[Rumour] J.T. Miller Trade/Contract Talks

[Gawdzukes]

39 minutes ago, Jester13 said:

IYO, which team is capable/possibly willing to trade significant assets for Miller with the intention of signing him to a realistic long-term deal? I'm not sure I can think of anyone, which leads me to believe that Miller is going to be a rental to some team and that we'll only be able to recoup assets that are of rental calibre. 

Any team that wants to make a major move can certainly make moves to facilitate the cap space. We just saw Vegas do it this year when they were one of the least likely teams able to afford Eichel. Any team would have 4 months or more to find the cap space. I would say every team is a possible destination besides the Canadian teams and maybe a couple of bottom dwellers like AZ and Seattle. Realistically any playoff team and maybe a Detroit, Columbus, Dallas, or even Buffalo.

[The Lock]

47 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

I think JT is looking at a similar contract to Zibanejad ( +$8.5 x 8yrs + NMC) range  This is why

I think the Rags are no longer interested in him.  There are not a lot of teams that want to put the

$, term along with NMC on their cap. 

The best thing that could happen (if the Nucks want to trade JT), is for a team like Preds, Stars,

Wild, etc to have poor performances during the playoffs.  They have the extra salary cap to

take on Miller's contract and he certainly would take them to greener pastures next season.

I actually could still see NYR having interest. They do have a lot of their contracts finishing at the end of this season and next season so they actually could afford him depending on what else they decide to do. Basically, they will have flexibilitiy over the next couple of years. They're in a really good position to be honest. It's a position I wish we could have had by now and I'm rather jealous of them. lol

 

Biggest question would be what they'd be willing to give up, and if you've been following my posts the past day or so here you'd know that I think that would be the biggest hurdle.

Edited April 2, 2022 by The Lock

[stawns]

35 minutes ago, mll said:

Miller looks to be the wrong age group for Nashville.  Poile talks of them re-tooling to get younger.  Their window will really open with their prospects taking the next step. They don't look to be the best trading partners.  

 

The Wild wouldn't have the cap space. Guerin has also said multiple times that he's not in the slightest interested in trading prospects or high draft picks they've worked hard to acquire.  He talked of how those futures are essential to weather their 13-15M cap penalties over the next 3 seasons.  The only reason he gave up the 2nd for Fleury is because they are getting a compensatory pick for not signing their 1st round pick in 2018 and another for the rights of McBain + they plan to extend him.

 

Can't see the Stars being interested given they witnessed 1st hand how quick players can fall off a cliff with Benn and Seguin.

 

again, anyone who thinks Poile isn't in it to wn a Cup during his tenure is buying a bill of goods. They may not make a move on MIller, but Poile won't want to retire as a pernnial bridesmaid

[The Lock]

8 minutes ago, stawns said:

again, anyone who thinks Poile isn't in it to wn a Cup during his tenure is buying a bill of goods. They may not make a move on MIller, but Poile won't want to retire as a pernnial bridesmaid

He doesn't strike me though as a GM who would just sacrifice everything and put the next GM in a "lesser state" for a cup he may or may not win. He's been Nashville's GM for over 2 decades. I don't see him suddenly changing attitude to something out of character for him.

 

Could it happen? Maybe? But I think that would be more wishful thinking on our part.

Edited April 2, 2022 by The Lock

[mll]

2 minutes ago, stawns said:

again, anyone who thinks Poile isn't in it to wn a Cup during his tenure is buying a bill of goods. They may not make a move on MIller, but Poile won't want to retire as a pernnial bridesmaid

Don't think Poile has any intention to retire - he seems to also be training his son to take over.  Also can't imagine he would leave the franchise in a mess to serve his own ambition.  Also he talked of a transition to get younger and himself says it's going to take time - they are doing better than expected but don't see him rushing things.

 

“It did not appear to me that if we kept the same team we were going to get better. I’m very comfortable with the path I’ve chosen," Poile told The Tennessean in late August. "The path chosen is going to take some time to play out.”

[stawns]

1 minute ago, The Lock said:

He doesn't strike me though as a GM who would just sacrifice everything and put the next GM in a "lesser state" for a cup he may or may not win. He's been Nashville's GM for over 2 decades. I don't see him suddenly changing attitude to something out of character for him.

He's also been a brisdesmaid for two decades and has had the team on the "brink" for a lot of that time..........with nothing to show for it.  He'sgot an older core who are running out of time to win, and that's the only reason he has a job.........to win a Cup.

[The Lock]

4 minutes ago, stawns said:

He's also been a brisdesmaid for two decades and has had the team on the "brink" for a lot of that time..........with nothing to show for it.  He'sgot an older core who are running out of time to win, and that's the only reason he has a job.........to win a Cup.

This doesn't mean he's going to sacrifice future years for it.

 

You seem to want to imply everyone will be out for themselves and themselves only: at least that's the mentality you're presenting here. Realistically, this just isn't how everyone is. (and we should be thankful for that to be quite frank. lol)

Edited April 2, 2022 by The Lock

[higgyfan]

29 minutes ago, aGENT said:

I think the Rangers would still have interest, they'd just need to either move out other cap, not extend Strome, or only take him on as a rental. That's up to them.

