Edit- Rick Tocchet Expected To Be Next Head Coach

[Odd.]

15 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Why do we have to?  It's our responsibility as fans to make it clear that this criminal sack of **** is not welcome here and to run him out of town by any means necessary. 

Why do you hate Tocchet? Do you automatically just see someone convicted of a crime and absolutely go ape shit on them? Especially nonviolent, non exploiting criminals?

 

You have these absurd takes of moral superiority which is absolutely condescending and disingenuous.
 

Do you think people aren’t allowed second chances, and any type of crime they commit should put them in jail for life? You were spouting nonsense saying Tocchet should be in prison, almost 17 years later after he already did his time.

Edited January 17, 2023 by Connor McDooDoo

[King Heffy]

33 minutes ago, Connor McDooDoo said:

Why do you hate Tocchet? Do you automatically just see someone convicted of a crime and absolutely go ape shit on them? Especially nonviolent, non exploiting criminals?

 

You have these absurd takes of moral superiority which is absolutely condescending and disingenuous.
 

Do you think people aren’t allowed second chances, and any type of crime they commit should put them in jail for life? You were spouting nonsense saying Tocchet should be in prison, almost 17 years later after he already did his time.

It was allegedly associated with organized crime; I do not consider that to be non-exploiting.  While people are certainly allowed second chances, that second chance does not need to be in the form of a head coaching job of the Canucks.  He also was enough of a scumbag in Arizona to drive OEL out of town; as we are stuck with OEL, would it not be a smarter move to hire a coach who can use him and isn't a proven failure as a coach and as a man?
 

Tocchet didn't do his time and got off with probation, which is far too soft a punishment.  Bottom line is there is zero excuse for allowing this vermin anywhere near our dressing room.  I absolutely won't stand idly by and allow Rutherford to disgrace the franchise by hiring this bottom feeding parasite.

Edited January 17, 2023 by King Heffy

[saucypass]

49 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

It was allegedly associated with organized crime; I do not consider that to be non-exploiting.  While people are certainly allowed second chances, that second chance does not need to be in the form of a head coaching job of the Canucks.  He also was enough of a scumbag in Arizona to drive OEL out of town; as we are stuck with OEL, would it not be a smarter move to hire a coach who can use him and isn't a proven failure as a coach and as a man?
 

Tocchet didn't do his time and got off with probation, which is far too soft a punishment.  Bottom line is there is zero excuse for allowing this vermin anywhere near our dressing room.  I absolutely won't stand idly by and allow Rutherford to disgrace the franchise by hiring this bottom feeding parasite.

Yeah I don’t see how Tocchet is the one to revive OEL. I don’t see how Tocchet is the one to revive the Canucks in general. Hasn’t won anything and his Arizona team played abysmally. Can someone explain the logic of this hire please? 

[Master Mind]

22 hours ago, The.Burrowers said:

Gillis inherited that entire core with a few relatively small exceptions.  He did some good but a lot of bad too and the absolutely piss poor drafting screwed this team for years.

Sure but the poor drafting is made up for by the 2011 run.

 

None of our GMs have done well with drafting and developing players since then. At least Gillis gave fans the greatest era of hockey in our franchise's history, while his successors haven't come close to matching that.

[DeNiro]

14 minutes ago, saucypass said:

Yeah I don’t see how Tocchet is the one to revive OEL. I don’t see how Tocchet is the one to revive the Canucks in general. Hasn’t won anything and his Arizona team played abysmally. Can someone explain the logic of this hire please? 

He had the 4th highest wins total of the last 12 seasons for the Coyotes behind Tippett who had three straight 40-50 win seasons when the Coyotes were actually trying to be good.

 

He averaged around .500 hockey for a team that was trying to lose and had top scorers with like 45 points for three years (Keller, Scmaltz, Kessel). 
 

I would say he did about as good as one could expect on a team that had No interest in winning or spending to the cap.

[jyu]

1 hour ago, King Heffy said:

It was allegedly associated with organized crime; I do not consider that to be non-exploiting.  While people are certainly allowed second chances, that second chance does not need to be in the form of a head coaching job of the Canucks.  He also was enough of a scumbag in Arizona to drive OEL out of town; as we are stuck with OEL, would it not be a smarter move to hire a coach who can use him and isn't a proven failure as a coach and as a man?
 

