Stop with the Sky Falling predictions... This team has plenty of talent... what it needs is a coach who can use it

[Hairy Kneel]

9 hours ago, IBatch said:

Green ... guys been coaching and also has GM experience as well since 2008.   He wasn't a special player but did play in a very tough era, and had a very decent NHL career.   Then he went back to his roots as an assistant coach/GM.   After years of that he eventually got his shot at the head coaching job and completely turned his team around and went on an epic run.   This didn't go unnoticed, and his hard work got him the Utica job.   Pretty much did the same thing with an underwhelming roster aside from Markstrom.   Point is he's not an "inexperienced coach"....or even and inexperienced NHL coach anymore.   And absolutely will get another job after this one.   I 100% agree this is mostly on JB.   Gadjovich isn't going to make us win a lot of these one goal losses this season .... that's on Green.   Travis Green wasn't just an early adopter but an actual pioneer on the idea of zone entries and exits.   I bet most on this site aren't even aware of this but have brought it up a few times.   Well before it was a "stat" that was factored in,  Travis and his staff would spend the time with pencils to record it.    Now it is a "thing". When he was hired JB and crew did their due diligence, and found out he was arguably the hardest working coach in the entire AHL.    Constantly trying to both improve his team but also looking for an edge.  

 

See so much vitriol on this site over Green.   He does make in game moves that sometimes work sometimes don't.  But as far as his credentials go - he's 100% put his time in and done it the right way, nothing was "gifted".    He's not Patrick Roy or Wayne Gretzky.  Or Larry Robinson or even Paul McLean.   As in a former player that was bored and just decided he wanted to coach.   He's a legitimate coach.   I agree with Button. And also it's not Green that is holding EP/BB/PK back.    I'd say it's even odds those some of those  things sort themselves out before he is fired.   

I think we're holding Green back too. 

Time to let him go so that he may truly fulfill his destiny. 

[King Heffy]

10 minutes ago, Hairy Kneel said:

I think we're holding Green back too. 

Time to let him go so that he may truly fulfill his destiny. 

Edited December 5, 2021 by King Heffy

[Hairy Kneel]

6 hours ago, rekker said:

I don't get why a lot of the pundits defend Green. I've even heard the term "he won't be out of a job long". Why? His AHL record is average, NHL record is below average. He's never won a championship at any level. I don't see the draw. 

Radio guys were adamant about this. They laughed at me for even suggesting that Green was inadequate. 

[Hairy Kneel]

7 hours ago, Provost said:

… or the team just isn’t as good as people thought.

Green has always had a clear vision of the style he wanted to play.  A fast, hardworking team that is tenacious on the forecheck. 

 

Benning would say so too and then go out and sign guys who can’t play that style at all.

 

The team needs a lot more than a chance of coach.  It needs a GM who has a vision for what the team identity is, articulate it to the fanbase, and then has the fortitude to go out and make the player moves to make it happen.

Then why have Chiasson on the 4th line? Slow, doesn't hit. Forechecked once, didn't like it. 

Why not bench Dick for not applying his fore check. Or not hitting it. 

 

He's lucky he got Motte back from injury. 

 

 

 

Edited December 5, 2021 by Hairy Kneel

[Tom Sestito]

we only need to play at a 2011 canucks pace the rest of the season to make the playoffs

 

only.

[dougieL]

15 hours ago, *Buzzsaw* said:

All of those screaming hysterically about dumping the entire team and starting all over again need to get their panties untwisted.

 

There is plenty of talent in the roster... but we need a coach who can get that group working together within a well thought out system.

 

The biggest problem right now is the blueline... its weak... but that can be compensated for if the forwards support them with solid backchecking and aggressive physical play in the D Zone.

 

That's the first step... do that and suddenly the rest of the team's game starts to look better.  Offense starts from a good defense.

 

There is no lack of skill between the pipes... Demko is elite and Halak is a veteran backup.

 

And up front we have a young group which is capable of adjusting their game and learning new systems.

 

There is plenty of skill to provide the offense the team needs... but its not being used.

 

Key to making progress is better puck support... right now it is mostly individual efforts to gain the zone with line mates too far separated... rarely do we see creative interplay and a series of passes leading to a grade A scoring opportunity on the rush.  Forwards need to work on more flexible and dynamic movement... criss crossing, trailers, using legal picks, etc.

