Francesco Aquilini says "I have no plans to make changes."

[NHL97OneTimer]

On 2/14/2021 at 3:34 PM, aGENT said:

It's the only way they have an 'argument' to justify their outrage.

 

Zero context given as to what conditions they were signed under (rebuilding team unable to attract players on the merit of contention). And zero recognition that all of those contracts expire after this and next year as planned.

 

All while also cutting down the importance and quality of those players as though they were worthless 'wastes' of cap space and of no or negative value.

 

Beagle is an excellent 4C and veteran mentor. Is his cap hit cheap? Hell no. Same goes for Sutter. At best though, you can label that as 'inefficient' cap. All teams have some and I'd happily pay both 'inefficiently' for what they bring for the last couple years coming out of a rebuild, all over again.

 

And no CDC, Myers is not overpaid. He's paid 2nd pair, UFA aged D rate, exactly as he should be.

 

The only cap hit people should really complain about is Eriksson. It's the only real clear 'clunker' of the lot. 

 

Beyond that, yes we have a few, short term, inefficient contracts hardly worth all the hand wringing.

 

Only other one I might want back in hindsight (especially after trading for Pearson and given our depth on wing) is Roussel. And even he's not that bad and also expires soon.

Agree.  Eriksson and the Luongo hit are the most problematic.  The rest were so-so and somewhat necessary during a time when there was little interest in playing for Vancouver given the rebuild.  The loss of Tanev and Markstrom sucked but likely necessary to preserve the club's future cap-wise.  I see this year (and next) as a transition time.  After that, this team should be fully built and it's all on JB if the personnel aren't pulling them close to the prize.

[Fred65]

31 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Or... you could just look at the objective proof of how long it took other teams to rebuild.

 

A 'quick' rebuild is generally in the 8-10 year range FYI.

 

That's not 'pro' or 'anti' Benning. It's just reality and has zip to do with bias.

You know it might serve some purpose that I am unaware of but in 2011 we lost the SC  to Boston, well guess  what Boston  has remained a top team including a in flight rebuild and currently sit tied for second O/A. Colorado since the arrival of Sakic have gone from pretender to performer. Chicago are way above us. Many Club chnaging their roster over are doing better,, we're not exactly the beacon of hope.  I hasten to add IMO

[Fred65]

Quote

Markstrom sucked but likely necessary to preserve the club's future cap-wise. 

Can we truly say that ? turn down Markstrom and then sign Holtby for $4.5 and add Harmonic at $1..25 We don't have a top line goalie and yet are spending basically the same money. The Cap issue was terrible self imposed problem but can't be the reason for not signing Markstrom

[Honky Cat]

23 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

To a degree that's true ... but, here's the big but!!

We overpaid FA's and ended up with no room to move within the Cap with old washed up players costing a lot of money, it stunted the growth of prospects.

Picks like Virtanen, McCann and to a lessor degree Juolevi were not the best 6th, 26th, or 5th best in the world 18 year olds in the draft, there were a number of better selection at those drafts (IMO)

 

This has cost the the club time amd wasted capital, frankly you don't get congratulated for these action

No argument about overpaying certain UFA's (actually I think its more term I had issues with)

Which prospects got stunted ? 

Benning wasn't going hit homeruns on all his picks. Yes , there's Jake (but there's also Demko and Tryamkin from that draft), and 3 consecutive calder finalists.

With Hog and Juolevi coming along this season, the last thing I'm going to rag on management about is drafting.

Edited February 20, 2021 by Honky Cat

[Provost]

18 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

Can we truly say that ? turn down Markstrom and then sign Holtby for $4.5 and add Harmonic at $1..25 We don't have a top line goalie and yet are spending basically the same money. The Cap issue was terrible self imposed problem but can't be the reason for not signing Markstrom

It is actually a bit of an impossible choice, and one we will never know which was a better option.

 

Could we have signed Markstrom to a little less and given him a NMC for expansion?  Probably.  Likely almost the same term and only a little discount.  
 

Would we have been better to do that and then use Demko as a trade chip to get rid of a bunch of salary and/or get another top prospect back?  Maybe, especially in the short term.

