Wet'suwet'en Protests and Blockades in BC

[Ryan Strome]

4 minutes ago, thedestroyerofworlds said:

Not discussing the extremes or now because the time for negotiations has passed.  The rail blockades passed the point after JTs presser last week.  Up until then was the negotiation time.   Again, negotiate first, force last.  Only in certain situations (drug bust etc) will there be no negotiation.  The fact you don't get that is sad.

Acts of sabotage potentially causing death should be treated the same as drug busts. Clearly the majority of Canadians agree.

 

[RUPERTKBD]

I found this article from the Vancouver Sun which I found pretty informative. It consists largely of anecdotal evidence and opinion from the people of the Wet'suwet'un territory, but it appears that the level of support vs. opposition to the pipeline might be closer than we thought.

 

It's a bit of a long read, so I'm only posting a link, but there's some good information in there and it's broken down better than previous articles I've seen. If you're interested in the thoughts of the Wet'suwet'un members themselves (not just hereditary chiefs and band councilors) I think you'll find it informative:

 

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/benefits-starting-to-pour-into-wetsuweten-through-pipeline-contracts-as-community-remains-divided/ar-BB10wRGX?li=AAggNb9

 

 

[RUPERTKBD]

Looks like some good news....(finally):

 

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/politics/proposed-agreement-reached-between-wetsuweten-chiefs-govt-ministers-after-3-days-of-talks/ar-BB10B1tX?li=AAggNb9

 

Quote

 

A tentative agreement on land rights and title has been reached between Wet'suwet'en hereditary chiefs and government ministers, bringing three long days of negotiations in northern B.C. to an end and resolving a longstanding dispute over the First Nation's traditional territory.

The chiefs reached the agreement late Saturday night in Smithers, B.C., with federal Crown-Indigenous Relations Minister Carolyn Bennett and her B.C. counterpart Scott Fraser.

 

The details of the agreement have not been released. The ministers and chiefs agreed that the agreement will be shown to all members of the Wet'suwet'en Nation first before the ministers return to Smithers for a signing if it is agreed upon.

"It's quite a milestone for all of us to view this together," Chief Woos said Sunday morning. "We're at a point in this moment in time to see if the arrangements will work in all aspects of what we stand for as Wet'suwet'en."

Bennett called the proposed agreement a "beginning" in a new relationship between government and Indigenous peoples.

"The rights holders will always be at the table, and that is the way forward for Canada if we continue to move on what the prime minister has said on the recognition of rights, respect, cooperation, partnership: that's the way forward," she said.

Chief Na'Moks told Global News that he and the other chiefs, along with the rest of the Office of the Wet'suwet'en, are satisfied with the outcome of the talks, which centred around resolving the Coastal GasLink pipeline dispute and answering the larger question of Indigenous rights and title in the region.

On Saturday, Na'Moks had said earlier drafts of a resolution had been sent back to government for more work, but he remained positive that a deal would be reached.

Bennett said the agreement effectively resolves the open question left dangling at the end of the Delgamuukw decision handed down by the Supreme Court of Canada in 1997.

Delgamuukw, which was brought by the Wet’suwet’en hereditary chiefs and their Gitxsan neighbours, saw the court acknowledge the existence of Aboriginal title as an exclusive and ancestral right to the land, which remains unextinguished.

However, the ruling did not recognize specifically what lands belong to the Wet’suwet’en. The judges found there was a defect in the pleadings and sent it back to trial, suggesting at the same time that goodwill negotiations could be a better way to resolve the questions it was being asked.

Those negotiations never happened until this week, leading to years of complaints from the Wet’suwet’en and Indigenous advocates that the province was delaying them in order to protect industry from the ruling’s ramifications.

The Wet’suwet’en hereditary chiefs have pointed to the decision as proof that they have sole rights and title over their non-reserve, traditional lands, and that the province had violated Indigenous law by approving the Coastal GasLink pipeline.

Twenty elected First Nation band councils along the pipeline route, including five bands within the Wet’suwet’en Nation, have signed agreements with the company. However, the chiefs point out those councils only have say over their reserves under the Indian Act.

 

 

[thedestroyerofworlds]

30 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said:

Acts of sabotage potentially causing death should be treated the same as drug busts. Clearly the majority of Canadians agree.

