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The Ethics of Eating Non-Human Animals


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#1 Pistachios

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:01 PM

Fun fact - I doubled my meat consumption on Nov 1st to make up for the idiocy.


I find it hilarious that you throw around terms like "idiocy" when it is blatantly obvious that you (among others) are irrational and therefore being not sensible/idiots.

Argument from Agony
  • Experience tells us that being in agony is morally bad
  • Anything morally bad always gives us a reason to want to avoid it
  • Therefore, being in agony always gives us a reason to want to avoid it
Argument from Moral Consideration
  • Anything that has an interest (e.g. avoiding agony) is morally considerable
  • Sentient beings have interests
  • Non-human animals and humans are sentient beings
  • Therefore, non-human animals and humans are morally considerable
Deduction from Both arguments:

If non-human animals are morally considerable, and being in agony always gives us a reason to avoid it, then it rationally follows that causing non-human animals to be in agony gives us normative reason to alleviate it. If being in agony is worth avoiding, this reason must apply to non-human animals as well because they are morally considerable. To discount their interests requires arguing why animals are not morally considerable, or why their interests ought to be overridden. Taste doesn't cut it. Nutrition doesn't cut it either.

That I rationally recognize these conclusions and act accordingly is the sensible/smart/intelligent thing to do. That isn't being self serving. That's being logical.

What have you said so far Avelanche? All I can say about you is that you are one big nincompoop. To spell it out for you, that means foolish or stupid.

Good day.

This was later in the thread and the response to it was so blatantly mistaken that it should be posted here.

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So if I would eat a dog it's ok for me to eat a turkey?

Well where is the line?

Do you use plastic bags? Well then you might as well eat meat because plastic bags utilize animal fat. Hope you don't take your bike anywhere because several bike tires (and car tires) use stearic acid. Don't get me started on if you've ever enjoyed fireworks or don't research shampoo, toothpaste, sugar, fabric softener, beer, wine, glue, biofuel, marshmallows. And let me add that if your residence catches fire don't you dare use a fire extinguisher because if you do you might as well be eating meat.

Stupid arguments beget stupid arguments.


Wow. Committing straw man arguments is clearly a favorite past time of yours.

  • Person A has position X.
  • Person B presents position Y (which is a distorted version of X).
  • Person B attacks position Y.
  • Therefore X is false/incorrect/flawed.


1.All the ad claims is that whatever normative reasons apply for not eating your dog as food (and the ad assumes correctly that the vast majority of dog owners would never eat their dogs) it is highly likely that those same reasons also apply to other animals purposed for food.


2. The ad says nothing about anything being derived from animals in some form or another is morally wrong. You are clearly taking things out of context.

3. Everything else you say is a mischaracterization of the ad's original intent. Attacking that mischaracterization is not valid. Hence, straw man.

Edited by SILLY GOOSE, 12 November 2012 - 05:25 PM.

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#2 BananaMash

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:03 PM

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I eat animals, and my justification is that they are delicious.
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#3 avelanch

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:04 PM

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why do you feel the need to specify non-human animals instead of just animals in general. It's that designation that opens yourself to mockery, saying you must eat human animals, as you only take an issue with non-human animal eating.

Well, that and your idiotic belief that Meat shouldn't be eaten...
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#4 ChenWei91

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:06 PM

As long as I don't see the face of the animal that I'm eating, then I don't care. Human or not o_o
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#5 Shift-4

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:08 PM

I just had some beef jerky..................MMMMMMMMMMMM
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#6 avelanch

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:08 PM

As long as I don't see the face of the animal that I'm eating, then I don't care. Human or not o_o

soooo, no head on shrimp or fish, no crawfish, or crustaceans in general for you, eh?

what is it with people and seeing the face/eyes of the thing you are eating? half the time the facial meat is some of the best flavoured meat on the animal.

I have meat with nearly every meal, and I have no qualms with it.

Edited by avelanch, 31 October 2012 - 01:08 PM.

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#7 Pistachios

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:09 PM

Also, some videos depicting common practices involved in livestock production. Do these practices give us more reason not to support the general practice of killing animals for food?




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#8 Hobble

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:10 PM

I will probably continue eating meat until they can perfect lab-grown meat.
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#9 ChenWei91

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:10 PM

soooo, no head on shrimp or fish, no crawfish, or crusteacians in general for you, eh?

what is it with people and seeing the face/eyes of the thing you are eating? half the time the facial meat is some of the best flavoured meat on the animal.


I don't know man.

Having a cow's eyes just staring at me while I eat it's insides is kinda disturbing to me...

I guess I should've rephrased my first comment. As long as I don't see it's eyes/head. I'm fine. So to answer your first question. Yes. I don't eat fish or any other foods, as long as it's head/eyes is still attached to it.

Edited by (>'-')>, 31 October 2012 - 01:13 PM.

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#10 BananaMash

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:11 PM

I don't know man.

Having a cow's eyes just staring at me while I eat it's insides is kinda disturbing to me...


You're not supposed to eat them alive man!
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#11 J.R.

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:11 PM

Nothing wrong with eating meat.

The terrible industrial livestock practices used by the major food suppliers on the other hand...

Edited by J.R., 31 October 2012 - 01:22 PM.

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#12 Primus099

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:13 PM

I'm going to go eat a big steak now, if you're a vegetarian then good for you. don't try and force your crap on other people

Edited by Primus099, 31 October 2012 - 01:13 PM.

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#13 Jägermeister

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:14 PM

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I eat meat because:
1. It is delicious
2. It is natural for humans/other predators to eat meat, just as they have been doing for millions of years.
There is a reason we have developed lateral incisors.
3. It is delicious

Edited by Jägermeister, 31 October 2012 - 01:16 PM.

