(Rumour) 4 teams interested in J.T. Miller

[ToTellTheTruth]

6 minutes ago, AnthonyG said:

This isnt a rebuild….. this is not going to take half of someones career to turn around.

1) do we have troubles scoring goals? Nope

2) can our PK improve? YUP

3) Can our goalies play better? YUP

 

Just fixing a simple PK structure and getting better goaltending on the PK and in all situations, will lead to several more wins.

Say what you want about D, our goalies have ultimately still sh*t the bed every game and let in minimum 1 bad goal. Our PK is going down in the history books and not for good reason either.  Your best PKer is supposed to be your goalie… guess who hasnt been our best PKer? Our goalies.

Our D is not contender material, but it sure as hell is good enough to compete for a playoff spot. It showed that last season. As soon as our goalies began to play better and then our PK got significantly better, we were one of the hottest teams in the NHL the final 57 games and thats not a fluke, thats 2/3 of a season. 
its been 2 consecutive seasons of poor goaltending for long stretches and a historically bad PK.

Rebuilds don't take 8 years to accomplish, NJD, Buffalo (2X), Ottawa.

Not if a team has cap space to use.

Especially if Bally Sports and other RBC's shut down or go tits up, the cap goes down or stays flat for more time.

 

The goal of becoming a cup contender has to viewed as only 3 or 4 players are good enough. This team with all the players has been a bottom feeder so long that fans forget what a contender looks like. The team has been a bottom feeder right there with Arizona, Buffalo, Ottawa, Detroit for years. They have been the worst of the bunch over the last 5 years, in the league. NJD rebuild started 4 years ago, Ottawa just over 3 years, Buffalo's 2nd, 3 years ago, Detroit 4 years ago

 

Quite true the goalie is usually the best PKer but some teams haven't been depending upon Norris level goaltending and they win more than the Canucks. Rutherford stated it outright, Demko has been covering up too many mistakes. 

Markstrom did the same before him too and Luongo before him.

I know many still think McLean was great but really the defence was outstanding and the forwards, that was a case of the goalie being good enough on a great team. Detroit and recently Colorado had pedestrian goalies and won multiple playoff rounds.

But the goaltending has not been up to the standard of what the Canucks need right now.

 

As far as half a career, Miller is already two thirds through his

[ToTellTheTruth]

17 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

Wouldn't that be wild if WAS traded for Miller, out of nowhere. 

 

to WAS - Miller (10% = $800K starting next season) + ?

to VAN - Strome, McMichael and Iorio

Don't even need to retain, take on Mantha and a 2025 unprotected 1rst.

[spook007]

2 hours ago, chon derry said:

OEL was brought in to replace elder. Both players at earlier stages gave both a decent defensive side as well as getting involved in the offence. But the difference between the 2 was elder as he lost his foot speed put more emphasis on the D side of his play. Staying on the line. His down side was his shot which never got thru. But became more defensive minded. OEL needs to simplify his game similarly. 

100%...

 

same as Myers. D first and foremost. 
We see... at the start of the season OEL played hard around the net and was mixing it up.... but its been a while now. 
We are good up front offensively, so getting the D to play D, and getting the forward to play at both end of the pitch... could be the first major step in the right direction. 

[JeremyCuddles]

22 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

Wouldn't that be wild if WAS traded for Miller, out of nowhere. 

 

to WAS - Miller (10% = $800K starting next season) + ?

to VAN - Strome, McMichael and Iorio

Retaining 800k for 7 years is absolutely a no-go. Miller is fine at his price tag. There are lesser players making more.

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[AnthonyG]

12 minutes ago, ToTellTheTruth said:

Rebuilds don't take 8 years to accomplish, NJD, Buffalo (2X), Ottawa.

Not if a team has cap space to use.

Especially if Bally Sports and other RBC's shut down or go tits up, the cap goes down or stays flat for more time.

