Jake Virtanen | #18 | RW

[ForsbergTheGreat]

Personally I think a player would benefit more from playing top minutes in junior, racking up points there playing 20 minutes a night and being a star in the WHL than playing 10 minutes a night as a fourth liner in Vancouver, not scoring and getting his confidence shattered. It's a common trend, just open your eyes and look around the NHL. The only kids who are forced into the NHL at such a young age are those who are real elite offensive talents - McDavid, Eichel, Reinhart, Ehlers, Bennett. To be honest, some of those kids would probably even benefit from a year back in junior. Virtanen is NOWHERE NEAR as good as any of them, and until he has a more rounded, full game he should be in junior earning his keep and developing to become a better player. Just look at kids who have taken that extra year - Domi was sent back and now he's arguably a star and maybe even better than Horvat. He really didn't have to, he was doing just about everything in junior, but that extra year helped round out his defensive game and now he's an absolute stud.

That's what we should be aiming for with Virtanen. Instead, I fear we're going to go down the dreaded Kassian pathway and break him. Kassian wasn't good enough when he was forced to play in Buffalo (as a lot of their kids aren't) and he's a fringe middle-6 inconsistent winger. If Virtanen becomes the next Kassian we have absolutely blown it as an organization.

This argument of Ehlers and Nylander being small skilled forwards is getting a bit rediculous. Ehlers is 6'0 and has room to put on some mass, but he's far from small. Domi is 5'10" and look what he's doing. Size is the most overrated value on these boards for whatever stupid reason and I don't know how many cups Patrick Kane has to win before people realize that the Bruins cup run was an anomaly - the way of the physical powerforward is GONE. Today's NHL is all about speed and elite skill. Virtanen has speed, he has physicality, but he definately lack that elite level of offensive talent. That's why I think he should go back to the WHL and try and put up more than a point per game in the WHL. I'm sure he's got it in him, but playing crap minutes as a checker with Vancouver isn't going to help him score or play better defence.

When Prust and Higgins return, Virtanen is our 12th forward. He just got benched for Cracknell as well, and rightfully so, which just shows that even the coaches think Cracknell is a better, more rounded choice right now than Virtanen which is good to see. I'd even put Shinkaruk and Gaunce well ahead of Virtanen on the depth chart. Shinkaruk is 3rd in the AHL right now with 6 goals in 6 games, he's going to get his chance at one point and when he does Virtanen isn't going to get a sniff of NHL time. I'm not sure if we can burn a year of his ELC and send him down to Utica which might not be a bad option, but I'd much rather him develop in the WHL. Jake's certainly not better than Higgins, Prust, Hansen, Gaunce or even Shinkaruk and doesn't deserve NHL minutes over those guys this season.

As for the Montreal game, my mistake, it was a 3-1 game early in the third where we had blown two goal leads before. Everyone knows the importance and idiocity of that penalty. It was a classic rookie penalty and Jake's lucky that Price messed up or it could have easily cost us the game. I'm not too fussed about finding a first line center with the emergence of McCann, you never know, but this absolute waste of a 6th overall pick has to be salvaged and if we keep Virtanen up with the Canucks to play 10 minutes a night of checking hockey, we'll have made to mistakes on one. Good teams don't even make one mistake with a pick that high but we're on the verge of really messing up.

Oh well, at least Boeser's looking good so far, hopefully we don't rush him into the league as well.

Personally you don't have a clue that's why u don't understand whats good for a player.  Virtanen, just like horvat last year, it gaining NHL experience and learning from the best.  If he wants to go back and dominate a league i'm sure there's a few beer leagues he could join.  

The funny thing is you say one thing without even thinking about the other.  I named you a list of players that played in the NHL as 19 year olds and didn't put up huge numbers.  Ryan Johansen and Voracek trump anything you have to say.  So it's really time you give up.