Tocchet didn't do his time and got off with probation, which is far too soft a punishment.  Bottom line is there is zero excuse for allowing this vermin anywhere near our dressing room.  I absolutely won't stand idly by and allow Rutherford to disgrace the franchise by hiring this bottom feeding parasite.

Ok so what do you plan on doing to stop him from hiring  Tocchet?

Edited January 17, 2023 by jyu

[King Heffy]

5 minutes ago, jyu said:

Ok so what do you plan on doing to stop him from hiring  Tocchet?

Make it damn clear that he isn't welcome.  If he goes ahead and brings in this sack of ****, I'll reconsider which team I support.

[Tom Sestito]

1 hour ago, King Heffy said:

It was allegedly associated with organized crime; I do not consider that to be non-exploiting.  While people are certainly allowed second chances, that second chance does not need to be in the form of a head coaching job of the Canucks.  He also was enough of a scumbag in Arizona to drive OEL out of town; as we are stuck with OEL, would it not be a smarter move to hire a coach who can use him and isn't a proven failure as a coach and as a man?
 

Tocchet didn't do his time and got off with probation, which is far too soft a punishment.  Bottom line is there is zero excuse for allowing this vermin anywhere near our dressing room.  I absolutely won't stand idly by and allow Rutherford to disgrace the franchise by hiring this bottom feeding parasite.

No real disagreement with with the betting stuff.

 

However, I do think it is a potential bonus that Tocchet and OEL hate each other. A coach isn't going to change the fact that OEL has Danny Dekeyser's legs and looks disinterested every game. If they can drive him out of the organization, that's good. 

[King Heffy]

4 minutes ago, Tom Sestito said:

No real disagreement with with the betting stuff.

 

However, I do think it is a potential bonus that Tocchet and OEL hate each other. A coach isn't going to change the fact that OEL has Danny Dekeyser's legs and looks disinterested every game. If they can drive him out of the organization, that's good. 

Not great when his contract his hard to move and you have a coach who will drive his value down even more.  Also a super bad look for getting anyone else to agree to come here given Tocchet's known character issues.

Edited January 17, 2023 by King Heffy

[MaxVerstappen33]

According to Wiki, Tocchet never coached in a junior program.... ? Right to the NHL

[King Heffy]

6 minutes ago, MaxVerstappen33 said:

According to Wiki, Tocchet never coached in a junior program.... ? Right to the NHL

Are we sure he's even allowed around minors after his conviction?

[DownUndaCanuck]

Everyone wanted Maurice and look what a bad job he's done in Florida, now we want another guy like Tocchet? Canucks management focusing on the wrong areas here, a coaching change will do nothing. If anything, we want a coach who is used to developing young guys, not someone who's never coached in the minor leagues and then just has an average .500 NHL career with Arizona...

 

I'd rather just stick it out with BB until we fix our roster.

[jyu]

9 hours ago, Tom Sestito said:

No real disagreement with with the betting stuff.

 

However, I do think it is a potential bonus that Tocchet and OEL hate each other. A coach isn't going to change the fact that OEL has Danny Dekeyser's legs and looks disinterested every game. If they can drive him out of the organization, that's good. 

Potential bonus?

 

A rift between one of the veteran players wearing an A and the new coach right off the bat on a team that already is reportedly having dysfunctional locker room?

 

I see it more as a potential risk, no a surefire risk.

 

[Petterson649]

I think Bruce is a good energy guy, can really boost the spirit of the players when needed.

 

But his lineup management just sucks.  Seems to just go with his gut or mixes up the lines HOPING something good will happen. No wonder there is no chemistry between players or cohesiveness as a team. There is no doubt this is a contributing factor to our poor defensive play as well

 

We need a coach who can build lines and making them work long term.  

[EddieVedder]

So much bad karma if this coaching change is made.

[Odd.]

12 hours ago, Tom Sestito said:

No real disagreement with with the betting stuff.

 

However, I do think it is a potential bonus that Tocchet and OEL hate each other. A coach isn't going to change the fact that OEL has Danny Dekeyser's legs and looks disinterested every game. If they can drive him out of the organization, that's good. 