 

Would we be in much worse shape a few years from now paying all that money to an older goalie?  Probably.

 

We can blame Benning for a lot, but it is clear he put all his chips and effort on trying to sign Markstrom until he “ran out of time” to negotiate with his other UFAs.

 

If I had my druthers at the time, we would have signed a cheaper 1B goalie than Holtby and tried to keep Stecher and Toffoli.  Tanev and Markstrom were big losses, but they earned better contracts than we weren’t in a position to pay.

Edited February 20, 2021 by Provost

[the grinder]

7 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

You know it might serve some purpose that I am unaware of but in 2011 we lost the SC  to Boston, well guess  what Boston  has remained a top team including a in flight rebuild and currently sit tied for second O/A. Colorado since the arrival of Sakic have gone from pretender to performer. Chicago are way above us. Many Club chnaging their roster over are doing better,, we're not exactly the beacon of hope.  I hasten to add IMO

Colorado ? since they drafted landeskog 2nd over all  in 2011  thats 10 years of rebuilding  and what have Colorado won?  nothing   Boston had a young core when they won Marchand ,Luicic , Beregron krejci etc with vets mixed in,    what core did we have in 2011?  sedins kesler burrows  and loungo  all retired ,    so comparing apples to oranges  lol

[Timråfan]

11 hours ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

 

It baffles me why some people want MG back.

It's probably because we have different views on what a GM are.

For me a GM is the entrpreneur that sells a vision and take responsibility from the shoulders of the rest in the org. 

The GM has a whole organisation working with drafting, scouting etc... So the GM are not the scout. 

I find it amazing that a GM for a company that has a value of 725 million dollars is supposed to do doing petty stuff. 

 

Mike Gillis took over Canucks when the value was 236 mill dollar and left when the value was 800 dollar. 

That is exactly what a GM is supposed to do. 

Then the GM has other people looking at all the different aspects of the Canucks. 

[DownUndaCanuck]

With this comment I wonder if the owners had a discussion with JB in the off-season to basically say he should play it really cautious this season. With a flat, uncertain cap and the ED coming up, now's not the time to make big moves for a cup run, especially with so many "wild card" young players who need a bit of stability and training. If that's the expectation and if that's the case then I agree with ownership and management - this season is basically a write-off, would have been nice if we played well but no surprise we've taken a step back, we'll be better after the Seattle draft and once the cap normalizes again when all these expensive contracts wear-off and newer, cheaper contracts play the majority.

 

The other reason is that the owners think this poor play on the ice is purely down to the players' poor effort. Part of that should be down to the coach but of course a lot of that is down to the players, in which case he's giving Green and JB a freebie. I don't think this is the case, because you've got lots of players really having almost-career seasons and it seems to be a systemic breakdown on defence, but is another possibility. 

[Fred65]

17 hours ago, Honky Cat said:

 

Here's a statement worth a read

 

Quote

Following the 2019-20 NHL season, disgruntled Buffalo defenseman Rasmus Ristolainen said what every Sabres fan has been thinking for years:

"Buffalo has a bright future, but we've been saying the 'bright future' for seven years now when I've been here. And I'm not sure, when is it?"

This isn't a unknown fan sitting at a bar some place. He's an insider who knows the goings on behind the scene. 7 years = to long according to Ristolainen

Edited February 20, 2021 by Fred65

[Honky Cat]

5 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

Here's a statement worth a read

 

This isn't a unknown fan sitting at a abr some place. He's an insider who knows the goings on behind the scene. 7 years = to long according to Ristolainen

So, who are these Canucks prospects that got stunted?, I'm still waiting for your answer on your claim?

Buffalo Sabres are about to miss their 10th consecutive season missing the post season.  Divided dressing rooms, coaching carousels etc

Comparing the Canucks to the Oilers , Sabres  futile years , is the negative default du jour for knee-jerk Canuck fans.

 

[Fred65]

14 minutes ago, Honky Cat said:

So, who are these Canucks prospects that got stunted?, I'm still waiting for your answer on your claim?

Buffalo Sabres are about to miss their 10th consecutive season missing the post season.  Divided dressing rooms, coaching carousels etc

Comparing the Canucks to the Oilers , Sabres  futile years , is the negative default du jour for knee-jerk Canuck fans.

