Harvey Spector Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 5 minutes ago, DeNiro said: I'd rather us follow the Tampa model. They were bad for a season, drafted Stamkos, were competitive again, developed Stamkos, were bad again for a season, then drafted Hedman. You need other foundational players around those guys though you can't start from scratch. This likely won't happen until the Sedins retire though. I would take our D and our goaltending including our prospects over Tampa's any day. As for their forwards Kucherov is their best forward this year and he was a second round pick. Also Tampa is only one point ahead of us in the standings. It's not like they are lighting it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bohoforpresident Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 5 minutes ago, DeNiro said: I'd rather us follow the Tampa model. They were bad for a season, drafted Stamkos, were competitive again, developed Stamkos, were bad again for a season, then drafted Hedman. You need other foundational players around those guys though you can't start from scratch. This likely won't happen until the Sedins retire though. Stamkos is made out of peanut brittle and candy canes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 Just now, Harvey Spector said: I would take our D and our goaltending inclusing our prospects over Tampa's any day. As for their forwards Kucherov is their best forward this year and he was a second round pick. Also Tampa is only one point ahead of us in the standings. It's not like they are lighting it up. Sorry, but Hedman is a beast. We don't have anyone close to his ability. My point was that you can acquire those franchise players fairly quickly in a matter of a couple seasons. And as long as you make good picks in the 2nd-5th round to fill in the foundation, it doesn't have to take long periods of being bad by stripping down the team to nothing. Tampa made it to the Eastern finals and the Stanley Cup finals in the last 5 years. This year is a down year, but they're still a contender with Stamkos in the lineup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gameburn2 Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 1 hour ago, the_impersonator13 said: Well said. Nice to see its the young guys really contributing....Bo, Baer, Sutter, Grandlund, Stetcher, Tryamkin, Sbisa etc. That is the significance of the turn around: the Sedins are not a big part of it -- and Hansen is not in the line up. The Canucks now have two legitimate lines: and the Sedins are not on either of them. The Sedins may play better next month, and there will be moments, for sure, but really we are looking at the team becoming Horvat's. And Baertschi, Tryamkin, Hutton, Stecher. and of course Sutter's. Getting Tanev back has helped as well. Granlund is looking better, and Skille and Megna are surprisingly useful, as well. The goaltending has been solid, but I'm not sure we'd have lost much if we'd moved Miller in the Summer, or if we move him this March. Imagine how much better we'd have been if Hansen and perhaps Tanev had been moved a year or more ago? Time for a Tkachuk or a Chychrun to have become part of this. Of course we might not have got first round picks for Tanev and Hansen, which would make this less convincing as an argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 4 minutes ago, bohoforpresident said: Stamkos is made out of peanut brittle and candy canes. He's also a 4 time 40+ goal scorer. Something we haven't had since Bure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBackup Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 10 minutes ago, DeNiro said: I'd rather us follow the Tampa model. They were bad for a season, drafted Stamkos, were competitive again, developed Stamkos, were bad again for a season, then drafted Hedman. You need other foundational players around those guys though you can't start from scratch. This likely won't happen until the Sedins retire though. It's pretty rare to see a team ping pong between competitive and top 3 pick the way Tampa has though. It really doesn't seem like a realistic model to base building your team around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harvey Spector Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 1 minute ago, DeNiro said: Sorry, but Hedman is a beast. We don't have anyone close to his ability. My point was that you can acquire those franchise players fairly quickly in a matter of a couple seasons. And as long as you make good picks in the 2nd-5th round to fill in the foundation, it doesn't have to take long periods of being bad by stripping down the team to nothing. Tampa made it to the Eastern finals and the Stanley Cup finals in the last 5 years. This year is a down year, but they're still a contender with Stamkos in the lineup. That is true. Of course Hedman makes a huge difference. Unfortunately the aren't many Hedman's around. Even if the Canucks drafted first overall next year they are still not getting a Hedman, so you have to get lucky and tank when those players are available. Our defence is fine anyways. We don't need a Hedman. All we need is one more puck moving D which we have in Juolevi. After that our D is set. And so is our goaltending for the future. BO looks like a #1 centre and Baer BO Boeser can be a #1 line. Benning just has to fill in the gaps up front with a couple other players. He needs to trade an excess D for a top 6 forward and hope Virtanen gets his sh** together. If that happens we are in good shape up front as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 1 minute ago, Bitter Melon said: It's pretty rare to see a team ping pong between competitive and top 3 pick the way Tampa has though. It really doesn't seem like a realistic model to base building your team around. It's just a matter of leaving cap space open after the Sedins retire, let the team finish low while transitioning in more youth, and then filling in any gaps with trades and free agent signings. This team is going to be very young in the next few years. The high picks will come Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xRussianrocket Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 4 minutes ago, DeNiro said: I'd rather us follow the Tampa model. They were bad for a season, drafted Stamkos, were competitive again, developed Stamkos, were bad again for a season, then drafted Hedman. You need other foundational players around those guys though you can't start from scratch. This likely won't happen until the Sedins retire though. 2008 first overall 2009 second overall by coming in last and secong to last in those draft years. This is what i dont understand what are the canucks waiting for. They have some up and coming guys. If they added a couple top tier picks they have a chance to really turn it around. This was the year to tank haters gonna hate but it is reality. And the longer we continue to fool ourselves we can draft 15th overall picks and 2nd third rounders and make them superstars, and be contenders by signing ufa Erikssons were just setting the stage to be mid a mid year team for another 5-10 years until we do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honky Cat Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 Very passive hockey game,almost devoid of any competitive emotion whatsoever (you could even see Edler and OEL joking with each other on the ice)...All three Canuck goals were beauty's though... The real test is the back to back coming up against the Flames....Hopefully the Canucks prove a point and redeem themselves over their last outing against the Flames. Would still like to see Rodin show what he can do (but its pretty obvious that WD has very little interest in the long term plans of the hockey team), Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 5 minutes ago, xRussianrocket said: 2008 first overall 2009 second overall 2013 third overall Those two picks didn't solve everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xRussianrocket Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 1 minute ago, DeNiro said: 2013 third overall Those two picks didn't solve everything. It was in reference how tampa drafted stamkos and hedman. drouin? 