As for Nylander and Ehlers The size doesn't refer to their physical stature is refers to there style of plays,  Nylander will never have hit a player like Virtanen hit Nichuskin.  Ehlers will never make a player panic when they have the puck..  If you had to chose a player to drive the puck to the front of the net and bang the garbage goal in, which one of the three are you going to choose?  The playoffs is a completely different game.  The refs put away their whistles and open ice doesn't exist.   How has crosby, the games top skilled player, done in playoffs that last 3 years?  How did he do against a big shut down team like the bruins in the two years ago playoffs.  How did the canucks two greatest skill players do against that same bruins team.  Or a very similar team in the Kings?

Cracknell didn't replace Virtanen, he got hurt.  Did you not see OEL cheap shot him.. do even watch the games?   If today's NHL was about elite offensive skill set, tell me when was the last time the art ross trophy winner won the Stanely cup in the same year?  The game is all about character and two way play.  Toews, Bergeron, Kopitar.  Add that with an elite power forward.  Hossa, Brown, Lucic.  Canucks have the two way center in Horvat, they even have high end skill in Baertschi and Shinkaruk (who already has 6 goals in 6 games this year, his second year pro), canucks didn't have the power forward.  Tell me again which player single handedly beat the canucks in the post season last year.  Imagine if canucks had player like that but with a way higher offensive ability.  Wouldn't a player like that be nice.  The best thing is we will be able to bring up this in 5 years, you are going to look a dumb as clutch, for making the burrows thread.

[Edlerberry]

 

I watched the Oiler's game for last ten minutes, let me tell you something you actually noticed Leon Draistel, but with Viratanen he is no were at the level Leon Draistel,It's time we bite our egos and admit Virtanen is years away from being a impact player. 

 

ya i'd notice someone playing top line with rnh and hall too.

 

damn the stupid is strong.

[Gstank29]

ya i'd notice someone playing top line with rnh and hall too.

 

damn the stupid is strong.

Yapukov right 

[Junkyard Dog]

Gaunce outplayed Virtanen last game. I noticed Gaunce's overall game and drive. Makes smart and safe plays. Looked like a good fit with Bo and Hansen, that line was pretty noticeable tonight.

Looked like Virtanen got hurt on two separate plays although it did not seem all that bad. If he is hurt then that opens up opportunity with Higgins coming back soon and gives us an extended look at Gaunce.

If he's not hurt then we have some tough decisions ahead.

Hope it isn't serious.

Edited October 31, 2015 by Junkyard Dog

[Edlerberry]

Yapukov right 

can't tell if serious. last 10 mins of the game 'he saw'

 

Edited October 31, 2015 by Edlerberry

[Nave]

Virtanen's been playing well. Hope his ribs are alright. 

Sometimes he looks lost, but then you realize he's covering the point or someone off-screen. 

[Derp...]

Hope he can rest for a bit and maybe even go play a couple games in Utica like Bo did last year. The last thing we want is for him to get injured. That's not good for anyones development.

[DownUndaCanuck]

Hope he can rest for a bit and maybe even go play a couple games in Utica like Bo did last year. The last thing we want is for him to get injured. That's not good for anyones development.

I'm not sure how the rules of playing in the AHL work with the ELC, but that'd be for the best. I'd love to see what Virtanen can do on Utica's top line or 2nd line, or even just playing with Shinkaruk. Get him some goals, get his confidence up and see what he can do as a scorer instead of a checker.

Injured or not, Gaunce easily outplayed Virtanen and was just another reminder that the poor former first round picks who have been plugging away in the AHL for years after earning their keep in junior deserve to be in the NHL over the teenagers like Virtanen. Gaunce's game is far more complete, he can kill penalties, even switch back to center if need be and he's smarter defensively, plus that was a great NHL-level goal he scored tonight.

[CanucksJay]

I'm not sure how the rules of playing in the AHL work with the ELC, but that'd be for the best. I'd love to see what Virtanen can do on Utica's top line or 2nd line, or even just playing with Shinkaruk. Get him some goals, get his confidence up and see what he can do as a scorer instead of a checker.

Injured or not, Gaunce easily outplayed Virtanen and was just another reminder that the poor former first round picks who have been plugging away in the AHL for years after earning their keep in junior deserve to be in the NHL over the teenagers like Virtanen. Gaunce's game is far more complete, he can kill penalties, even switch back to center if need be and he's smarter defensively, plus that was a great NHL-level goal he scored tonight.