 

The goal of becoming a cup contender has to viewed as only 3 or 4 players are good enough. This team with all the players has been a bottom feeder so long that fans forget what a contender looks like. The team has been a bottom feeder right there with Arizona, Buffalo, Ottawa, Detroit for years. They have been the worst of the bunch over the last 5 years, in the league. NJD rebuild started 4 years ago, Ottawa just over 3 years, Buffalo's 2nd, 3 years ago, Detroit 4 years ago

 

Quite true the goalie is usually the best PKer but some teams haven't been depending upon Norris level goaltending and they win more than the Canucks. Rutherford stated it outright, Demko has been covering up too many mistakes. 

Markstrom did the same before him too and Luongo before him.

I know many still think McLean was great but really the defence was outstanding and the forwards, that was a case of the goalie being good enough on a great team. Detroit and recently Colorado had pedestrian goalies and won multiple playoff rounds.

But the goaltending has not been up to the standard of what the Canucks need right now.

 

As far as half a career, Miller is already two thirds through his

Actually rebuilds take a minimum of 8 if you do not draft generational talent or you have nothing to accelerate a rebuild.

 

NJD has had how many top 10 picks in the last decade? Not just top 10, but how many top THREE??

 

Going back to 2011 they have had 5 top 5 picks. An additional 2 top 10.

Their rebuilding started a loooong time ago. 

 

If you dig deep enough, you’ll see how long it took almost every team to become successful through the draft. 
you dont draft a team in 1 draft, it takes several years of drafting and 5 is still too quick because picks dont all pan out. Plus the only way you can assure your best chances is to win 1st overall and you hope to god its McDavid every time because that is the only way you can rebuild in under 5 years

[Elias Pettersson]

Miller, like Boessr isn't going anywhere.  It's over.  Time to move forward...

[KoreanHockeyFan]

 

[NewbieCanuckFan]

1 hour ago, spook007 said:

Cheers amigo. 
you kinda answered your own question there  

Unless Tocchet tells PA that we will go nowhere with OEL, I think we have to be prepared for him to stick around at least another year. 
Next year when Myers is gone, they may take the bull by the horns or find a decent rhd to play with OEL. If we strike it lucky and find a rhd that can play with OEL ( play well that is), we could maybe be fine with OEL as a second or even third pairing, but I have tempered expectations for that to happen. 

Myers (imho) is far more easily moveable.  I question whether we'd have to retain any salary once his bonus is paid out as well.

[spook007]

2 minutes ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

Myers (imho) is far more easily moveable.  I question whether we'd have to retain any salary once his bonus is paid out as well.

Absolutely... however, they may even be able to get something for him at next tdl. 
we may not have to retain, but if we do, it wouldn't be much of a problem. 1 year only. 

[ToTellTheTruth]

31 minutes ago, AnthonyG said:

Actually rebuilds take a minimum of 8 if you do not draft generational talent or you have nothing to accelerate a rebuild.

 

NJD has had how many top 10 picks in the last decade? Not just top 10, but how many top THREE??

 

Going back to 2011 they have had 5 top 5 picks. An additional 2 top 10.

Their rebuilding started a loooong time ago. 

 

If you dig deep enough, you’ll see how long it took almost every team to become successful through the draft. 
you dont draft a team in 1 draft, it takes several years of drafting and 5 is still too quick because picks dont all pan out. Plus the only way you can assure your best chances is to win 1st overall and you hope to god its McDavid every time because that is the only way you can rebuild in under 5 years

They did like the Canucks, hung on after their cup run trying to put a bandaid on the problems.

 

It wasn't until 2018/19 season they started trading away vets for picks in earnest.

 

Don't mix up when the rebuild started with trying to hang on and re-whatever to stay competitive. Even the quick tank job earlier was followed with trading for big name players.

 

From 2017 on they had 51 draft picks, a gain of 17, they had 9 first round picks in the last 5 drafts, 3 1rst's more yet to make the team regularly.

 

 

[Ted Lasso]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Miller, like Boessr isn't going anywhere.  It's over.  Time to move forward...

These returns sound less than underwhelming.  No thank you

[ToTellTheTruth]

1 hour ago, N7Nucks said:

Retaining 800k for 7 years is absolutely a no-go. Miller is fine at his price tag. There are lesser players making more.

Why?

