[PGT] San Jose Sharks at Vancouver Canucks | Dec. 27, 2022

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, BlakeQuinnAndEggs said:

I agree but we won't be able to change the supporting cast with the way this team is constructed and capped out. Plus we need to re-up Pettersson in less than 2 years.

 

Trading Bo makes sense, we can load up on futures to start re stocking the cupboard and it will give us some cap flexibility to find a top d man and some more checking and pk specialists.

 

Our offense won't win us playoff series but our defense will lose them. Heck just making the playoffs is farfetched for this group as the last 8 years have shown.

IMHAO our new management, in their first year, has shown they can change the supporting group even with the lack of assets and cap space.  

Demko 5 mil

Millet 8 mil

Hughed 8 mil

Petey 10.5 mil

Bo 7.5 mil

 

I think we will have these core five for around 40 mil.  That leaves lots of room to build out a fantastic supporting cast.  Going to take more time.  Myers, Pearson are 2024 TDL guys, unless Allvin can work magic sooner.  Garland and Boeser will be gone before then.  The change to the supporting cast is still in its beginning.  

But we have a very good core five.  Need to keep those guys.  

[-Vintage Canuck-]

15 minutes ago, stawns said:

They should have gone with a coach with more longevity, one that could grow with the team.  BB has always been a placeholder for someone else and I didn't, and don't, see the point. 

I wonder if Patrik Allvin would be interested?

 

 

[stawns]

Just now, -Vintage Canuck- said:

I wonder if Patrik Allvin would be interested?

 

 

I wouldn't be surprised if they went with a euro coach actually 

[BC_Hawk]

8 hours ago, JamesB said:

Nice to see the Canucks get over 500 after their best 3-game stretch of the season. My key takeaways from tonight against the Sharks are as follows.

 

1. Sorry to start with a cliche but the team with the better goalie usually wins and that was true tonight.  The Canucks were also the better team overall but it was a lot closer than the score indicated.  Earlier in the season a couple of the those big saves by Martin were going in instead and Reimer did not have a great night for San Jose.  In terms of expected goals (Natural Stat Trick) the Canucks had a slight edge, but it was close.

 

2. Although the Horvat line had a huge night in terms of scoring, the Pettersson line actually had better underlying numbers (expected goals).  Of course,  the Horvat line was hard matched against the Hertl line so they faced tougher competition. And they won that battle by a big margin.  Great to see Boeser have a good night.  That  line -- Horvat, Mikheyev and Boeser looks great.

 

3. The Pettersson line had great numbers with an expected goals for percentage of 75%. There is kind of a Pederson bandwagon developing, but I am not sold yet.  Petey is playing great and Kuz is also playing well. I think almost any forward would look good in Pederson's  spot.  But, as he was  a throw-in in what was already a great deal to get Bear for a 5th round pick (with retained salary as well!) he is found money. But jury still out on whether Pederson is good enough to allow Petey to play to his full potential on a long-run basis.

 

4. Miller's line was buried in the numbers, although they were hard-matched against the Couture line.  But the team needs more from Miller and Garland on a consistent basis. And I want Lazar to do well but he has a hard time generating offence.

 

5. I have been critical of Tyler Myers but he played well tonight. He and OEL were hard-matched against Couture and Meier  (San Jose's best line) and Myers in particular did well.

 

6. Karlsson was only on the ice for about 27.5 minutes.  It seemed like more. 

Good Summary…couple comments:
 

2) Horvats line does look great, though I hope Pearson comes back soon so that can free up Ilya to jump on Petterson’s line

 

3) I’m not sold on Pederson either. I watched him closely last night and plays often died on his stick. Same as when they were first signed, I think a Ilya-Petterson-Kuz line is absolutely perfect; speed, size, and tons of skill.

 

4) I love what Lazar brings, but he doesn’t generate any offense based on skill (just effort). I think it is time to bring Podz back up to see how he looks. The Podz-Miller-Garland line was dynamite late last year. That would create a ton of great 4th line options too.

 

5) The d has looked better the last bit; few notes:

- maybe not for forever, but I like that Hughes-Bear pairing. Bear moves the puck well, and Highes seems to be flying since they got paired. Maybe he is over his injury? Maybe confidence? Maybe Bear? Who knows, but keep it up.

- OEL-Myers are looking good again now. I’d still keep the for sale sign up on him, but wouldn’t be too mad to keep Myers into the off-season

- Now this is where Schenn should be; best 5th Dman around. Look what he did last night; made Stillman look good. Hopefully we can see a 3rd pair of Dermott-Schenn soon. Send Stillman to Abby please.

 

[Gawdzukes]

48 minutes ago, Devron said:

I disagree, he would have been paid in free agency term and all

I don't disagree. You keep missing the point though. He would be signed by a team that was looking to win now. Because of the tight financial landscape of the league very few teams were/are capable of doing that.

