake. Watch the hole that not having Bo here creates. 

[ToTellTheTruth]

12 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

99 points is almost double from 52 points. No sane GM in the league is going to prioritize signing a 52 point player over a 99 point player. 

Horvat's roll over the years has been more a defensive role, maybe one he wasn't great at but he was never the go to guy on offence. He always has managed to be a playoff performer and scorer.

He is playing for his last big contract and scoring counts for more. A good soldier he has been playing his role which was second fiddle to other 1rst line players.

 

"Until they say otherwise" a slip of the tongue?

[Coconuts]

4 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Well let’s not pretend that Horvat is a 50 goal scorer either based on his last 7 seasons. So why did he down a 7x8 offer which is the same total money Miller accepted? 

Most aren't pretending Bo's a 50 goal scorer, doesn't take a genius to realize he's probably not a contender for the Rocket out of nowhere. 

 

But he has been on pace for 25 goals over 82 games the last five seasons prior to this one, he's stronger than Miller defensively, he's our primary faceoff guy, he plays both special teams, he's probably good for 50-60 points and 20-25+ goals. He's a legit top six center who, while not a Selke candidate, doesn't need to be sheltered and who would probably continue to thrive in a larger role with better quality linemates. 

 

He's historically been saddled with subpar linemates over the course of his career in Vancouver, I don't see why he couldn't have more to give. 

 

He brings more to the table as a player than Miller does, whereas all Miller really brings is offense, and even then he's a double edged sword who'll probably hurt us more often as he ages and loses his speed. 

 

Plus, I fully expect there will be teams willing to pay him 8x7 if not more via UFA if he reaches UFA. Lot of teams would love to grab a Horvat for nothing but money. 

Edited December 13, 2022 by Coconuts

[rekker]

Lots of talk on here and in the media about offers and dollar amounts. My gut tells me Bo wants out though. I don't blame him. Franchise is a mess and he wants to go win or at least try with a different team. He's given his all here, I wouldn't blame him to want to try winning on a different team. 

[Elias Pettersson]

1 minute ago, Coconuts said:

Most aren't pretending Bo's a 50 goal scorer, doesn't take a genius to realize he's probably not a contender for the Rocket out of nowhere. 

 

But he has been on pace for 25 goals over 82 games the last five seasons prior to this one, he's stronger than Miller defensively, he's our primary faceoff guy, he plays both special teams, he's probably good for 50-60 points and 20-25+ goals. He's a legit top six center who, while not a Selke candidate, doesn't need to be sheltered and who would probably continue to thrive in a larger role with better quality linemates. 

 

He's historically been saddled with subpar linemates over the course of his career in Vancouver, I don't see why he couldn't have more to give. 

 

He brings more to the table as a player than Miller does, whereas all Miller really brings is offense, and even then he's a double edged sword who'll probably hurt us more often as he ages and loses his speed. 

Sure, that tells me he’s a 7x8 guy. So why did he turn it down?  

[Ted Lasso]

Just now, rekker said:

Lots of talk on here and in the media about offers and dollar amounts. My gut tells me Bo wants out though. I don't blame him. Franchise is a mess and he wants to go win or at least try with a different team. He's given his all here, I wouldn't blame him to want to try winning on a different team. 

Does he have any movement clauses?

 

[rekker]

2 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

 

He's historically been saddled with subpar linemates over the course of his career in Vancouver, I don't see why he couldn't have more to give

This as well. Some suspect linemates over the years. This year Bo has a legit winger in JT and boom, what do you know. 

[Coconuts]

1 minute ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Sure, that tells me he’s a 7x8 guy. So why did he turn it down?  

Maybe he's tired of playing for an organization who's largely done nothing but lose his entire NHL career? And that looks poised to lose yet another season?

 

Maybe he wants to go somewhere he could actually make the playoffs consistently, given he'll likely get paid wherever he goes?

 

Maybe we've just stunk most of the past decade despite his best efforts and he's tired of it?