 

Those acts mostly occurred after JT spoke and the injunctions were enforced.   It was the protesters escalating after force was used to break up the blockades.   That's the whole point of negotiating first.  You try to avoid escalation.  

[Ryan Strome]

6 minutes ago, thedestroyerofworlds said:

Those acts mostly occurred after JT spoke and the injunctions were enforced.   It was the protesters escalating after force was used to break up the blockades.   That's the whole point of negotiating first.  You try to avoid escalation.  

Canada does not negotiate with criminals and terrorists, well at least not before 2015. Imagine if he dealt with what his dad did in 1970. 

[thedestroyerofworlds]

8 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said:

Canada does not negotiate with criminals and terrorists, well at least not before 2015. Imagine if he dealt with what his dad did in 1970. 

I think you are missing what type of negotiation I'm talking about.  I'm not talking about negotiation to minimize or eliminate charges/getting off free.  I'm talking about negotiation for the protesters to give up /end protest peacefully.   The last resort is to break the protest up with force.  We have taken the negotiation first, force last position on many protests in the past.  Even pre 2015.   Hopefully you get it now.

[Ryan Strome]

12 minutes ago, thedestroyerofworlds said:

I think you are missing what type of negotiation I'm talking about.  I'm not talking about negotiation to minimize or eliminate charges/getting off free.  I'm talking about negotiation for the protesters to give up /end protest peacefully.   The last resort is to break the protest up with force.  We have taken the negotiation first, force last position on many protests in the past.  Even pre 2015.   Hopefully you get it now.

I don't. These people are hurting the economy and hurting vulnerable people. The bloody thing is lead by an American and you want to negotiate. 

[thedestroyerofworlds]

16 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said:

I don't. These people are hurting the economy and hurting vulnerable people. The bloody thing is lead by an American and you want to negotiate. 

Not now as the injunctions have been put it place.  But still, asking the protesters to break up the protest peacefully before force is used is and will be the way it's done.  That's the minimum negotiation I'm talking about.  I'm not talking about them getting away Scot free.  Now do you understand??

[kingofsurrey]

33 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said:

I don't. These people are hurting the economy and hurting vulnerable people. The bloody thing is lead by an American and you want to negotiate. 

Alberta is hurting all Canadians  ( climate change ) with its dirty oil and gas industry.......   Now being led by the Chinese....... you want to negotiate.... 

Edited March 1, 2020 by kingofsurrey

[kingofsurrey]

Good news for our government.  Bad news for climate change.

Hopefully soon Canada can start to move from dirty bitumen and dirty LNG  to GREEN energy.....

 

 

 

SMITHERS — A Wet’suwet’en hereditary chief and senior government ministers say they have reached a proposed arrangement in a pipeline dispute that has prompted solidarity protests across Canada in recent weeks.

 

Federal Crown-Indigenous Relations Minister Carolyn Bennett and British Columbia Indigenous Relations Minister Scott Fraser would not give details on the proposal, saying it first has to be reviewed by the Wet’suwet’en people.

 

Fraser says that while the Coastal GasLink natural gas pipeline at the heart of the dispute is already approved and underway, the talks have helped develop a protocol to deal with such projects in the future.

 

Chief Woos, one of the Wet’suwet’en hereditary leaders, says the proposal represents an important milestone for everyone involved.

But he says the hereditary chiefs remain opposed to the pipeline in their traditional territory.

 

https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/wetsuweten-chiefs-ministers-reach-proposed-agreement-in-pipeline-dispute

[I.Am.Ironman]

7 minutes ago, kingofsurrey said:

Good news for our government.  Bad news for climate change.

Hopefully soon Canada can start to move from dirty bitumen and dirty LNG  to GREEN energy.....

Not a lot of people dispute that we need to transition to green energy but the reality is that we can't flip a switch to do it. It will take years and projects like these are hopefully the last of their kind but at this time, they are necessary. The reality is we need the energy sector to sustain the economy as we transition to green. Green/Net Zero by 2050 is a lofty goal in and of itself but it is a good one. A lot of R&D needs to happen in the mean time. These projects are important because the revenue generated can go toward green energy R&D, as JT proposed for the transmountain expansion.