 

Frankly it's a waste of my time to answer, ask Chatfield or Brisebois or  Tryamkin or who ever going to Utica is like going to purgatory. Vcr likes to instant patches via expensive FA. All these FA and ask yourself ( honestly ) how much progress has the team made ( and don't go on about the prospects and  the future) We're still struggling season after season and youngsters are still being bi-passed for the same results IMO... any way over and out this is a circular firing squad

[Honky Cat]

Just now, Fred65 said:

Frankly it's a waste of my time to answer, ask Chatfield or Brisebois or  Tryamkin or who ever going to Utica is like going to purgatory. Vcr likes to instant patches via expensive FA. All these FA and ask yourself ( honestly ) how much progress has the team made ( and don't go on about the prospects and  the future) We're still struggling season after season and youngsters are still being bi-passed for the same results IMO... any way over and out this is a circular firing squad

Chatfield, Brisebois and Tryamkin have not been stunted, two of them are clearly not NHL calibre at this point. After an initial conditioning issue, Tryamkin was/is an NHL player.

No UFA's have blocked any Canuck prospect, glad we got that out of the way. 

Which youngsters are getting by passed exactly?

[Fred65]

18 hours ago, the grinder said:

Colorado ? since they drafted landeskog 2nd over all  in 2011  thats 10 years of rebuilding  and what have Colorado won?  nothing   Boston had a young core when they won Marchand ,Luicic , Beregron krejci etc with vets mixed in,    what core did we have in 2011?  sedins kesler burrows  and loungo  all retired ,    so comparing apples to oranges  lol

I was thinking more in terms of when they changed management ie from Sakics arrival. thats' the point of time they decided that pervious management were sr**ing the pooch. Colorado since Sakic took over has gone from after thought to a top team, it's amazing what a ne management team can do

[Fred65]

7 minutes ago, Honky Cat said:

Chatfield, Brisebois and Tryamkin have not been stunted, two of them are clearly not NHL calibre at this point. After an initial conditioning issue, Tryamkin was/is an NHL player.

No UFA's have blocked any Canuck prospect, glad we got that out of the way. 

Which youngsters are getting by passed exactly?

Maybe you didn't read this part  "any way over and out this is a circular firing squad"

[Honky Cat]

2 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

Maybe you didn't read this part  "any way over and out this is a circular firing squad"

So,I'll take that as a confirmation that you cant name any youngsters that are getting bypassed.

Keep up the good work.

Edited February 20, 2021 by Honky Cat

[Fred65]

1 minute ago, Honky Cat said:

So,I'll take that as a confirmation that you cant name any youngsters that are getting bypassed.

Keep up the good work.

I'd like to respond but good taste prevents me. Too many ostriches posting

[NewbieCanuckFan]

18 hours ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

Agree.  Eriksson and the Luongo hit are the most problematic.  The rest were so-so and somewhat necessary during a time when there was little interest in playing for Vancouver given the rebuild.  The loss of Tanev and Markstrom sucked but likely necessary to preserve the club's future cap-wise.  I see this year (and next) as a transition time.  After that, this team should be fully built and it's all on JB if the personnel aren't pulling them close to the prize.

Bae & Spooner's cap hit combined equal to Luongo's.  

[Toyotasfan]

Calgary is chomping at the bit for the Canucks to let Travis Green go so they can sign him for 6 years. 

[Honky Cat]

18 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

I'd like to respond but good taste prevents me. Too many ostriches posting

I'm all ears Fred, but if you're going to deliver depressing 'hot takes', the burden of proof is on you to back it up?

 

[the grinder]

22 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

I was thinking more in terms of when they changed management ie from Sakics arrival. thats' the point of time they decided that pervious management were sr**ing the pooch. Colorado since Sakic took over has gone from after thought to a top team, it's amazing what a ne management team can do

no you weren't  ,   Sakic already had a core when he took over  ,so what has he done since  traded Duchense  to Ottawa  for 1 st rounder  and traded for kadri , and they still don't have a goalie , pfft management   10 years of sucking  to get landeskog mckinnion ranteennen  and then sakic takes over and you say great management team .