McDavid and the last quarter century

[Baratheon]

3 hours ago, MaxVerstappen33 said:

How is this news? We knew he was better than Crosby before he was drafted. He was basically a hall of famer before he was drafted. 

 

It would be news if he wasn't doing this.

 

Playing in an AHL western confrence helps too

Oh pardon me.  Didn't mean to offend your delicate sensibilities.

 

I think when someone does something that hasn't been done in more than 25 years it becomes news.  

 

I would think this is a relatively simple concept 

[Bell]

On 2/28/2023 at 9:27 AM, -AJ- said:

He's unbelievable--that said, we are in a different era of hockey these days. The rate of scoring is 3.16 goals per game, higher than it's been since 1993-94.

Imagine him playing in the 80s with how poorly most guys skated and the tiny goalie gear.  

[Baratheon]

Update:  If the season were to end today, McDavid would have the 6th highest point total (tied with Jagr) of any Art Ross trophy winner in the last 25 years.  8 more points will give him sole possession of 1st place. 

 

This will be his 5th Art Ross Trophy.  The most of any player during this timespan.  (Jagr has 4 while Crosby, Malkin and St. Louis all have 2) 

[flat land fish]

Pretty incredible production should be one way traffic at nhl awards night.

[EoH]

Just rest this man for the playoffs right now and he’ll still win the art ross.

[cripplereh]

Last I saw his points at his games played was the same as Crosby.Rules changed and scoring went up so he has passed Crosby.

 

In 15 years people will say was he really better then Crosby?  

 

He needs to win 4 cups to be better and gold in the Olympics with more points or he even if ends his career with more points will not be as good.

[HKSR]

On 3/2/2023 at 9:33 AM, MaxVerstappen33 said:

They don't call him Mcjesus for nothing. How is inline with expectations crazy ?

Kinda feel for Bedard.  If he is ONLY a superstar in the NHL and not a generational level player, he won't hear the end of it.  Expectations are sky high for the kid.

[IBatch]

On 2/28/2023 at 12:27 PM, -AJ- said:

He's unbelievable--that said, we are in a different era of hockey these days. The rate of scoring is 3.16 goals per game, higher than it's been since 1993-94.

It's also very gratifying for an older fan like me, who was around in 1987 for the Canada Cup and the greatest collection of hockey players ever.   And grew up with a 21 team league.    Funny how when the talent level catches up to expansion and the rules created to open the game up in the first place, scoring goes up.    Players were complaining about clutching and grabbing in well before 1993-1994.   It's not like the goalies suck that's ridiculous.    3 on 3 OT... that's adding as well.   Most games don't go to the shoot-out like they used too.     Leagues still watered down.    Games faster then ever - removing a pass and the redline for sure helped with that, same as making room for small PMD's that would have a tough time surviving and keeping out of the infirmary back then.     It's making me a little giddy.    Glad McDavid is having a career year and scoring close to Gretzky's and Mario's career average this year.    And hope he gets to 150.   We've gone a long way from the 2000's when some seasons nobody  was breaking 100 and guys in the top ten were scoring 80ish points. 

Edited March 8, 2023 by IBatch

[IBatch]

On 3/2/2023 at 4:31 PM, Bell said:

Imagine him playing in the 80s with how poorly most guys skated and the tiny goalie gear.  

Imagining is pretty easy to do.    Funny how after the rule changes Alfie scores over 100 points at age 34, Sakic at age 37 and Zubov had his most productive season since the early 90's,  also at 37.   And how the stars with longevity from the 80's were still stars in the 90's, some like Yzerman on one knee winning the Conn Smythe, same with Roy, just prior to retirement.    McDavid hasn't beat Gartner's record properly either.   Go watch that year (and he was a throw in that all-star game) a half dozen guys were faster then todays fasted skaters and they weren't allowed to take a stride first before the clock started.   Stastny, Hawerchuk ... i'm guessing McDavid would be producing around like they did,   Maybe a 150 point year too,   

Edited March 8, 2023 by IBatch

[.Naslund]

I think at this point McDavid is underrated by a lot of people. He’s dominating his peers at a level that only Gretzky and Lemieux have done. The point differential between him and #2 is far greater than Crosby ever did. Jumbo Joe was racking up points at a similar pace to Crosby during his 120 point season. If you want to compare plus minus, McDavid compares nicely to Crosby as well. The best defence sometimes is offence, and McDavid is always dangerous when he’s on the ice. 
 

It comes down to style I suppose. Mcdavid is the best offensive player that’s come around since Wayne/Mario. Crosby plays more like a grinder/well rounded but anyone saying he’s anywhere near McDavid offensively is a bit delusional. Appreciate his greatness. 
 

McDavid also averaged 2 points a game last playoffs. Not his fault his organization is horrible at surrounding him with a well rounded team. Crosby was blessed with having Letang, Fleury (superstar goalie) and Malkin. 

[canuck73_3]

On 3/4/2023 at 7:54 AM, Baratheon said:

Update:  If the season were to end today, McDavid would have the 6th highest point total (tied with Jagr) of any Art Ross trophy winner in the last 25 years.  8 more points will give him sole possession of 1st place. 

 

This will be his 5th Art Ross Trophy.  The most of any player during this timespan.  (Jagr has 4 while Crosby, Malkin and St. Louis all have 2) 

Unreal player, picked 2 random Oiler games this year to go to, saw him casually score 4 points and a shootout goal. Including his 100th point of the year. Draisaitl is elite but McDavid is another level. 