 

The same applies to the PP... currently it is far too static, with players rarely moving out of their standard positions and passes telegraphed.  It needs a much faster tempo in the passing... it needs the creative use of legal picks to confuse the opposing D... it needs a willingness to take the puck to the net... (look a what Schenn was able to do) and to look for the greasy goal.  If the defenders aren't forced to guess, it makes it easy for them to stay in position and block every shot.

 

Sorry Chicken Little... the sky is not falling.  Get a veteran coach and we will see an improvement.

 

 

 

Vigneault was able to adjust the team's style of play between 2006-07 and 2009-10 to suit the the strengths of the players. Green appears to play the same grinding, dump and chase, attack along the boards style no matter who his players are. The players are constantly chasing the puck. It looks like an exhausting style to play. Other teams seem to play more efficiently by having players in better positions.

Edited December 5, 2021 by dougieL

[Tom Sestito]

3 minutes ago, dougieL said:

Vigneault was able to adjust the team's style of play between 2006-07 and 2009-10 to suit the the strengths of the players. Green appears to play the same grinding, dump and chase, attack along the boards style no matter who his players are. The players are constantly chasing the puck. It looks like an exhausting style to play. Other teams seem to play more efficiently by having players in better positions.

They made some interesting system adjustments that have limited some of the transition opportunities we concede and probably contribute to our defensive metrics being OK at 5 on 5. But, the lack of pressure and simplicity in our offense as a result of these changes has neutered the team. 

 

They were best off playing that stupid rope-a-dope hockey they were playing in 19-20 where they'd just keep games close 5 on 5 and rely on the superstars to win them games. Or at least, have a system in place that enables them the ability to do so.

[Chris12345]

13 minutes ago, Tom Sestito said:

we only need to play at a 2011 canucks pace the rest of the season to make the playoffs

 

only.

Look on the bright side....we only need to play at the current pace to get a good draft pick.

[Tom Sestito]

12 minutes ago, Chris12345 said:

Look on the bright side....we only need to play at the current pace to get a good draft pick.

Wouldn’t hold your breath on us still having that draft pick considering we’ve traded the last two. 

[Chris12345]

7 minutes ago, Tom Sestito said:

Wouldn’t hold your breath on us still having that draft pick considering we’ve traded the last two. 

Oh trust me I have learned the hard way.

 

Best case scenario (other than a magical playoff run) is they go on a run at the end of the year to "build a winning culture" and draft 5th instead of 1st....aka Matthews vs OJ.

[DIBdaQUIB]

1 hour ago, Hairy Kneel said:

Then why have Chiasson on the 4th line? Slow, doesn't hit. Forechecked once, didn't like it. 

Why not bench Dick for not applying his fore check. Or not hitting it. 

 

He's lucky he got Motte back from injury. 

 

 

 

Aside from Motte, who hits on our team?  Who plays hard and with an edge? I think that is one of the most frustrating and disappointing things about this group.  You would expect them to at least play angry when they are getting embarrassed in front of their fans but they show nothing...no hitting...no scrums...no fights...nothing at all!! That to me is more of a symptom.of how broken this team is as  their inability to score or defend. 

Edited December 6, 2021 by DIBdaQUIB

[Ajax-]

6 hours ago, Topcheeze86 said:

Im saying we need new systems all across the board offensively and defensively 

 

baumer needs to go its stale

systems? you seemed like an expert but yet we are all still waiting for any explanation of systems you know and how you would employ them?

[Ajax-]

8 minutes ago, DIBdaQUIB said:

Aside from Motte, who hits on our team?  Who plays hard and with an edge? I think that is one of the most frustrating and disappointing things about this group.  You would expect them to at least play angry when they are getting embarrassed in front of their fans but they show nothing...no hitting...no scrums...no fights...nothing at all!! That to me is more of a symptom.of how broken this team is as  their inability to score or defend. 

Miller, Schenn, Hamonic, Myers

 

buy yes i hear you

[Alflives]

6 minutes ago, Ajax- said:

systems? you seemed like an expert but yet we are all still waiting for any explanation of systems you know and how you would employ them?