 

Now instead of some other team having to deal with that contract and it's repercussions (as a go for it now team) we are now saddled with it and it'll stop us from signing Bo/Kuz, and or other defenceman, plus it'll be that much harder for us to get rid of, even if management choose to go that route.

[J-23]

The untouchables 

 

[Canuckfanforlife82]

4 minutes ago, Alflives said:

IMHAO our new management, in their first year, has shown they can change the supporting group even with the lack of assets and cap space.  

Demko 5 mil

Millet 8 mil

Hughed 8 mil

Petey 10.5 mil

Bo 7.5 mil

 

I think we will have these core five for around 40 mil.  That leaves lots of room to build out a fantastic supporting cast.  Going to take more time.  Myers, Pearson are 2024 TDL guys, unless Allvin can work magic sooner.  Garland and Boeser will be gone before then.  The change to the supporting cast is still in its beginning.  

But we have a very good core five.  Need to keep those guys.  

The D is a major problem and you haven't offered any solutions as to how they can bring in impact players. Teams just don't let impact dmen walk anymore. Saying they can do it is one thing but after a year management still hasn't been able to figure it out except sign more forwards. You can't magically come up with more picks. You can hope if you want to but there is a ton of reality to keep in mind here.

Edited December 28, 2022 by Canuckfanforlife82

[canuckleheads fan]

8 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

That depends on the return you get with a trade.  Need to look at the overall value.  If we are trading Miller for a pick and that pick is a nobody then all we have left is Horvat.  If we trade Horvat and the player we get back turns into Tage Thompson, plus we have Miller as well, then the 2nd option of trading Horvat would be better long term value.

 

We won't know if we will be better off for at least 3-4 years, as that is how long a guy like Tage Thompson took to break out...

Honestly, we need to clear Miller, Garland, and Meyer's contracts off the books. For Myers and Garland, at least a couple of second rounders would do. For Miller, Rutherford blew his chance for a big haul and now we need the cap space to resign Bo and Kuzmenko now and Petey after next year. I don't think the team can afford to lose Bo, who is just reaching his peak, and still compete in a couple of years. Kuzmenko is proving to be the perfect winger for Petey, and I don't think he would be easy to replace either. Miller has turned himself into a 3C with some PP upside, for which he is being paid far too much. His production is being replace by Mikheyev, who's faster though less physical. And we now have NHL caliber talent in Abbey to replace the losses of Garland and Miller.

[Locke Lamora]

15 minutes ago, Goal:thecup said:

Which tends to show the DAWG rating is not always very accurate at all, doesn't it?

I’d go far as to same its highly suggestive as to how lame it is.

 

Cool name though. DAWG. Woof indeed. 

[bishopshodan]

9 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

I'd rather have a guy that can be responsible as a Center myself. Miller has been crap in the middle all year despite you saying it's everything but that. I'm pretty sure he was moved off Center initially because he wasn't doing the job. That was well documented. We'll see moving forward what happens but being placed on the wing while playing an AHLer at Center because of BB's lack of trust in the 30 wingers on this team is far fetched at best.

 

JT saving Bo's crappy season first, now Centering a line all by himself.

 

 

What a wonky response.

This is what the crew was saying pre game, and intermission. That BB wants 3 centres and he wasn't thrilled about his wingers etc..

 

Who's the AHL centre? JT?

 

Are you being intellectually honest here?

 

 

[Canuckfanforlife82]

5 minutes ago, canuckleheads fan said:

Honestly, we need to clear Miller, Garland, and Meyer's contracts off the books. For Myers and Garland, at least a couple of second rounders would do. For Miller, Rutherford blew his chance for a big haul and now we need the cap space to resign Bo and Kuzmenko now and Petey after next year. I don't think the team can afford to lose Bo, who is just reaching his peak, and still compete in a couple of years. Kuzmenko is proving to be the perfect winger for Petey, and I don't think he would be easy to replace either. Miller has turned himself into a 3C with some PP upside, for which he is being paid far too much. His production is being replace by Mikheyev, who's faster though less physical. And we now have NHL caliber talent in Abbey to replace the losses of Garland and Miller.

Forwards were never the issue. It's d, d, d. We just don't have the assets to fix it right now. Don't you think if they could have gotten rid of Garland and Myers for second rounders it would have been done by now? The reality is that we will need to offer sweeteners in a trade to get them off our books. 

Edited December 28, 2022 by Canuckfanforlife82

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, Canuckfanforlife82 said:

The D is a major problem and you haven't offered any solutions as to how they can bring in impact players. Teams just don't let impact dmen walk anymore. Saying they can do it is one thing but after a year management still hasn't been able to figure it out. You can't magically come up with more picks. You can hope if you want to but there is a ton of reality to keep in mind here.