Poor take.
 

We don’t need any more of these types of behind the scenes crap. If OEL is moved out I’d hope it’s done in good faith, not because he was forced out because of rifts behind the bench. This will severely hinder our ability to retain or bring people back, with the already toxic locker room environment and a clown show of a management group who continue to show unprofessionalism unlike this organization has seen before since the Keenan days.

Edited January 17, 2023 by Odd.

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

I honestly don’t believe the OEL-Tocchet relationship and their past history in Arizona would be much of an issue, if Rick Tocchet is hired as the next Canucks head coach.

 

Lots has been said and written about the “rift.” And it’s true that Tocchet wanted OEL to be more “fiery” and play with more intensity and passion. He definitely challenged OEL to be a stronger and more vocal leader and tried to push some buttons with him. And sometimes that backfired. But for all the talk about Tocchet embarrassing and disrespecting OEL, it seems like Coyotes fans were more upset than Ekman-Larsson himself. 
 

For OEL’s part, here are some quotes where he discusses his relationship with Tocchet:

(2020 interview)

“I think we have a great relationship. I think he’s a great coach and I’m excited to play for him again. 

We have talked about this before, but it’s always hard for a new coach to come in and get to know all of his players and there’s always going to be times when I look at it one way and he looks at it another, but you’ve got to have that respect for the person and the coach and it goes the other way around with Toc for his players. I feel like that’s not an issue. We have a good relationship and we have been talking about a lot of stuff.  It’s not like we agree on everything but at least we talk and at the end we have a good relationship. I don’t see that as a problem.”

(2021 interview, after Tocchet was fired)

"He just loves the game. He just wants to get better every day, it doesn't matter if he's a player or a coach," Ekman-Larsson said. "I feel like he made all of the players and guys around him better."

 

Coyotes fans (and many other fans and analysts around the league) have talked a lot about how OEL’s decline coincided with Tocchet’s coaching tenure in Arizona. And it’s true that a couple years before Tocchet’s arrival, OEL enjoyed his best season, and he was, at his peak during 2015-16, arguably one of the best players in the NHL (fancy stats that year, for instance, had him at around 6 wins above replacement and a player value north of $20 million). However, contrary to the popular narrative, OEL actually had a great first season, under Tocchet, in 2017-18 (it was, in fact, the second best season of his entire career, at least by the analytics).
 

Ekman-Larsson’s overall career chart paints a pretty clear picture. It’s really a textbook case of age-related decline. And not Rick Tocchet’s systems, or some personal rift, that saw OEL change from one of the league’a most valuable defencemen to a player on one of the NHL’s worst contracts.
 

OEL’s decline has actually played out over two teams and four different head coaches.

So Tocchet didn’t “break” OEL.
 

Father Time did.

 

None of this is meant as a “pro” argument for hiring Tocchet (just to be clear). More meant to make the point that any concerns about their relationship being a major issue are likely overstated. Handwringing is not warranted IMO. I doubt OEL is going to cry and sulk if he suddenly finds himself reunited with his former coach. He’s too good a person and pro for that. And he’s certainly not going to retire and quit hockey because of any coach (he has $10.5 million reasons, paid both this year and next year, not to, plus an additional $18.5 million in salary his final three years of this contract).
 

And I also doubt Tocchet is going come in and single out OEL for his “whipping boy” (although some other Canucks may not be so lucky). I think any buttons Tocchet wanted to push with OEL are done and in the past now. And OEL is also no longer the best player and leader on his team. Tocchet will likely be focused elsewhere, if he’s looking to challenge key Canucks players to be better.

 

When it comes to OEL, I think the more critical factor will be whoever Tocchet picks (if he’s hired) as his assistant to run the D. That relationship is going to be far more important, when it comes to how much value the Canucks can get out of the remaining years on OEL’s deal, and how happy OEL is with his role and playing in Vancouver.
 

