Mackcanuck Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 (edited) This is concerning. The moral choice that may soon be facing Canadian doctors: who lives, who dies What keeps him awake now is the same issue intensive care doctors in Italy have been grappling with: a shortage of ventilators. Because the novel coronavirus causes a respiratory ailment, ventilators are a key component in the rehabilitation of those in the most critical state. Dr. Kenyon occasionally will run a thought experiment in his mind: Nanaimo, a mid-size city on the east coast of the island, is home to roughly 90,000 people. Taking a conservative estimate, say only 25 per cent of those get infected with the virus. That’s 22,500 people. And then say 4 per cent of those people – the figure most often used – require intensive care. That’s 900 people. And most, if not all, will require a ventilator machine. And most people needing ventilation with COVID-19 generally require it for three weeks. “What am I going to do with 14 ventilators?” Dr. Kenyon said in an interview. “I can tell you what I’m going to do: I’m going to do what they’re doing in Italy and I’m going to take 70-year-olds off the ventilator, and then 60-year-olds off the ventilator and eventually 50-year-olds off the ventilator, and I’m going to give them to 30-year olds with three kids.” Much more here https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-the-moral-choice-that-may-soon-be-facing-canadian-doctors-who-lives/ Edited March 22, 2020 by Mackcanuck 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 1 minute ago, Mackcanuck said: This is concerning. The moral choice that may soon be facing Canadian doctors: who lives, who dies What keeps him awake now is the same issue intensive care doctors in Italy have been grappling with: a shortage of ventilators. Because the novel coronavirus causes a respiratory ailment, ventilators are a key component in the rehabilitation of those in the most critical state. Dr. Kenyon occasionally will run a thought experiment in his mind: Nanaimo, a mid-size city on the east coast of the island, is home to roughly 90,000 people. Taking a conservative estimate, say only 25 per cent of those get infected with the virus. That’s 22,500 people. And then say 4 per cent of those people – the figure most often used – require intensive care. That’s 900 people. And most, if not all, will require a ventilator machine. And most people needing ventilation with COVID-19 generally require it for three weeks. “What am I going to do with 14 ventilators?” Dr. Kenyon said in an interview. “I can tell you what I’m going to do: I’m going to do what they’re doing in Italy and I’m going to take 70-year-olds off the ventilator, and then 60-year-olds off the ventilator and eventually 50-year-olds off the ventilator, and I’m going to give them to 30-year olds with three kids.” Much more here https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-the-moral-choice-that-may-soon-be-facing-canadian-doctors-who-lives/ Real life "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one." It's bad enough to make life and death choices. The deaths are pretty much drowning in your own fluids in your lungs that's horrifying. That's why flattening the curve is so critical, so there is a few of those choices to be made as possible and hopefully none. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-DLC- Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 At first, this was something we could use humour to laugh off as we abided by the social distance/stay at home rules. But sadly, our Province is now leading the charge in COVID cases...ON and QB have double and triple (? I believe) our population. My fear is that too many AREN'T taking this seriously...and that's sad. Maybe because we can meme and laugh and it tends to make it all ok. It will be...eventually. But, in the short term, anyone feeling invincible or above the guidelines is a huge problem. To all of us. It's ok to be critical of those who are so selfish they "prefer" to do it their way because they don't want to look "weird". They look very very bad as a result. And someone's loved one could pay the ultimate price in that. I take my responsibility to the world/my family very seriously and feel sad that some prompt me to criticize. I see that more of their deal than mine. Be kind only extends so far and seemingly isn't working. My focus is now on be safe and damn well make sure you do your part. And if you're flippant and giggly, you pose a threat to my Father/son with asthma and all the other families praying to get through this... so I don't take that lightly even if they do. And yes, I strongly word that. This is an exponential deal, folks. Now or never in keeping it low. There are 1331 confirmed and presumptive cases in Canada. — British Columbia: 424 confirmed (including 10 deaths, 6 resolved) — Ontario: 377 confirmed (including 3 deaths, 6 resolved) — Alberta: 226 confirmed (including 1 death) — Quebec: 181 confirmed (including 5 deaths, 1 resolved) — Saskatchewan: 25 confirmed, 19 presumptive — Nova Scotia: 9 confirmed, 12 presumptive — Manitoba: 18 confirmed, 1 presumptive — New Brunswick: 7 confirmed, 10 presumptive — Canadians quarantined at CFB Trenton: 13 confirmed — Newfoundland and Labrador: 3 confirmed, 3 presumptive 1 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 I wonder if there is time to be like WWII to get manufacturers to ramp up production of ventilators on an emergency basis, getting factories going 24/7. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester13 Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 9 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said: The fact we don't have millions of cases is showing what we are doing is working. Being cautious is better than being overwhelmed. There are 300k cases in the world, so your hyperbolic argument is ridiculous. We don't yet know how SD is working. 