[Slegr]

I still think it’s highway robbery that they gave MVP to Matthews last year. McDavid deserved it last year, and he’ll get it with no eastern media interference this year.

[Baratheon]

He would need a huge 5 point game but it would be fun to see him hit 129 against the Laffs!  And on HNIC as well! 

[IBatch]

Of note... 80 of McDavids 130 points have come on the power play.    That's a ton.    Good for him too.   He's only one point ahead of bottom feeder team EK for 5 x 5 points and not that far ahead of EP either.    He's like Ovi on steroids right now.   Gretzky never did this.    He scored the vast majority of his points 5 x 5... Hope McDavid scores 160 though.  Will be in special company then. 

[IBatch]

On 3/9/2023 at 1:04 AM, .Naslund said:

I think at this point McDavid is underrated by a lot of people. He’s dominating his peers at a level that only Gretzky and Lemieux have done. The point differential between him and #2 is far greater than Crosby ever did. Jumbo Joe was racking up points at a similar pace to Crosby during his 120 point season. If you want to compare plus minus, McDavid compares nicely to Crosby as well. The best defence sometimes is offence, and McDavid is always dangerous when he’s on the ice. 
 

It comes down to style I suppose. Mcdavid is the best offensive player that’s come around since Wayne/Mario. Crosby plays more like a grinder/well rounded but anyone saying he’s anywhere near McDavid offensively is a bit delusional. Appreciate his greatness. 
 

McDavid also averaged 2 points a game last playoffs. Not his fault his organization is horrible at surrounding him with a well rounded team. Crosby was blessed with having Letang, Fleury (superstar goalie) and Malkin. 

Crosby never played with Malkin on his line as a regular.   Rust.  And a bunch of chumps aside from eventually Geuntzal. Drasaitl ... is a great player.     Also he never feasted on the PP like McDavid.   Even now, Crosby is one of the even strength leaders, and doesn't cheat.    It's not like the Oilers don't have a good supporting cast right now either.   Like Crosby, who doesn't cheat defensively ever, McDavid going to have to change his game if he wants a cup.  

[IBatch]

On 3/9/2023 at 11:49 PM, Slegr said:

I still think it’s highway robbery that they gave MVP to Matthews last year. McDavid deserved it last year, and he’ll get it with no eastern media interference this year.

Nope.  Mathews deserved it.   No skin in the game, he was better. 

[IBatch]

On 3/7/2023 at 10:56 PM, cripplereh said:

Last I saw his points at his games played was the same as Crosby.Rules changed and scoring went up so he has passed Crosby.

 

In 15 years people will say was he really better then Crosby?  

 

He needs to win 4 cups to be better and gold in the Olympics with more points or he even if ends his career with more points will not be as good.

Crosby will retire as a top 5-7 all-time center likely.   Ovi the best LW likely.   Lucky to have them, we truly are.   Great examples of what being a superstar really is.    I'd have a hard time putting Crosby ahead of Yzerman and Sakic - but he's made a case for it.   McDavid?  He needs to adapt the same way Yzerman and Crosby did, or EDM won't win a cup.     He's for sure the biggest offensive weapon in the league now.    

 

Scoring goals like a boss.   It's great to see him add that to his game.   He's in his peak prime now. 

Edited March 17, 2023 by IBatch

[Kevin Biestra]

42 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Of note... 80 of McDavids 130 points have come on the power play.    That's a ton.    Good for him too.   He's only one point ahead of bottom feeder team EK for 5 x 5 points and not that far ahead of EP either.    He's like Ovi on steroids right now.   Gretzky never did this.    He scored the vast majority of his points 5 x 5... Hope McDavid scores 160 though.  Will be in special company then. 

 

I think he'll just get to 150...but that is very special company.  I think just five other players ever (six if we count Marc Tardif in the WHA).

 

160 is for Gretzky and Mario...and of course everyone who ever got to 160 also got to 199.

 

Edited March 17, 2023 by Kevin Biestra

[IBatch]

1 minute ago, Kevin Biestra said:

 

I think he'll just get to 150...but that is very special company.  I think just five other players ever.  160 is for Gretzky and Mario...and of course everyone who ever got to 160 also got to 199.

Me too but hoping he can do it.   Has to score at almost a 3 point pace to do it.   Espo, Nichols, Yzerman, Mario and Wayne.   That said even 130 is special company.    Without checking I think Nilsson, Espo, Orr, Coffey, Hawerchuk, Yzerman, Mario, Gretzky, Kurri, Dionne and that's about it.   Did i miss anyone? 

[Kevin Biestra]

24 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Me too but hoping he can do it.   Has to score at almost a 3 point pace to do it.   Espo, Nichols, Yzerman, Mario and Wayne.   That said even 130 is special company.    Without checking I think Nilsson, Espo, Orr, Coffey, Hawerchuk, Yzerman, Mario, Gretzky, Kurri, Dionne and that's about it.   Did i miss anyone? 

 

Off the top of my head... Dennis Maruk, Peter Stastny, Denis Savard, Bossy, Lafleur, Jagr, Oates, Lafontaine, Brett Hull, Pierre Turgeon and Trottier.

 

Bobby Hull, Andre Lacroix, Real Cloutier and Marc Tardif if the WHA counts...maybe there were a couple more of them.

 

All of them a long time ago now though.  McDavid has already done something special even if he slips on a banana peel tomorrow.

 

It's kind of the same jump on defense for the big two.  The two guys who ever got to 104 also got to 138.

 

 

Edited March 17, 2023 by Kevin Biestra