 

 

 

2 minutes ago, The Lock said:

I actually could still see NYR having interest. They do have a lot of their contracts finishing at the end of this season and next season so they actually could afford him depending on what else they decide to do. Basically, they will have flexibilitiy over the next couple of years. They're in a really good position to be honest. It's a position I wish we could have had by now. lol

 

Biggest question would be what they'd be willing to give up, and if you've been following my posts the past day or so here you'd know that I think that would be the biggest hurdle.

The problem for the Rags, is that their top 3 players have NMCs and +26M with long term contracts.

Trouba, Fox and Goodrow sighed with NMCs + long term + 21M

*Add JT (who I'm sure will want a NMC), that makes 7 difficult contracts.  Although that sounds

very Rangerish, having 56m cap for 8 players with NMCs is madness.

 

All other players are under 3M (not including tender 5.6m) which doesn't return much $ in a trade.

 

 

[mll]

2 minutes ago, stawns said:

He's also been a brisdesmaid for two decades and has had the team on the "brink" for a lot of that time..........with nothing to show for it.  He'sgot an older core who are running out of time to win, and that's the only reason he has a job.........to win a Cup.

He signed Duchene, Josi long term thinking they would compete and it didn't happen so they changed course and decided to rebuild.  Ellis got moved out so did Arvidsson.  Ekholm only got a 4 year deal and so did Granlund - he didn't want to sign any vet to more than 4 years.  Granlund even went to free agency before circling back.  Ekholm and Granlund were signed to help transition to their younger players. 

[The Lock]

9 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

 

The problem for the Rags, is that their top 3 players have NMCs and +26M with long term contracts.

Trouba, Fox and Goodrow sighed with NMCs + long term + 21M

*Add JT (who I'm sure will want a NMC), that makes 7 difficult contracts.  Although that sounds

very Rangerish, having 56m cap for 8 players with NMCs is madness.

 

All other players are under 3M (not including tender 5.6m) which doesn't return much $ in a trade.

 

 

You'd have to understand though, we'd likely get something of cap back plus then it'd only be 3 mil higher than what he's currently being paid. I don't see it as being as big of a deal as you're making out here. Yes, they'd have to figure a few things out to get it to work, but it's definately doable for them.

 

Like I wouldn't be surprised if we got someone like Kreider back or even Goodrow.

Edited April 2, 2022 by The Lock

[JM_]

1 hour ago, Gawdzukes said:

Oh yeah I agree, don't shoot the messenger lol.  In one sentence he says Miller won't leave money on the table and then suggests he leave 18mil in the next.  These Canucks Army guys leave a lot to be desired but it does illustrate some of the problems with any Miller contract. 6 x 9.5 or 10 maybe gets it a little closer but I don't know how this makes sense to us unless people are just excited to watch Miller make big money while we flounder around in circles.

 

  

Yes way more info needed on all fronts. I really think we all need to wait until the playoffs are over to see what's left. Everyone feels like they know their team and the direction and plan is pretty obvious but every year that drastically changes for a lot of teams. We still have the draft, UFA, the hockey playoffs, trades, injuries, prospects, breakthroughs, year end interviews, and player/team decisions. It's going to be a long summer.  

I've seen some comments around how mistakes were made not moving Miller, but we have no idea what was being offered. I'd suspect not much, as we didn't really get any leaks over possible deals, unless I missed some report?

[higgyfan]

1 minute ago, The Lock said:

You'd have to understand though, we'd likely get something of cap back plus then it'd only be 3 mil higher than what he's currently being paid. I don't see it as being as big of a deal as you're making out here. Yes, they'd have to figure a few things out to get it to work, but it's definately doable for them.

Yes, probably Chytil 2.3m.  I have no doubt that they can deal a contract to JT.  The question is whether

they want multi years of 8 players making 67M with NMCs.  I know I wouldn't want to see the

Canucks with that arrangement.

 

[JM_]

1 hour ago, aGENT said:

Nashville, Boston, maybe Pittsburgh easily and likely another 5+ teams that would have to (eventually) move out salary (which teams consistently do).

 

No, they'll pay Miller closer to $8.5x7 (or if they trade for him, $8.125x8).

 

Probably because he's a better player? And I doubt Kadri signs for $7x5 either (since you want to conflate terms here).

its not really conflating, they are available UFA C's. Is Miller worth the extra 2.5 mil over what Strome brings? thats what teams will be looking at imo. 

[Alflives]

28 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

Yes, probably Chytil 2.3m.  I have no doubt that they can deal a contract to JT.  The question is whether

they want multi years of 8 players making 67M with NMCs.  I know I wouldn't want to see the

Canucks with that arrangement.

 

Any Miller trade to the Rags is finished.  That was strictly Miller as a two playoff rental.  We kind of screwed ourselves.  It’s either extend Miller to a big contract and try to be competitive for these next couple years, or trade him at the 2023 TDL at a greatly reduced value.   Or, he walks for nothing summer 2023.  It’s a mess.  