It's not the ELC that prevents Virtanen from  playing in the AHL, it's his age as he is too young. That being said, say he injured his ribs tonight and was out for a couple of weeks, he could technically play in the AHL on a conditioning stint for 2 weeks. 

[DownUndaCanuck]

It's not the ELC that prevents Virtanen from  playing in the AHL, it's his age as he is too young. That being said, say he injured his ribs tonight and was out for a couple of weeks, he could technically play in the AHL on a conditioning stint for 2 weeks. 

That would work quite well for him then to get the most professional experience he can without burning a year. Heal up over this injury (broken rib might take a while though), play in the AHL for a couple of weeks, come back for a final NHL game and see where he's at then before sending him back to junior.

Hopefully it's not a fracture or break because a second half-season in a row would hurt. This is a prime year of his development, hopefully it's nothing too serious.

[messier's_elbow]

Its funny when guys like Richardson take cheap shots at Jake, cause he lays bombs. How wasnt that a penalty btw?

They better get their licks in while they can. When Jake matures and is no longer a baby face with average upper body strength, no one will be pulling that garbage on him anymore. This kid is going to be invaluable in future playoff series.

[messier's_elbow]

I guess you're upset.  I sense that in the tone of your writing.  Might I ask why you're so obviously upset on a night when the Canucks play well and win?  I make the assumption you're a Canuck's fan, and you are (of course) are entitled to your beliefs.  I just fail to understand why you are upset - we won,  our kids played great!  Heck, our young guys - including Virtanen - were some of our best players.  I really don't get why you would want a Smurflike softy instead of a steam train?  Vey and Baer are exactly like those two softies you mentioned.  We need Virtanen's speed and aggressive play.  Little small Smurflike players, we already have seen that movie, and left the theatre.

Cause he doesnt know his head from his a#$. He wont be saying he rather have Ehlers when there is a 7 game series, and Jake is wearing down the opposing D. This is a development year, I think Jake and Jared both stay along with the obvious, Hutton. Unless they think Mccann isnt ready for the NHL grind. Cracknel will get sent down. Baertchi better get his stuff together, Higgins is back soon...

[clutesi]

Watching Gaunce outplay Virtanen last night perfectly explains why Virtanen needs to go back to junior. He needs more skill and he needs to process the game more effectively. You get that from playing big minutes in every situation. Not playing sheltered minutes and running around trying to lay out players on every shift. He's got one assist in eight games and hasn't looked dangerous. That's not what I expect from my top ten draft pick. Virtanen could be good some day, he's got the toolbox, but right now all I see is size, speed. Add some skills to those elements and you have an NHL forward. 

[Alflives]

Watching Gaunce outplay Virtanen last night perfectly explains why Virtanen needs to go back to junior. He needs more skill and he needs to process the game more effectively. You get that from playing big minutes in every situation. Not playing sheltered minutes and running around trying to lay out players on every shift. He's got one assist in eight games and hasn't looked dangerous. That's not what I expect from my top ten draft pick. Virtanen could be good some day, he's got the toolbox, but right now all I see is size, speed. Add some skills to those elements and you have an NHL forward. 

you have an interesting perspective.  I wonder what you expect from Virtanen?  He plays exactly the way the coaches want him to.  He forces the other team's D to be aware of him, thus keeping them from joining the rush.  He impacts the game, helping set a great tone, every time he's on the ice.  I respect your opinion, but don't really understand what you are pointing out.  He's big, fast, aggressive, and impacts the opponent's D.  Do you want him to race around on the outside, like a Smurf, looking all fancy but accomplishing nothing?  

[Frazzy Desjardins]

Personally I think a player would benefit more from playing top minutes in junior, racking up points there playing 20 minutes a night and being a star in the WHL than playing 10 minutes a night as a fourth liner in Vancouver, not scoring and getting his confidence shattered. It's a common trend, just open your eyes and look around the NHL. The only kids who are forced into the NHL at such a young age are those who are real elite offensive talents - McDavid, Eichel, Reinhart, Ehlers, Bennett. To be honest, some of those kids would probably even benefit from a year back in junior. Virtanen is NOWHERE NEAR as good as any of them, and until he has a more rounded, full game he should be in junior earning his keep and developing to become a better player. Just look at kids who have taken that extra year - Domi was sent back and now he's arguably a star and maybe even better than Horvat. He really didn't have to, he was doing just about everything in junior, but that extra year helped round out his defensive game and now he's an absolute stud.