That all said, I do think it’s still a fair assumption that Tocchet probably wouldn’t be OEL’s first choice for a new head coach. But he knows what he’s getting in Tocchet, so if it happens, it’s probably going to be an easier adjustment for OEL than most of his current teammates. And, when it comes to their “rift,” it would seem that most of these personal issues are well in the past. Both Tocchet and OEL seem to agree that they’ve always had good communication, had many productive conversations, and have worked through any issues or conflicts. And some time has passed, which also tends to help. They’re both adults and pros. Whatever the history, they should still be able to have a decent enough working relationship.

 

And for all the talk about the “rift” and these two “hating” each other, OEL has never really said anything to suggest that he ever wanted to leave Arizona because of Rick Tocchet. He agreed to a trade because Coyotes management made it very clear that they didn’t want him. That probably hurt his feeling more than anything Tocchet ever did (even the famous story about him getting knock on his ass during practice). Had things played out differently with that front office, I actually think Ekman-Larsson would have happily remained a Coyote for the remainder of his career, even with Tocchet as his coach.

If Tocchet becomes the next head coach in Vancouver, I really doubt it’s going to make OEL want to get out of town. I think that’s just wishful thinking for people who want to dump the contract. Which I can easily understand. But OEL picked Vancouver and I don’t see him requesting another trade, regardless of the coach. And his contract is all but unmovable, at this point, so he’s probably here for the duration of his deal and we just have to accept that. 
 

(Sorry this post is long and rambling. I’m thumb-typing it on my phone during some spare moments, while focused on a dozen other things, so it’s probably pretty repetitive and clumsy, but just going to submit this mess as it is. Credit to anyone who made it through the whole thing. )

[Attila Umbrus]

1 hour ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

I honestly don’t believe the OEL-Tocchet relationship and their past history in Arizona would be much of an issue, if Rick Tocchet is hired as the next Canucks head coach.

 

Lots has been said and written about the “rift.” And it’s true that Tocchet wanted OEL to be more “fiery” and play with more intensity and passion. He definitely challenged OEL to be a stronger and more vocal leader and tried to push some buttons with him. And sometimes that backfired. But for all the talk about Tocchet embarrassing and disrespecting OEL, it seems like Coyotes fans were more upset than Ekman-Larsson himself. 
 

For OEL’s part, here are some quotes where he discusses his relationship with Tocchet:

(2020 interview)

“I think we have a great relationship. I think he’s a great coach and I’m excited to play for him again. 

We have talked about this before, but it’s always hard for a new coach to come in and get to know all of his players and there’s always going to be times when I look at it one way and he looks at it another, but you’ve got to have that respect for the person and the coach and it goes the other way around with Toc for his players. I feel like that’s not an issue. We have a good relationship and we have been talking about a lot of stuff.  It’s not like we agree on everything but at least we talk and at the end we have a good relationship. I don’t see that as a problem.”

(2021 interview, after Tocchet was fired)

"He just loves the game. He just wants to get better every day, it doesn't matter if he's a player or a coach," Ekman-Larsson said. "I feel like he made all of the players and guys around him better."

 

Coyotes fans (and many other fans and analysts around the league) have talked a lot about how OEL’s decline coincided with Tocchet’s coaching tenure in Arizona. And it’s true that a couple years before Tocchet’s arrival, OEL enjoyed his best season, and he was, at his peak during 2015-16, arguably one of the best players in the NHL (fancy stats that year, for instance, had him at around 6 wins above replacement and a player value north of $20 million). However, contrary to the popular narrative, OEL actually had a great first season, under Tocchet, in 2017-18 (it was, in fact, the second best season of his entire career, at least by the analytics).
 

Ekman-Larsson’s overall career chart paints a pretty clear picture. It’s really a textbook case of age-related decline. And not Rick Tocchet’s systems, or some personal rift, that saw OEL change from one of the league’a most valuable defencemen to a player on one of the NHL’s worst contracts.
 

OEL’s decline has actually played out over two teams and four different head coaches.

So Tocchet didn’t “break” OEL.
 

Father Time did.

 

None of this is meant as a “pro” argument for hiring Tocchet (just to be clear). More meant to make the point that any concerns about their relationship being a major issue are likely overstated. Handwringing is not warranted IMO. I doubt OEL is going to cry and sulk if he suddenly finds himself reunited with his former coach. He’s too good a person and pro for that. And he’s certainly not going to retire and quit hockey because of any coach (he has $10.5 million reasons, paid both this year and next year, not to, plus an additional $18.5 million in salary his final three years of this contract).
 

