stawns Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 11 minutes ago, Odd. said: Mercer and Holtz coming back for Hughes is insanely underwhelming, respectively. Like I mentioned above, Mercer’s defensive deficiencies, and him having a slow year this year (despite being 21), and Holtz who is undersized and not physically ready for the NHL are risky gambles to bet on for an established defenseman like Hughes. Using the cap to retain Horvat instead of Hughes is another great mistake. We lose a positional and organizational strength to essentially keep Horvat around at a depreciating long term contract while having 2 other 30 year olds with long term depreciating contracts, coupled with 2 young forwards who don’t provide much of an immediate or future impact, I’m sorry but that’s mediocrity written all over. Instead what we can and should do is trade Horvat for a young RHD prospect or an established RHD in the league such as Carlo, Peeke, Cernak or Perbix, etc, use the cap space to find another RHD or a 3rd line center, trade Myers and Schenn for some picks, and move Garland or Boeser for again picks and maybe a short term contract in return, effectively shedding cap space now, and in the future. Sorry, I forgot a 1st in that deal. So Mercer Holtz 1st Severson (expiring) Horvat UFA dman 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 24 minutes ago, Odd. said: Mercer and Holtz coming back for Hughes is insanely underwhelming, respectively. Like I mentioned above, Mercer’s defensive deficiencies, and him having a slow year this year (despite being 21), and Holtz who is undersized and not physically ready for the NHL are risky gambles to bet on for an established defenseman like Hughes. Using the cap to retain Horvat instead of Hughes is another great mistake. We lose a positional and organizational strength to essentially keep Horvat around at a depreciating long term contract while having 2 other 30 year olds with long term depreciating contracts, coupled with 2 young forwards who don’t provide much of an immediate or future impact, I’m sorry but that’s mediocrity written all over. Instead what we can and should do is trade Horvat for a young RHD prospect or an established RHD in the league such as Carlo, Peeke, Cernak or Perbix, etc, use the cap space to find another RHD or a 3rd line center, trade Myers and Schenn for some picks, and move Garland or Boeser for again picks and maybe a short term contract in return, effectively shedding cap space now, and in the future. I'm feeling contemplative on this Christmas Eve, so just going to use this post as a jumping off point. Out Hughes - NJ Miller - Washington Boeser - Nash In Mercer -nj Holtz - nj Severson (expiring) - NJ 1st - NJ McMichael - was Eller (expiring)- Was 1st - Was Fabbro (expiring)- Nash Prokop - Nash 2nd - Nash Three players our, 10 significant pieces back........3 of those are expiring contracts which creates room for Horvat and 2-3 UFA's. They'd take a hit for the rest of this year, which puts them in a great draft position with two additional picks, likely in the top 20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odd. Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 36 minutes ago, stawns said: I'm feeling contemplative on this Christmas Eve, so just going to use this post as a jumping off point. Out Hughes - NJ Miller - Washington Boeser - Nash In Mercer -nj Holtz - nj Severson (expiring) - NJ 1st - NJ McMichael - was Eller (expiring)- Was 1st - Was Fabbro (expiring)- Nash Prokop - Nash 2nd - Nash Three players our, 10 significant pieces back........3 of those are expiring contracts which creates room for Horvat and 2-3 UFA's. They'd take a hit for the rest of this year, which puts them in a great draft position with two additional picks, likely in the top 20. I can see Miller to Washington happening, but Preds aren’t going to be willlint to trade their first considering they’re currently outside of a playoff spot and don’t look to be contenders this year, with an already aging and stale core. With Petey likely to cost at least $11M, how comfortable would you be willing to give Horvat his asking price, which is above the $7.5Mx8 he rejected. He’s likely to get more in the free market by about $1-1.5M more, and in that case, that would be way too much for what he brings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnthonyG Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 1 hour ago, Odd. said: Calling Hughes a PP specialist when he plays 24 minutes a night is laughably false You also mention Hughes is a tier below Fox Makar and Dahlin. That is laughably false. Go and take a look at PPG, also, go and take a look at xGF xGA, take a look at their shot suppression, zone exits, zone entries, defensive zone starts, and you will quickly realize where Hughes ranks among them, which is right around there. Out of curiosity, what sources do you use for entries/exits etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 46 minutes ago, Odd. said: I can see Miller to Washington happening, but Preds aren’t going to be willlint to trade their first considering they’re currently outside of a playoff spot and don’t look to be contenders this year, with an already aging and stale core. With Petey likely to cost at least $11M, how comfortable would you be willing to give Horvat his asking price, which is above the $7.5Mx8 he rejected. He’s likely to get more in the free market by about $1-1.5M more, and in that case, that would be way too much for what he brings. I've got Preds giving up a second for that very reason! Prokop is the main piece in that deal.......I think he could potentially be a more skilled version of Schenn if they develop him right. If they move out those three players, they're giving up $22mish off their cap and getting back expiring contracts. That's a lot of cap to play with, easily enough for Petey and Horvat's $3mish raises and whatever Kuz needs, probably $5mish. They could add 1-2 more UFA depth to the core they would be building around........they could also weaponize their cap space and stock up on picks. That's how you truly add depth, imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FaninMex Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 4 hours ago, stawns said: He's a pp specialist in that that's where he makes his impact. He doesnt score, doesn't penetrate the inside of the ice in the ozone........I had thought he might develop into a rover kind of dman, but that hasn't come to fruition. He's turning out to be more passive than I'd hoped he would be. No, Hughes is not a PP specialist. JT seems to make more things happen. OEL is better on the PP than QH. PP2 gets scoring opportunities because of OEL despite some of the players he has to work with. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quattrobaj Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 (edited) 21 minutes ago, FaninMex said: No, Hughes is not a PP specialist. JT seems to make more things happen. OEL is better on the PP than QH. PP2 gets scoring opportunities because of OEL despite some of the players he has to work with. Honestly I rather have Hughes on PP than OEL.. the only thing OEL has over Hughes is his shot from the point. Hughes is better with the puck and can create room for himself because he is such an elite skater. He is much faster and has way better passing/sticking handling than OEL. If Hughes actually had a good shot he would open up more options for petey and miller. There's a reason why he has 0 goals this season it's because his shots aren't dangerous. Edited December 25, 2022 by quattrobaj 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandmaster Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 17 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said: Anything with Arnold gets a like from me. No words needed…. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Ferlands_Head Posted December 25, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted December 25, 2022 6 hours ago, stawns said: Sorry, I forgot a 1st in that deal. So Mercer Holtz 1st Severson (expiring) Horvat UFA dman Amazing how in this trade we’re acquiring all those assets none of which will improve our defense which is 3rd worst in the league. Instead we create an even greater surplus of top 6 forwards which we don’t need. 1 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Buzzsaw* Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 What people don't understand about Hughes and his play this season is that he been focusing on defense because the team is so bad that way. Time and time again the other team gets a fast break out and Hughes has to put on the jets and motor back to collect the puck before the uncovered opposition forward grabs it. If he had a defensive partner with better wheels, (no disrespect to Schenn, he is playing well this year in his own end clearing the boards and front of net, but he just does not have the footspeed to catch a fast breaking forward) then Hughes could focus on his offensive puck carrying game more and you might see some give and go goals. Hughes is the team's best D defensively, not just offensively. (his plus/minus is not an accurate reflection) He actually should not have to put his focus on D play... he has far more to offer on offense. If he had a big strong D-Partner who could also skate, then you'd see Hughes' offensive stats really take off. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Buzzsaw* Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 1 minute ago, Ferlands_Head said: Amazing how in this trade we’re acquiring all those assets none of which will improve our defense which is 3rd worst in the league. Instead we create an even greater surplus of top 6 forwards which we don’t need. Exactly.... we need to unload at least one and possibly two of our top six to make room for the guys in Abby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Kneel Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 (edited) Severson, Ian Cole, Graves, Gudas, Soucy, and Mayfield all UFA's next year and Schenn and Burroughs There's a whole gang at league minimum too. https://www.spotrac.com/nhl/free-agents/defenseman/ufa/ ps Brady Keeper too. Hope we resign him for Abby. Edited December 25, 2022 by Hairy Kneel 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Kneel Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 (edited) On a lighter note Sharangovich NJ Good little forward Edited December 25, 2022 by Hairy Kneel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Kneel Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 7 hours ago, Ferlands_Head said: Amazing how in this trade we’re acquiring all those assets none of which will improve our defense which is 3rd worst in the league. Instead we create an even greater surplus of top 6 forwards which we don’t need. That's what you use the cap space and you use your fwd depth for more moves They are also equally in need of C's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gawdzukes Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 Moar forwards lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post -Vintage Canuck- Posted December 25, 2022 Author Popular Post Share Posted December 25, 2022 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 I'm fine with getting more forwards; Take forwards from team A trade some forwards to team B for a couple of d men. works out fine. I'm beginning to think a 3 way deal is the most likely outcome here. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted December 25, 2022 Share Posted December 25, 2022 18 minutes ago, Gurn said: I'm fine with getting more forwards; Take forwards from team A trade some forwards to team B for a couple of d men. works out fine. I'm beginning to think a 3 way deal is the most likely outcome here. Exactly 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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