Edited April 2, 2022 by Alflives

[aGENT]

29 minutes ago, JM_ said:

its not really conflating, they are available UFA C's. Is Miller worth the extra 2.5 mil over what Strome brings? thats what teams will be looking at imo. 

You're conflating terms. Miller in the article's $9.5m example was their (highly optimistic) hopes for a 5 year term (the longest term that makes any sense for the Canucks). (IMO, even $11 or $12m AAV is optimistic at 5 years)

 

Miller will almost certainly be signing a 7 or 8 year deal at +/- $8.5 or $8.125m.

 

As will Kadri at probably closer to $7-$7.5m (x7-8 years). At a 5 year term, his AAV would go up as well.

 

 

Edited April 2, 2022 by aGENT

[higgyfan]

16 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Any Miller trade to the Rags is finished.  That was strictly Miller as a two playoff rental.  We kind of screwed ourselves.  It’s either extend Miller to a big contract and try to be competitive for these next couple years, or trade him at the 2023 TDL at a greatly reduced value.   Or, he walks for nothing summer 2023.  It’s a mess.  

I think the Nucks would have traded him if there had been a really good trade offered.  If they are going

to trade JT, I think it will happen during the offseason or early in the new season.  Waiting until TD

would force them into taking a desperation offer.

 

I would be very surprised if they re-sign him for the $ and term I'm seeing bandied about.

[JM_]

1 minute ago, higgyfan said:

I think the Nucks would have traded him if there had been a really good trade offered.  If they are going

to trade JT, I think it will happen during the offseason or early in the new season.  Waiting until TD

would force them into taking a desperation offer.

 

I would be very surprised if they re-sign him for the $ and term I'm seeing bandied about.

those numbers are, at best, an attempt by Millers agent to set some sort of negotiating ceiling. I'd be really surprised if anyone gave him 8.5 x 8. 

[Gawdzukes]

1 hour ago, mll said:

Miller looks to be the wrong age group for Nashville.  Poile talks of them re-tooling to get younger.  Their window will really open with their prospects taking the next step. They don't look to be the best trading partners.  

 

The Wild wouldn't have the cap space. Guerin has also said multiple times that he's not in the slightest interested in trading prospects or high draft picks they've worked hard to acquire.  He talked of how those futures are essential to weather their 13-15M cap penalties over the next 3 seasons.  The only reason he gave up the 2nd for Fleury is because they are getting a compensatory pick for not signing their 1st round pick in 2018 and another for the rights of McBain + they plan to extend him.

 

Can't see the Stars being interested given they witnessed 1st hand how quick players can fall off a cliff with Benn and Seguin.

 

 

1 hour ago, stawns said:

again, anyone who thinks Poile isn't in it to wn a Cup during his tenure is buying a bill of goods. They may not make a move on MIller, but Poile won't want to retire as a pernnial bridesmaid

GM's say stuff all the time but live in contradictory worlds. We've seen it with Benning enough. Just because a GM makes a statement doesn't mean it dictates every decision moving forward and he can't make a future beneficial move for the club because of it. Every team looks unlikely until they decide it's in their prerogative. I do get that most teams won't change their mindset or make a major change up but it only takes one or two.

[wai_lai416]

37 minutes ago, JM_ said:

those numbers are, at best, an attempt by Millers agent to set some sort of negotiating ceiling. I'd be really surprised if anyone gave him 8.5 x 8. 

first off any other team it'll be 7 years not 8 and why wouldn't anyone give him 8.5x7? Zibanjed signed for 8.5x8, if miller signs for 7 they end at the same time. Hertl just signed for 8 years at 8.1 that takes him to 37. Couture signed till he's 38. there are plenty of example of players signing a max term contract at market price at the age of 29-30.. not that many of them age well but doesn't mean there won't be teams out there willing to give those contracts out. 

 

besides it doesn't even matter if there's no team that'll give him 8.5x7 if he hits ufa... you think he'll sign a low term contract or low cap high term contract just because you tell him i don't think any team will offer you 8.5x 7 or 8? any offer from vancouver that's not max money max term.. he can easily get from most teams in free agency.. so unless we offer him something that's favorable to him.. there's 0 reason for him to not test free agency.. and if we ended up trading him.. Miller wouldn't care as it would be to a contender.. not like we can threaten to dump him to buffalo or new jersey like some poster were suggesting when we were negotiating with EP and Hughes.. as they would have 0 interest

[mll]

20 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

 

GM's say stuff all the time but live in contradictory worlds. We've seen it with Benning enough. Just because a GM makes a statement doesn't mean it dictates every decision moving forward and he can't make a future beneficial move for the club because of it. Every team looks unlikely until they decide it's in their prerogative. I do get that most teams won't change their mindset or make a major change up but it only takes one or two.

He traded away Ellis and Arvidsson for futures and only gave Granlund and Ekholm 4 year deals.  In his interviews when Poile doesn't want to answer a question he says so.  Can't recall him giving a bogus answer for the sake of it.  

 

Guerin has said multiple times that the fanbase is too smart for him to lie to - not how you create trust.  Guerin is in media so often and so far has stayed true to what he has disclosed.

 

Edited April 2, 2022 by mll