7 minutes ago, milk and honey said: Ya exactly that's the main point I was trying to make. Be cautious and responsible. Stay home for a couple days if you can but seeing friends for a hour with safe distancing is ok imo As long as SD is practiced properly it.can be ok, but it still isn't recommended. Also, what type of hanging out are you doing at a safe distance? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 19 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said: That is where my mother and her parents played out the depression, Jimmy. We cold be kin! LOL if you start talking about Yorkton we might have to go half's on a generic test. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 21 minutes ago, Dr. Crossbar said: Yeah, a lot of factors. I was just thinking if everyone goes out at the same peak times to the same places, it creates a large unintended gathering. You may be right on early morning. I just went out for a walk around the block and it's a ghost town down here. I think people are starting to get it. Hopefully. another good one thats kind of a 'city hike' is starting out anywhere along 1st between Main and Cambie, and then make your way up to QE Park. There's a dozen side streets you can take to avoid people and the elevation is actually pretty decent (~500 feet) all things considered. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-DLC- Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 Ha, did everyone's family live in Saskatchewan back in the day. Mine too.... 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 1 minute ago, debluvscanucks said: Ha, did everyone's family live in Saskatchewan back in the day. Mine too.... its where all the best ones come from 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-SN- Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 1 minute ago, debluvscanucks said: Ha, did everyone's family live in Saskatchewan back in the day. Mine too.... Saskatoonian checking in. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-DLC- Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 Just now, StealthNuck said: Saskatoonian checking in. Hey cousin! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 Ontario on my Mom's side. My Dad was first generation Canadian on his side born in East Van. The old joke. "My Grandfather saw a sign that said Drink Canada Dry, so he came to Canada and he did....". 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Canorth Posted March 22, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted March 22, 2020 Just now, debluvscanucks said: Hey cousin! Is everyone from Saskatchewan related? Explains a few things 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-DLC- Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 I honestly wish that, if the Government isn't ready to "clamp down" in a serious way, at least try new and more creative ways than politely asking. Start some challenges. The COVID cup (ugh) now replaces the Stanley Cup....province with the lowest number "wins" (in more ways than one). Keep the graph up and the next SCF will be played in the place that wins. Honestly...make this the indoor make up in front of your vanity challenge. Instead of ice bucket, do the living room charades game where we have to post what we're doing that would normally be outdoors or together. Mostly tongue in cheek but....if you want to motivate people, rather than pleading like a nagging parent try some new approaches then? Get the young people involved re challenges that don't include eating soap...washing with it instead. I mean, I prefer the take it seriously but, for those who don't it might "trick" them into complying. Their egos will buy in.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 9 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said: if you start talking about Yorkton we might have to go half's on a generic test. No we are safe...……..family was from Saskatoon FFFweeew! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-DLC- Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 2 minutes ago, Canorth said: Is everyone from Saskatchewan related? Explains a few things We might be. (My favourite cousin is still there - in Saskatoon). She left 20 years ago to "get ahead"/buy a house and never came back. Nor does she intend to. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 At least its cowbells not banjos. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 19 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said: if you start talking about Yorkton we might have to go half's on a generic test. 15 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said: another good one thats kind of a 'city hike' is starting out anywhere along 1st between Main and Cambie, and then make your way up to QE Park. There's a dozen side streets you can take to avoid people and the elevation is actually pretty decent (~500 feet) all things considered. 14 minutes ago, debluvscanucks said: Ha, did everyone's family live in Saskatchewan back in the day. Mine too.... 13 minutes ago, StealthNuck said: Saskatoonian checking in. 12 minutes ago, debluvscanucks said: Hey cousin! 10 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said: 10 minutes ago, Canorth said: Is everyone from Saskatchewan related? Explains a few things 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 I had 2 co-workers that moved to Gull Lake, Sask...…...there has not been a lake there for 10,000 years Makes you kind of wonder! It explains some of the people in my family, that is for sure! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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