And I also doubt Tocchet is going come in and single out OEL for his “whipping boy” (although some other Canucks may not be so lucky). I think any buttons Tocchet wanted to push with OEL are done and in the past now. And OEL is also no longer the best player and leader on his team. Tocchet will likely be focused elsewhere, if he’s looking to challenge key Canucks players to be better.

 

When it comes to OEL, I think the more critical factor will be whoever Tocchet picks (if he’s hired) as his assistant to run the D. That relationship is going to be far more important, when it comes to how much value the Canucks can get out of the remaining years on OEL’s deal, and how happy OEL is with his role and playing in Vancouver.
 

That all said, I do think it’s still a fair assumption that Tocchet probably wouldn’t be OEL’s first choice for a new head coach. But he knows what he’s getting in Tocchet, so if it happens, it’s probably going to be an easier adjustment for OEL than most of his current teammates. And, when it comes to their “rift,” it would seem that most of these personal issues are well in the past. Both Tocchet and OEL seem to agree that they’ve always had good communication, had many productive conversations, and have worked through any issues or conflicts. And some time has passed, which also tends to help. They’re both adults and pros. Whatever the history, they should still be able to have a decent enough working relationship.

 

And for all the talk about the “rift” and these two “hating” each other, OEL has never really said anything to suggest that he ever wanted to leave Arizona because of Rick Tocchet. He agreed to a trade because Coyotes management made it very clear that they didn’t want him. That probably hurt his feeling more than anything Tocchet ever did (even the famous story about him getting knock on his ass during practice). Had things played out differently with that front office, I actually think Ekman-Larsson would have happily remained a Coyote for the remainder of his career, even with Tocchet as his coach.

If Tocchet becomes the next head coach in Vancouver, I really doubt it’s going to make OEL want to get out of town. I think that’s just wishful thinking for people who want to dump the contract. Which I can easily understand. But OEL picked Vancouver and I don’t see him requesting another trade, regardless of the coach. And his contract is all but unmovable, at this point, so he’s probably here for the duration of his deal and we just have to accept that. 
 

(Sorry this post is long and rambling. I’m thumb-typing it on my phone during some spare moments, while focused on a dozen other things, so it’s probably pretty repetitive and clumsy, but just going to submit this mess as it is. Credit to anyone who made it through the whole thing. )

I’m a fan of long posts, all good Sid. Great points to bring up. 
 

OEL is here long term unless bought out I would think. I hope that Tocchet can get some fire back in OEL. Maybe they can get on the same page quickly and work things out with his game…I think he plays well with an edge. We have seen him get a little nasty here and there and when he’s playing like that he seems more confident to me..I compare him directly to Edler at this age. Still a 5 M dman but cannot provide the offence like he used to so is over paid a bit. Edler really provided value as a vet and a solid dman during his plateau, I mean he’s still a very user guy on the blue line, just ask LA… hopefully OEL can do the same and still provide that 5 M value to our team.

 

I just don’t see a trade here with any team. He has so much term left on his contract. Unless Vancouver retains he won’t be moved. On contrast, who knows, teams can get pretty crafty to make trades. Might just hurt too much to do so. We don’t need to mortgage the future just to get rid of OEL. Especially if you get his game turned around.

[AnthonyG]

https://www.hockeyfeed.com/nhl-news/reports-that-the-canucks-have-interviewed-mike-babcock?fbclid=IwAR2JjL_gR9O_qlgaOkmTm1XEQfTlM0eqjO9QTLl1cYJ5kYK0ljqx-3BXmmg
 

 

I hope to god Daliwal is trolling. 

[Dr. Crossbar]

3 minutes ago, AnthonyG said:

https://www.hockeyfeed.com/nhl-news/reports-that-the-canucks-have-interviewed-mike-babcock?fbclid=IwAR2JjL_gR9O_qlgaOkmTm1XEQfTlM0eqjO9QTLl1cYJ5kYK0ljqx-3BXmmg
 

 

I hope to god Daliwal is trolling. 

The state of Vancouver sports media is worse than anything to do with the team.