Rutherford already stated that Miller's 8 million would be negligible when the cap goes up, the team has carried Holtby's and Virtanen's buy outs for the last year, that is over two million so what is a mil by comparison? And if they traded a million dollars for 7 million in cap space with the value of cap space is that not a good trade? Especially if there is an asset coming back?

 

Anything can be done with cap space, not so much with an 8 million dollar NMC contract. Flexibility might be worth it.

[MattWN.]

Honestly, the more you think about Miller to the Penguins, the more it makes sense. 

The window is clearly shrinking for Pittsburgh with Crosby, Malkin, and Letang.

Miller gives them the depth to make one or two more "runs."

Once the Penguins trio retires, they're going to be in for a LONG rebuild.

They have one of the shallowest prospect pools in the league, and if they load up this year it will only get worse.

That being said, if 3 years from now they go into a full rebuild, they'll the ability to retain on Miller and recoup assets in picks/prospects without jeopardizing their competitiveness now. So long as Miller keeps some sort of skill base moving forward, there's no reason they couldn't retain on the last half of his contract and get a good return. (I don't think they stand a chance either way this year in the East, but whatever)

If the return is anything like we've seen posted, there isn't a lot of downside now for Pittsburgh, and possibly some upside later. 

 

 

All that to say, we shouldn't be retaining shit on Millers deal, and there better be picks along with their average Dmen. 

Edited March 1, 2023 by MattWN.

[Canucks Curse]

Just now, MattWN. said:

Honestly, the more you think about Miller to the Penguins, the more it makes sense. 

The window is clearly shrinking for Pittsburgh with Crosby, Malkin, and Letang.

Miller gives them the depth to make one or two more "runs."

Once the Penguins trio retires, they're going to be in for a LONG rebuild.

They have one of the shallowest prospect pools in the league, and if they load up this year it will only get worse.

That being said, if 3 years from now they go into a full rebuild, they'll the ability to retain on Miller and recoup assets in picks/prospects without jeopardizing their competitiveness now. So long as Miller keeps some sort of skill base moving forward, there's no reason they couldn't retain on the last half of his contract and get a good return. (I don't think they stand a chance either way this year in the East, but whatever)

If the return is anything like we've seen posted, there isn't a lot of downside now for Pittsburgh, and possibly some upside later. 

 

the thing is hex tall is an idiot, who knows what will happen, Miller is exactly what they need up front but it sounds like they also have D issues, tbh, Hextall has left this all to the bitter end and they should have tried to get Miller last summer

[MattWN.]

2 minutes ago, Canucks Curse said:

the thing is hex tall is an idiot, who knows what will happen, Miller is exactly what they need up front but it sounds like they also have D issues, tbh, Hextall has left this all to the bitter end and they should have tried to get Miller last summer

To be fair, the guy took an overwhelming number of Felix Potvin uppercuts, it's not his fault. 

[NewbieCanuckFan]

17 minutes ago, spook007 said:

Absolutely... however, they may even be able to get something for him at next tdl. 
we may not have to retain, but if we do, it wouldn't be much of a problem. 1 year only. 

Yeah he might even be able to get his game back to where it was before this season (he's been ok for us prior to this season imho).  

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[Canucks Curse]

Just now, -Vintage Canuck- said:

 

who is JT Muller? Cousins with Ferris Bueller? 

[JeremyCuddles]

12 minutes ago, ToTellTheTruth said:

Why?

Rutherford already stated that Miller's 8 million would be negligible when the cap goes up, the team has carried Holtby's and Virtanen's buy outs for the last year, that is over two million so what is a mil by comparison? And if they traded a million dollars for 7 million in cap space with the value of cap space is that not a good trade? Especially if there is an asset coming back?

 

Anything can be done with cap space, not so much with an 8 million dollar NMC contract. Flexibility might be worth it.

I dunno if you noticed, but we been complete ass the last few years. Likely cause we keep having dead cap on the books making it hard to build an actual team. 800k matters, especially when we'll still be feeling for almost an entire decade. Teams don't make a habit of carrying deadcap for the better part of a decade. It's why the OEL buyout idea is so moronic. And Miller absolutely should not be retained on. He is a good player worth his price tag. At least for the next 4 years. How it ages is anyone's guess.