That's what we should be aiming for with Virtanen. Instead, I fear we're going to go down the dreaded Kassian pathway and break him. Kassian wasn't good enough when he was forced to play in Buffalo (as a lot of their kids aren't) and he's a fringe middle-6 inconsistent winger. If Virtanen becomes the next Kassian we have absolutely blown it as an organization.

This argument of Ehlers and Nylander being small skilled forwards is getting a bit rediculous. Ehlers is 6'0 and has room to put on some mass, but he's far from small. Domi is 5'10" and look what he's doing. Size is the most overrated value on these boards for whatever stupid reason and I don't know how many cups Patrick Kane has to win before people realize that the Bruins cup run was an anomaly - the way of the physical powerforward is GONE. Today's NHL is all about speed and elite skill. Virtanen has speed, he has physicality, but he definately lack that elite level of offensive talent. That's why I think he should go back to the WHL and try and put up more than a point per game in the WHL. I'm sure he's got it in him, but playing crap minutes as a checker with Vancouver isn't going to help him score or play better defence.

When Prust and Higgins return, Virtanen is our 12th forward. He just got benched for Cracknell as well, and rightfully so, which just shows that even the coaches think Cracknell is a better, more rounded choice right now than Virtanen which is good to see. I'd even put Shinkaruk and Gaunce well ahead of Virtanen on the depth chart. Shinkaruk is 3rd in the AHL right now with 6 goals in 6 games, he's going to get his chance at one point and when he does Virtanen isn't going to get a sniff of NHL time. I'm not sure if we can burn a year of his ELC and send him down to Utica which might not be a bad option, but I'd much rather him develop in the WHL. Jake's certainly not better than Higgins, Prust, Hansen, Gaunce or even Shinkaruk and doesn't deserve NHL minutes over those guys this season.

As for the Montreal game, my mistake, it was a 3-1 game early in the third where we had blown two goal leads before. Everyone knows the importance and idiocity of that penalty. It was a classic rookie penalty and Jake's lucky that Price messed up or it could have easily cost us the game. I'm not too fussed about finding a first line center with the emergence of McCann, you never know, but this absolute waste of a 6th overall pick has to be salvaged and if we keep Virtanen up with the Canucks to play 10 minutes a night of checking hockey, we'll have made to mistakes on one. Good teams don't even make one mistake with a pick that high but we're on the verge of really messing up.

Oh well, at least Boeser's looking good so far, hopefully we don't rush him into the league as well.

arent you being a little bit harsh?? we finally draft a hometown kid destined to be a fan favourite who hits like a train at 19 years old, a lower mainland born and bred power forward who is so young he is still eligible for jr and you call him a waste of a 6th overall pick....

 

 

 

not to mention you put all that thought into typing an essay about it... you are delusional, i hope you turn into the modern day clutch and eat your words when he finally breaks out.

 

I do think he should go back to junior though, but to call the kid a bust already is just mind blowing lol

Edited October 31, 2015 by Frazzy Desjardins

[Alflives]

arent you being a little bit harsh?? we finally draft a hometown kid destined to be a fan favourite who hits like a train at 19 years old, a lower mainland born and bred power forward who is so young he is still eligible for jr and you call him a waste of a 6th overall pick....

 

 

 

not to mention put all that thought into typing an essay about it... you are delusional, i hope you turn into the modern day clutch and eat your words when he finally breaks out.

 

I do think he should go back to junior thought but to call the kid a bust already is just mind blowing lol

down under Canuck is not a Canuck fan.  He writes like he's a mad Flames fan, and because his team sucks, and ours is winning, he posts here trying to make himself feel better.  