[Russ]

6 minutes ago, I.Am.Ironman said:

Not a lot of people dispute that we need to transition to green energy but the reality is that we can't flip a switch to do it. It will take years and projects like these are hopefully the last of their kind but at this time, they are necessary. The reality is we need the energy sector to sustain the economy as we transition to green. Green/Net Zero by 2050 is a lofty goal in and of itself but it is a good one. A lot of R&D needs to happen in the mean time. These projects are important because the revenue generated can go toward green energy R&D, as JT proposed for the transmountain expansion.

Exactly, as much as I hate the idea of constantly expanding oil sand, its needed to expand, that money the government receives as revenue and taxes needs to be put into a green energy fund to continue to expand the R&D and get us eventually to being green.  Lots of green concepts and development going on now and its only going to get better as the technology and demand grows but they need to be smart and put money aside for when the time comes to grab and start going hard on green we actually have a fund rather than throwing more money that we don't actually have and throwing the country further into debt.

[JM_]

4 hours ago, Ryan Strome said:

You're nuts. They are sabotaging rail roads and starting fires. Ya let's negotiate with terrorists. 

Go sabotage a railroad, potentially causing death I guarantee you won't have negotiations with anybody but your lawyer.

If the RCMP was in the area they would have reacted to those idiots trying to burn down a train. But regular peaceful but annoying protests? we don't water cannon that in Canada, yet. 

 

[UnkNuk]

9 hours ago, RUPERTKBD said:

I found this article from the Vancouver Sun which I found pretty informative. It consists largely of anecdotal evidence and opinion from the people of the Wet'suwet'un territory, but it appears that the level of support vs. opposition to the pipeline might be closer than we thought.

 

It's a bit of a long read, so I'm only posting a link, but there's some good information in there and it's broken down better than previous articles I've seen. If you're interested in the thoughts of the Wet'suwet'un members themselves (not just hereditary chiefs and band councilors) I think you'll find it informative:

 

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/benefits-starting-to-pour-into-wetsuweten-through-pipeline-contracts-as-community-remains-divided/ar-BB10wRGX?li=AAggNb9

 

 

It seems to me that the Wet'suwet'en are having the same debate as the rest of Canada is.  Namely, how do we balance economic prosperity with concern for the environment?

[Ryan Strome]

Any word on the cause? @RUPERTKBD

 

Firefighters scramble to douse flames at CN Rail building in Prince Rupert

[RUPERTKBD]

1 minute ago, Ryan Strome said:

Any word on the cause? @RUPERTKBD

 

Firefighters scramble to douse flames at CN Rail building in Prince Rupert

Probably won't know anything for a day or so. I don't think those buildings actually get used for much, so it could be just about anything....

[RUPERTKBD]

10 hours ago, Ryan Strome said:

Any word on the cause? @RUPERTKBD

 

Firefighters scramble to douse flames at CN Rail building in Prince Rupert

A bit of an update from the local rag:

 

https://www.thenorthernview.com/news/massive-fire-destroys-cn-roundhouse-in-prince-rupert/

Quote

 

A CN roundhouse in Prince Rupert has been destroyed in a massive blaze.

 

Prince Rupert firefighters arrived at the scene at 4:30 p.m. to attempt to extinguish the blaze which reached from ground level at the waterfront rail lines to the cliff top above First Ave.

A CN contractor, who would only speak to The Northern View on the condition of anonymity, said the roundhouse has been used primarily as storage for more than 11 years and had a lot of flammable items such as oil drums and other flammable material in it.

 

RCMP cordoned off Bill Murray Way and cleared the waterfront area of vehicular traffic just after 5 p. m. citing the need for emergency vehicles only in the area. Hoses could be seen running from the waterfront across the several lines of rail tracks.

 

More on the story as information becomes available. 

 

Bill Murray Way is the main access to the Waterfront. (The only other access is a unmaintained, dirt road at the opposite end of the waterfront)

 

There are some high end condos along the road as it descends down to where the fire occurred. I'm guessing the residents probably had to prove that they live there and they likely had to park somewhere at the top of the hill.

[Squamfan]

On 3/1/2020 at 10:10 AM, RUPERTKBD said:

Looks like some good news....(finally):

 

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/politics/proposed-agreement-reached-between-wetsuweten-chiefs-govt-ministers-after-3-days-of-talks/ar-BB10B1tX?li=AAggNb9

 

 

Wonder how much they got paid

 

 

 

[Squamfan]

 

[Squamfan]