I think 5 on 5 we have changed from the last few years.  We no longer forecheck, when the opponents have clear puck on stick heads up possession, with three guys.  Westay back in the neutral zone.  I actually like our5 on 5 systems.  It’s th3 PK I think we need to tweak.  We need to stack up our forwards on the forecheck.  Pressure the first pass, and have the high goreard pinch it off BEFORE THE RED LINE.  if the opponents do gain position in our zone, we must pressure the puck with three guys all over the ice.  And our D can’t LSY DOWN is n the ice n hopes of preventing a cross ice pass any more.  That’s just stupid, especially with two guys who are 6’8 and 6’5.  

I played junior high mixed inter-mural dodgeball, so I know.  And if not for Maryanne Jones, I’d have been an alternate captain too!  So I know sports.  

Edited December 6, 2021 by Alflives

[Ajax-]

3 hours ago, bigbadcanucks said:

With the type of players Canucks have, they need to to play a high pressure forechecking game, with d-men pinching and forwards protecting the pinch.  The exact system they played under AV from 2009 to 2012.  They have the right players and the goalie to play this type of game.  Canucks need to play to win 6-4 / 5-3, rather than hoping to win 2-1. 

 

As well, the Canucks need to protect the puck through the neutral zone.  Too many turnovers in the neutral zone (Miller, Hughes, Pettersson, Boeser are the worst at protecting the puck in the neutral zone) are turning into odd man rushes back into the Canucks zone, and the forwards aren't committed enough to help the d-men when this happens.

 

Defensively, the players need to block shots or get the phuck out of the way. 

Basic stuff, not really systems explained but better than the idiots always complaining "our systems suck, we need better systems"

 

Our PK -  passive inverted T structure to keep them to the outside and force shots from the outside. It is not working. go Back to the Box and like you said block shots. That mean forwards have to laydown and block the odd shot

[Ajax-]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

I think 5 on 5 we have changed from the last few years.  We no longer forecheck, when the opponents have clear puck on stick heads up possession, with three guys.  Westay back in the neutral zone.  I actually like our5 on 5 systems.  It’s th3 PK I think we need to tweak.  We need to stack up our forwards on the forecheck.  Pressure the first pass, and have the high goreard pinch it off BEFORE THE RED LINE.  if the opponents do gain position in our zone, we must pressure the puck with three guys all over the ice.  And our D can’t LSY DOWN is n the ice n hopes of preventing a cross ice pass any more.  That’s just stupid, especially with two guys who are 6’8 and 6’5.  

I agree our 5 on 5 is doing much better this year..... Shaw?

 

PK, if you can't slow them down in the neutral ice, we need to change our PK structure  back to a Box kill and preassure the puck on the OUTSIDE. and block some shots. if Motte can laydown and block a &^@#ing slapshot so can everyone

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Ajax- said:

Basic stuff, not really systems explained but better than the idiots always complaining "our systems suck, we need better systems"

 

Our PK -  passive inverted T structure to keep them to the outside and force shots from the outside. It is not working. go Back to the Box and like you said block shots. That mean forwards have to laydown and block the odd shot

No more laying down!  Stand up!  Attack the puck along all walls with three guys, and that fourth guy must be on the far post.  It’s just like dodgeball. And I was (.almost) an alternate captain of our junior high mixed inter-mural team, so I have sports experience.  

[Hairy Kneel]

24 minutes ago, DIBdaQUIB said:

Aside from Motte, who hits on our team?  Who plays hard and with an edge? I think that is one of the most frustrating and disappointing things about this group.  You would expect them to at least play angry when they are getting embarrassed in front of their fans but they show nothing...no hitting...no scrums...no fights...nothing at all!! That to me is more of a symptom.of how broken this team is as  their inability to score or defend. 

That's quit in its truest form. 

[Hairy Kneel]

1 hour ago, Chris12345 said:

Look on the bright side....we only need to play at the current pace to get a good draft pick.

Always with the positives hey 12345.

[Nuxfanabroad]

Alberta - Bumsville(BC) - California

 

The PO's are as easy as yer abc's kids! It currently resembles a sh*t sandwich..& GREEN, we're stuck-in-the-middle with you.

 

Said this 7-10 days back...

1- Fire travesty

2- Trade Prince Charmin

3- Trade another piece or two(by TDL, Millsy or Bo perhaps) if there's no jump-start