He needs to realize having Virtanen is way better for our team's success that the two Smurflike guys he wanted to draft.  We have Vey and Baer who are better than those other two guys anyway.

plus, when true Canuck's fans challenge him, in the open forum, he runs and hides in the Calgary forms - runs and hides much like those two softies he prefers to Virtanen.

[BanTSN]

arent you being a little bit harsh?? we finally draft a hometown kid destined to be a fan favourite who hits like a train at 19 years old, a lower mainland born and bred power forward who is so young he is still eligible for jr and you call him a waste of a 6th overall pick....

 

 

 

not to mention put all that thought into typing an essay about it... you are delusional, i hope you turn into the modern day clutch and eat your words when he finally breaks out.

 

I do think he should go back to junior thought but to call the kid a bust already is just mind blowing lol

As others have said, It looks like this person is disgruntled about not having his favorite draft choice being selected, and hasn't moved on since.  There are a few of these people.  That's sad.  And while probably the best choice available, Dylan Larkin, isn't being chatted about by them, for some reason it's Ehlers and Nylander.  All these players aren't a Jake Virtanen type.  But they are similar to McCann.

Instead of being upset about missing out on these players, we should be excited that we have Virtanen AND McCann. 

The Canucks needed both player types going forward, and Benning absolutely nailed the 2014 draft.  Especially of Tryamkin turns into an NHLer, because Demko looks lights-out too.

Larkin, Ehlers, and Nylander will all turn into great players in their own right, but they are all on the best teams for their development.  Larkin to Detroit is perfect.  Ehlers is surrounded by big forwards in Winnipeg.  Nylander will be a star playmaker in Toronto, who just traded their all-star away to make room for him.

The Canucks still have the Sedins and aren't rebuilding like Toronto is.  They lacked a Virtanen type.  They also lacked centers with upside and had to trade Kesler to get McCann.

In the future the Canucks will need additional defense to compliment Hutton, who's a nice surprise, and will need to round out their core going forward.  Right now there's a lot of elements to be excited about as Canucks fans.  They might even be assembling a complete team that will hopefully win their first Stanley Cup.

[Alflives]

As others have said, It looks like this person is disgruntled about not having his favorite draft choice being selected, and hasn't moved on since.  There are a few of these people.  That's sad.  And while probably the best choice available, Dylan Larkin, isn't being chatted about by them, for some reason it's Ehlers and Nylander.  All these players aren't a Jake Virtanen type.  But they are similar to McCann.

Instead of being upset about missing out on these players, we should be excited that we have Virtanen AND McCann. 

The Canucks needed both player types going forward, and Benning absolutely nailed the 2014 draft.  Especially of Tryamkin turns into an NHLer, because Demko looks lights-out too.

Larkin, Ehlers, and Nylander will all turn into great players in their own right, but they are all on the best teams for their development.  Larkin to Detroit is perfect.  Ehlers is surrounded by big forwards in Winnipeg.  Nylander will be a star playmaker in Toronto, who just traded their all-star away to make room for him.

The Canucks still have the Sedins and aren't rebuilding like Toronto is.  They lacked a Virtanen type.  They also lacked centers with upside and had to trade Kesler to get McCann.

In the future the Canucks will need additional defense to compliment Hutton, who's a nice surprise, and will need to round out their core going forward.  Right now there's a lot of elements to be excited about as Canucks fans.  They might even be assembling a complete team that will hopefully win their first Stanley Cup.

what proof is there those three players will be stars.  That's poppycock.  They are far more likely to bust.  Even the much touted Larkin is falling off.  And don't be too surprised when Ehlers and Nylander end up playing in the Euro leagues.

i think we needed some balance to this discussion, especially since this is a CANUCKS board.

[Toews]

Alflives is not a Canucks fan, he is simply here to make Canucks fans look bad by posting totally ridiculous over the top blanket statements about players nobody really believes he has ever watched.

Yeah it's not exactly difficult coming up with some BS narrative just because you do not like a poster's opinion.

[Mackcanuck]

The Calgary Hitmen are not exactly a powerhouse team, In fact I think they will suck this year.

IMHO The only reason the Hitmen GM wants Virt back is to sell tickets!

Benning should not send Virt back to a struggling, rebuilding team