12g 12a in 34 games i dunno what ur getting at referencing him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 1 minute ago, xRussianrocket said: It was in reference how tampa drafted stamkos and hedman. drouin? 12g 12a in 34 games i dunno what ur getting at referencing him That they didn't turn it around in two drafts. They bounced back and fourth between the Eastern finals and drafting 3rd overall. The point is there's no perfect formula. And even drafting top 3 three times in 5 years doesn't guarantee you anything. Proper player development is the only way. And that involves developing foundational players in the meantime until you get those franchise players. That's what we're doing right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cripplereh Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 true and coaching is one of the best ways to win it all a coach that gets his message across Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormriders Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 2 hours ago, Darius71 said: The fourth line dictated a lot of the play. Gaunce isn't putting up points but his defensive game and his game along the boards is looking good. He is still a young player and he is capable of playing a heavy game that wears d men down. if he finds a scoring touch we will have a really good bottom 6 player that can grow with the other young guys on the team. Agree completely, Gaunce is playing the game Willy wants, solid D, offense later as a 4th liner. He's playing well for what they want him to do, and he is young and has time to develop slowly. He has proven he can improve each year so the points will come. He is playing safe because that's how he stays in the lineup, because Willy needs to 'trust' his players. He has way more offensive upside, . . . . ok not 30 goals, but way more offense, once he has a more solid position within the team. Right now it's his first year and Willy wants them to earn trust, which btw, is one of the things I don't like about Willy, I would prefer he allows them to be free to make mistakes and learn through that. Also, I have noticed on the 4th line, because they are all starved for goals, they are MOST LIKELY to shoot than pass, because they want the goals, must more so than other lines, . . . . understandably. BTW, for all the talk about how great Chaput's FO stats are, Gaunce is within a few points of him and Sedin in his first year, so pretty great for his first year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xRussianrocket Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 1 minute ago, DeNiro said: That they didn't turn it around in two drafts. They bounced back and fourth between the Eastern finals and drafting 3rd overall. The point is there's no perfect formula. And even drafting top 3 three times in 5 years doesn't guarantee you anything. Proper player development is the only way. And that involves developing foundational players in the meantime until you get those franchise players. That's what we're doing right now. So they are still relying on their number one and two guys stamkos and hedman, thats what they built around. Was drouin a good draft pick yes and do those gems exist sometimes yes. but he is not a foundational player and i dont foresee us obtaining any guys of that caliber until we can draft them. We have drouins in our system but signing aged ufas for 6m/6yr. Is not a winning formula. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckledraggin Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 5 in a row yo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormriders Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 2 hours ago, xRussianrocket said: Horvat needs help on the youth movement. Talking playoffs and winning now is gonna get us a 10th round pick, weve never had a first overall. We cant sign more Eriksson contracts. We need more top 5 picks to get that edge. Id rather lose now and be truly competitive later. Being a brink playoff team with no chance to go far is not a way to build an elite deep team. Unfortunately the forum only gives me one -1 per day, and some other idiot beat you to the rating. Next time though . . . . . PS Try starting out your day tomorrow with a positive thought, . . . . just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattrek Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 My thoughts on this game: 1. Baertschi is finally becoming that player that Calgary had hoped for when they drafted him 13th overall. He is relentless on the puck and you can just see his confidence explode. This guy is a stud and in his 2nd season already he's clocking a 50 point season pace. We may already have one of Bo's wingers to replace the Sedins. Benning please protect him for the expansion draft. 2. Stecher had a tough game. He was caught out of position on multiple plays, tried to make impossible passes and took a penalty near the end of the game. That's to be expected. He's still a rookie and he'll have off games. He'll learn from this and be better off for it. 3. Hutton is definitely in the dreaded Sophomore slump. He seems to panic when he has the puck instead of the calm steady plays he made last year. I wouldn't give up on him just yet. His offense is starting to pick up a bit and he's still really young. Next year he'll be much better. 4. Horvat's wheels are insane. No explanation needed. 5. Sutter did an awesome fake to get the goalie leaning the wrong way and then tucked it just under the top left corner behind Smith. That was great to watch, I agree with John, more penalty shots please. As usual he's also a stud in the defensive areas, offensive areas and though not up to his usual standards had a good night in the face off circle. 6. I LOVE seeing vintage Miller back. I was worried that goalie was gone, but I've never been more happy to be wrong. Not too flash, just calm and steady with no rebounds. 7. Another great game coached by Wille. Evenly spread ice time, no line changes that make me scratch my head and no line mash ups that don't make sense. Great job by him, I have hope that after 5 games in a row of this he will have learned from his previous mistakes and continue utilizing our players with good in game decision making. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the harry Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 There is a striking difference between the current D and last years. Kudos to Benning and WD to go with Sbisa, Stecher and Tryamkin along with the expected Tanev, Edler and Hutton. What a great mix of defenders. And to all the trading Tanev, Sbisa or Edler talk - nope. But what about trading Gudbranson? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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