Bear has looked excellent with Hughes.  Yes, Hughes makes his partners look good, but Bear seems to be supporting ?Hughes better than others (since Tanev) which allows Quinn to be more free offensively 5 on 5.  The moves already made have improved the club’s supporting cast.  Still more to come.  Summer 2024, after Myers and Pearson are gone, will see cap freed up to sign more expensive UFA to help on D.  It’s a process.  But trading away our core five IMHAO isn’t needed, and would be a mistake.  

[Pickly]

3 minutes ago, canuckleheads fan said:

Honestly, we need to clear Miller, Garland, and Meyer's contracts off the books. For Myers and Garland, at least a couple of second rounders would do. For Miller, Rutherford blew his chance for a big haul and now we need the cap space to resign Bo and Kuzmenko now and Petey after next year. I don't think the team can afford to lose Bo, who is just reaching his peak, and still compete in a couple of years. Kuzmenko is proving to be the perfect winger for Petey, and I don't think he would be easy to replace either. Miller has turned himself into a 3C with some PP upside, for which he is being paid far too much. His production is being replace by Mikheyev, who's faster though less physical. And we now have NHL caliber talent in Abbey to replace the losses of Garland and Miller.

Lol if the Canucks were offered (at least) a couple of second rounders for Myers and Garland they would already be gone. Teams don’t want to take on bigger cap hits at the moment because there are few teams who have cap space and the only way you are getting rid of Myers or Garland is if you attach an asset. As for replacing Millers production in Abby, who are you referring to?

[BC_Hawk]

1 minute ago, Canuckfanforlife82 said:

The do is a major problem and you haven't offered any solutions as to how they can bring in impact players. Saying is one thing but after a year management still hasn't been able to figure it out. You can't magically come up with more picks. You can hope if you want to but there is a ton of reality to keep in mind here.

Did you not read his comments about Beoser and Garland? That’s almost 12m opened up. Trade Pearson and Myers…that’s another 9m.

 

 Just as we did in the summer, we still need one top pair RHD; I’ll give credit to PA for Bear for bringing that number down to one. PA just needs to get off his ass and find this years Marino. Hell, maybe even trade for Severson to see how he fits in the last part of the year if you could unload Myers.

 

 

[aqua59]

56 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Sharks were coming off a dominating 5-2 win over Minnesota.  The Wild have the same record as the Jets.  NHL teams are all good.  Got to play the right way and get solid goaltending to win, no matter who the opponent is. 

Don't be disillusioned Alf  I  do how ever love your positive outlook. 

 

[Canuckfanforlife82]

6 minutes ago, BC_Hawk said:

Did you not read his comments about Beoser and Garland? That’s almost 12m opened up. Trade Pearson and Myers…that’s another 9m.

 

 Just as we did in the summer, we still need one top pair RHD; I’ll give credit to PA for Bear for bringing that number down to one. PA just needs to get off his ass and find this years Marino. Hell, maybe even trade for Severson to see how he fits in the last part of the year if you could unload Myers.

 

 

We will have to offer sweeteners for players like Boeser and Garland as no one will want those contracts or bring in players who have also had down years and their careers need to be rejuvenated through a new start. 

Edited December 28, 2022 by Canuckfanforlife82

[Pickly]

3 minutes ago, Canuckfanforlife82 said:

We will have to offer sweeteners for players like Boeser and Garland as no one will want those contracts or bring in players who have also had down years and their careers need to be rejuvenated through a new start. 

This. Getting picks for underachieving players on bad contracts is not going to happen. Let alone 1st and 2nd round picks. You trade Garland you get a comparable player in return on a similar deal, perhaps with a year less term to somewhat help alleviate your situation. If a team had already offered a 2nd for Boeser he would have been dealt already. With the cap supposedly only going up minimally next season this is the reality we face. Prepare to be underwhelmed if and when the Canucks make trades. 

[chon derry]

5 minutes ago, BC_Hawk said:

Did you not read his comments about Beoser and Garland? That’s almost 12m opened up. Trade Pearson and Myers…that’s another 9m.

 

 Just as we did in the summer, we still need one top pair RHD; I’ll give credit to PA for Bear for bringing that number down to one. PA just needs to get off his ass and find this years Marino. Hell, maybe even trade for Severson to see how he fits in the last part of the year if you could unload Myers.

 

 

Beat me to it. None of us are privy to who’s going to be moved out but to suggest this team doesn’t have assets to move is just wrong. If horvat goes, on his own he garners  a pkg deal coming back.or a Dman of equivalent value.  Speaking of pkg deals jr pa could put a pkg deal of peripheral players together. For a dman. Plenty of possibility’s. The sky isn’t falling.