[Proposal] Scraping the bottom of the barrel - finding a backup goalie in free agency?

[Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw]

With our team practically set, there are currently 5 goaltenders signed to the Vancouver Canucks: Thatcher Demko, Arturs Silovs, Spencer Martin, Zach Sawchenko, and... Nikita Tolopilo?  As it stands, the Canucks do not have a clear, outright #2 goaltender.  It'll probably be a toss-up between Silovs and Martin. 

 

Silovs, who had a 3-2-0 record with Vancouver (.908 SV%/2.75 GAA), had a very good season in Abbotsford, capped off by an insane run at the Worlds.  The concern here is that he's 22.  He's got about a season and a half of pro experience.  Even though he had a good stint at the end of the year, there's worry that he'd be getting rushed into the NHL when he should probably be logging more starts in the AHL.  Demko became our backup at age 23.  Schneider became our backup at age 24.  I'm sure Silovs would do fine, but is it worth the risk of rushing him?

 

Spencer Martin is the other option.  He had a good stint with Vancouver in 21-22, and then started as our main backup in 22-23.  He was actually outperforming Demko at the start of the season, and then the whole Canucks season got turned upside down.  Demko got injured, and Martin started to get clobbered in net.  One coach firing later, Martin was eventually sent back down to Abbotsford, logging a brutal 11-15-1 record (0.871SV%/3.99 GAA) in Vancouver.  It's hard to say how much of this falls on Martin.  The team was utter trash.  Martin himself wasn't expecting to be the primary starter.  We always get obliterated during east coast road trips anyway - is it really Martin's fault we kept losing?

 

There is one other option - acquire a goalie.  You can go about that in two ways: a trade or a free agent signing.  The trade options are clear: find a third-string goalie on another team you think is good enough to be backup on our team.  As for free agency, here's where our options become paper-thin.

 

There were a couple free agents I wanted Vancouver to target - Martin Jones and Alex Stalock.  With them gone, there's basically only three UFAs left who have NHL experience.

 

2-6-3, .877 SV%, 4.21 GAA.  No way.

 

 

12-8-2, .891 SV%, 3.40 GAA.  Elliott is definitely going to get signed somewhere as a 2/3 goalie, but it's not clear where he'll end up.  There are a handful of teams that would like an extra goalie, and I think we're one of them.

 

 

10-9-5, .903 SV%, 2.72 GAA.  Okay, I know guys.  I know.  According to a report in Slovakia, Halak does want to return to the NHL.  Whether he wants to return here is a different story... and I'm not sure fans would be stoked to have him back.  But out of the remaining free agents, he is by far the best option.

 

 

What do you all think?  Go after a free agent?  Go for a trade?  Or stick with what we've got and roll the dice?

[hammertime]

I would love to take a stab at Akira Schmid. The kid looks legit. Not sure what it would cost? Klimovich and NJ's 4th back? 

 

NJD Just signed Kallgren they have Brennan and Daws in the pipe. Alternatively if they send Akira down I think he's got something like 27 exempt pro games left maybe we pluck Kallgren who would have to pass waivers I believe? 

[higgyfan]

I think Martin should be given a 2nd chance, as there are various circumstance that the OP has

pointed out in his post. He is clearly a much better backup, but his game was sabotaged by

the *hit show that was Vancouver's 22-23 season. 

[Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw]

14 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

I think Martin should be given a 2nd chance, as there are various circumstance that the OP has

pointed out in his post. He is clearly a much better backup, but his game was sabotaged by

the *hit show that was Vancouver's 22-23 season. 

For posterity, here is Martin's card.  It is ugly.  But it also seems to show his expected SV% never dropped.  He's probably just not good enough to be more than a 3rd string goalie.

 

[-AJ-]

20 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

I think Martin should be given a 2nd chance, as there are various circumstance that the OP has

pointed out in his post. He is clearly a much better backup, but his game was sabotaged by

the *hit show that was Vancouver's 22-23 season. 

I'm okay with him getting 15-20 games. He just can't take a heavy workload.

[Phil_314]

1 hour ago, hammertime said:

I would love to take a stab at Akira Schmid. The kid looks legit. Not sure what it would cost? Klimovich and NJ's 4th back? 

 

NJD Just signed Kallgren they have Brennan and Daws in the pipe. Alternatively if they send Akira down I think he's got something like 27 exempt pro games left maybe we pluck Kallgren who would have to pass waivers I believe? 

I think Schmid's earned his role (9-5-2, 2.13 GAA, 0.922 sv %).  
If anything I'd try for Sam Montembeault (1 year left, $1 million).  Maybe trade Martin + a pick?  He started over Allen for stretches last season.

Alternatively, if we could make the cap work, DeSmith looks pretty good plus apparently he wants out of Montreal.

[Citizen Erased]

I don’t think they can really afford any of those options but if they made space, I’d take a chance on Elliott.

[Pears]

I personally feel like Silovs is ready for a backup role, but I wouldn’t be opposed to starting him in Abbotsford and calling him up if Martin starts to falter. Although I’d be just fine with Martin as a backup as that’s what he’s best suited for. 

[Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw]

1 hour ago, Phil_314 said:

I think Schmid's earned his role (9-5-2, 2.13 GAA, 0.922 sv %).  
If anything I'd try for Sam Montembeault (1 year left, $1 million).  Maybe trade Martin + a pick?  He started over Allen for stretches last season.
 

Spoiler

Alternatively, if we could make the cap work, DeSmith looks pretty good plus apparently he wants out of Montreal.

 

 

Nobody's getting Montembeault anymore.  But I do like the idea of DeSmith.

34 minutes ago, Citizen Erased said:

I don’t think they can really afford any of those options but if they made space, I’d take a chance on Elliott.

We'd be paying him less than $1M.  You gotta pay someone to be our backup.  It might as well be someone who can actually do it.

[Hairy Kneel]

I think run with 3 goalies and let the 2 backups compete for starts. You falter you die.

[Citizen Erased]

1 minute ago, Bob.Loblaw said:

 

Nobody's getting Montembeault anymore.  But I do like the idea of DeSmith.

We'd be paying him less than $1M.  You gotta pay someone to be our backup.  It might as well be someone who can actually do it.

They’re still over the cap and need to make room for him, even at under 1 million.

[hammertime]

Really though if Alvin doesn't get a proper backup. They start Demko too much he goes down and they Di Pietro Silovs development it will be an epic fail. It doesn't take a clairvoyant  to see how this is going to go if we can't get Demkos starts down.

[Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw]

12 minutes ago, Citizen Erased said:

They’re still over the cap and need to make room for him, even at under 1 million.

Right, but it doesn't matter who is in net, someone has to earn that $1M.  If it's Martin, you pay him.  If it's Silovs, you pay him.  If it's someone else, send the other two down and pay the new guy.

[qwijibo]

2 hours ago, Phil_314 said:

I think Schmid's earned his role (9-5-2, 2.13 GAA, 0.922 sv %).  
If anything I'd try for Sam Montembeault (1 year left, $1 million).  Maybe trade Martin + a pick?  He started over Allen for stretches last season.

Alternatively, if we could make the cap work, DeSmith looks pretty good plus apparently he wants out of Montreal.

Montreal isn't moving Montembeault.  Guaranteed.  He's likely their 1A/B starter this season.  He looked really good in the second half last season behind a rookie defense.   If anything Montreal will look to move Allen, DeSmith or Primeau 

Edited August 28, 2023 by qwijibo

[Citizen Erased]

1 hour ago, Bob.Loblaw said:

Right, but it doesn't matter who is in net, someone has to earn that $1M.  If it's Martin, you pay him.  If it's Silovs, you pay him.  If it's someone else, send the other two down and pay the new guy.

I would rather go with Martin for 15-20 games if they can’t make room for someone more experienced.

[Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw]

1 minute ago, Citizen Erased said:

I would rather go with Martin for 15-20 games if they can’t make room for someone more experienced.

Okay, I don't think you're getting my point.  If we get... Jaro Halak or someone like that for 900K, that'll mean he earns basically the same money as Martin.  We're obviously not going to keep 3 goalies on our main roster, so regardless of who's in net, we're only paying our backup the same amount of cash.  We don't need to make room.  The cap hit will be the same no matter who's in net.  Unless we get a backup that costs much more than 1M, which I'm not proposing.

[Citizen Erased]

3 minutes ago, Bob.Loblaw said:

Okay, I don't think you're getting my point.  If we get... Jaro Halak or someone like that for 900K, that'll mean he earns basically the same money as Martin.  We're obviously not going to keep 3 goalies on our main roster, so regardless of who's in net, we're only paying our backup the same amount of cash.  We don't need to make room.  The cap hit will be the same no matter who's in net.  Unless we get a backup that costs much more than 1M, which I'm not proposing.

So Martin would be sent down and it won’t count against the cap?

[Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw]

4 minutes ago, Citizen Erased said:

So Martin would be sent down and it won’t count against the cap?

Of course not.  Anyone earning less than $1.075M has zero cap hit if they're sent down to the AHL.  There are bunch of exceptions and complicated rules, but Martin's contract is simple.  He gets paid $762,500 no matter where he plays, but the cap hit only applies when he's playing with Vancouver.

[Citizen Erased]

Just now, Bob.Loblaw said:

Of course not.  Anyone earning less than $1.075M has zero cap hit if they're sent down to the AHL.  There are bunch of exceptions and complicated rules, but Martin's contract is simple.  He gets paid $762,500 no matter where he plays, but the cap hit only applies when he's playing with Vancouver.

I wasn’t aware of that. Thanks!

[Ghostsof1915]

You are wasting your time with goalies on War Charts. There's only one advanced stat that means anything when it comes to goalies.

 

Goals saved above expected. https://moneypuck.com/goalies.htm

 

Silovs: -0.8

Delia: -4.3

Demko: -5.7

Martin: -23.5

 

Now expecting Spencer Martin to go from Backup to Starter was going to be bad no matter what. Demko's injury had a major impact, and he looked far better when he returned at the end of the year healthy. The question of course is, can Demko stay injury free for 50-60 games a year?

 

Montembeault had a 11.8 goals above expected. There is no way in hell Montreal is going to let him go. Unless you are talking moving a high draft pick, and/or Lekkerimaki. 

Akira Schmid looks like a great choice, provided we can make the right type of trade for him. He had 8.2 goals saved above expected.