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#14 jatylo

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:16 PM

I always justify this by thinking about the poor vegetables, imaging working your whole life fighting through the dirt and the second you see daylight Bam! you get sucked up and chopped into ten pieces.
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#15 Scottish⑦Canuck

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:17 PM

This is the second time in the past couple of weeks that someone's felt the need to post "non-human" in front of animals...

I'm seeing some cannibalistic traits in some posters.
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#16 Pistachios

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:17 PM

why do you feel the need to specify non-human animals instead of just animals in general.


Because that is what they are, by definition. A dog, cat, cow, monkey is a non-human animal, and that is the subject matter I am referring to.

It's that designation that opens yourself to mockery, saying you must eat human animals, as you only take an issue with non-human animal eating.


Who said I only take issue with eating non-human animals? How does that even follow? You've committed a non-sequitir and comitted a straw man in one sentence.

Well, that and your idiotic belief that Meat shouldn't be eaten...


This is question begging, which is not a good form of reasoning.
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#17 Harbinger

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:19 PM

More meat please.
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#18 Scottish⑦Canuck

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:20 PM

This is question begging, which is not a good form of reasoning.


I genuinely misread that as seasoning. You've got me hungry now.
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#19 Sanford

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:21 PM

There's a reason why these animals have a lot of meat in em, there's a reason why their meat contain essential nutrients that make the body stronger (protein for development in brain etc,). A child that does not get his/her essential proteins can become malnurished... (don't point out the vegetarian alternatives like tofu, cavemen and our ancestors did not have this kind of technology).

Frankly, regarldless of which religion you believe in or if you're an atheist, it should be concluded that many animals are on this earth for the very purpose of eating.

Look at it this way, without eating animals you and I would probably not be here. Cavemen would not have survived the harsh weathers without eating meat. I was in a university seminar once in evolution, there was arguments that the ability for mankind to hunt allowed us to eat more protein and hence developed the brain. Monkeys today just eat fruits and vegetables mostly... and what are they? They are just monkeys.

Meat is essential to our diet. Denying it just being completely delusional.

Edited by Sanford, 31 October 2012 - 01:25 PM.

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#20 g_bassi13

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:23 PM

I don't know man.

Having a cow's eyes just staring at me while I eat it's insides is kinda disturbing to me...

I guess I should've rephrased my first comment. As long as I don't see it's eyes/head. I'm fine. So to answer your first question. Yes. I don't eat fish or any other foods, as long as it's head/eyes is still attached to it.


Cow eyes are delicious.

This is the second time in the past couple of weeks that someone's felt the need to post "non-human" in front of animals...

I'm seeing some cannibalistic traits in some posters.


Same poster.

edit: brb, the thread has got me hungry for some bacon.

Edited by g_bassi13, 31 October 2012 - 01:24 PM.

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#21 J.R.

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:24 PM

Do a pack of lions think about the ethics of taking down and devouring a wildebeest?

Edited by J.R., 31 October 2012 - 01:24 PM.

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#22 Pistachios

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:25 PM

I will probably continue eating meat until they can perfect lab-grown meat.


This is an interesting point. I agree that if in vitro meat could be produced, people might be more willing to eat it than having to kill non-human animals. That would be a good outcome.

Nothing worn with eating meat.

The terrible industrial livestock practices used by the major food suppliers on the other hand...


This is interesting as well. It raises ethical issues regarding humane slaughter. Even without cruelty, is it still ethically permissable to kill non-human animals for no other reason than just to enjoy the taste of meat?

I'm going to go eat a big steak now, if you're a vegetarian then good for you. don't try and force your crap on other people


Who says I am forcing? If you don't want to participate, then don't. Rational argument is what I am interested in.

I eat meat because:
1. It is delicious
2. It is natural for humans/other predators to eat meat, just as they have been doing for millions of years.
There is a reason we have developed lateral incisors.
3. It is delicious


regarding 2, just because something is natural doesn't make it morally good. See appeal to nature.
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#23 Harbinger

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:25 PM

I feel sorry for people who don't eat meat. Meat is almost always the most delicious part of any meal. Oh yeah and it is also a proven fact that people that eat meat have larger brains than people who don't.


Oh yeah and before any of the vegans or vegetarians get upset about me saying they have smaller brains. Feel free to look it up.

Edited by Harbinger, 31 October 2012 - 01:29 PM.

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#24 playboi19

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:28 PM

I wish I was eating a burger right now.
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#25 Captain Aerosex

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:28 PM

I eat meat because it tastes delicious and has outstanding nutrition. If we don't eat the terrorizer animals, then they will eat us.
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#26 250Integra

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:29 PM

Wait..

So you eat humans?
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#27 avelanch

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:30 PM

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sooo, this is the new meat thread right?
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mmmmm
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#28 Captain Aerosex

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:32 PM

sooo, this is the new meat thread right?
Posted Image
mmmmm


When I go home for Remembrance Day weekend I'm eating braised short ribs, Indian curry steak, homemade burgers, and as many meat dishes as I can afford from Red Chili's on Lonsdale.

And it will be delicious. And my stomach will be happy. And I will laugh.

Edited by Witchcraft and Sedinery, 31 October 2012 - 01:32 PM.

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#29 AbbyNucksFan

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:33 PM

it's pretty widly accepted that the human brain only grew to the size it is now because of cooking/eating meat. By cooking the meat, our bodies didnt need as much energy to process the food, so more energy was used to make the brain larger.

BTW: I'm a member of PETA.




















People Eating Tastey Animals.
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#30 BananaMash

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 01:39 PM

regarding 2, just because something is natural doesn't make it morally good. See appeal to nature.


"I'm naturally supposed to eat meat, but because I don't feel it's morally okay I will deprive myself of delicious ribs, pork, bacon, venison, lamb, and beef" doesn't work for me.
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