Management miscues? Did we maximize our return today?

[Wrecken]

After PLD was picked (screw you CBJ!) I was praying that they would announce a trade before we picked and that we had moved back to 9-10 and gotten acouple more picks in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. I am happy with OJ, but there were others that would have been fine with me at 9-10. However I doubt any of the other teams cared much after the top 4 were gone.

[ice orca]

I like Juolevi but i hope everybody realizes it's going to take a couple of years of development for this kid. Some people in other threads have him in the starting lineup next year. Let's hope the management has a little more patience for once.

[wren223]

35 minutes ago, Wrecken said:

After PLD was picked (screw you CBJ!) I was praying that they would announce a trade before we picked and that we had moved back to 9-10 and gotten acouple more picks in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. I am happy with OJ, but there were others that would have been fine with me at 9-10. However I doubt any of the other teams cared much after the top 4 were gone.

Hahaha for some reason I don't know if I down with calling him OJ?!?!?

[mpt]

3 hours ago, ice orca said:

I like Juolevi but i hope everybody realizes it's going to take a couple of years of development for this kid. Some people in other threads have him in the starting lineup next year. Let's hope the management has a little more patience for once.

For sure, I'm looking forward to see him at prospects camp, but let's give this kid some time to develop.  We don't need him in our lineup until Edler, Hutton, Sbisa, or Hamhuis? are gone.

[mpt]

I didn't want to start a new thread, but man does Day 2 of the draft suck when we don't have any picks...

[Crabcakes]

There's an old adage that when teams trade, the team who gets the best player wins the trade.

 

Same thing in drafting.  They have to take the best player to maximize their return.  This is why especially in the 1st round, GM's select the BPA. 

 

Trading down would not get the Canucks a better player

[16ToWin]

13 hours ago, The Vancouver Connection said:

Now, Let's just run through today's draft, even events leading up to the draft, perhaps even past trades/deals. 

 

Note: I have no problem/issue with Benning's pick. However, did we maximize our return today? No.

 

The second LDB was drafted by CBJ he should of traded down, with the flames, sabers at the very least. Get an additional 2nd or 3rd, Calgary would of done this in heartbeat, they had picks they could of parted with and they wanted MT bad, it was obvious. 

 

I think Benning is a great scout he knows what he's doing on that end, but he's no mastermind - Being a GM requires more than being a great scout, it requires the ability to negotiate, quick on your feet and to deal. 

 

This isn't the first time we've missed to maximize our return, and it seems it won't be the last. The issue here isn't who we pick or trade or who we sign, it's always the return that should be the focus. We missed out on an opportunity to acquire more picks today and we missed the boat, that's it. 

 

Now, like I said I wasn't there, I don't know what management discussed, I'm sure they knew/know something I didn't - but just seems like we're not taking advantage of our ammunition here. 

 

Thoughts?

Why didn't they then?

[stawns]

13 hours ago, mpt said:

And if the Flames knew that we weren't going with or interested in Tkachuk, why would they offer us anything when they know they'll just get him anyways?

Exactly........the only way the Flames or coyotes trade up if is they desperately wanted tkachuk.  Obviously the Flames had another selection they valued equally, probably juolevi.......so why would they trade up is right.

[VegasCanuck]

With Debois gone, (was surprised by this) we got a really good D who should evolve into a top pairing guy.

 

Now, sign Stamkos July 1 and call it a day!

[selkirkcraig]

15 hours ago, The Vancouver Connection said:

Now, Let's just run through today's draft, even events leading up to the draft, perhaps even past trades/deals. 

 

Note: I have no problem/issue with Benning's pick. However, did we maximize our return today? No.

 

The second LDB was drafted by CBJ he should of traded down, with the flames, sabers at the very least. Get an additional 2nd or 3rd, Calgary would of done this in heartbeat, they had picks they could of parted with and they wanted MT bad, it was obvious. 

 

I think Benning is a great scout he knows what he's doing on that end, but he's no mastermind - Being a GM requires more than being a great scout, it requires the ability to negotiate, quick on your feet and to deal. 

 

This isn't the first time we've missed to maximize our return, and it seems it won't be the last. The issue here isn't who we pick or trade or who we sign, it's always the return that should be the focus. We missed out on an opportunity to acquire more picks today and we missed the boat, that's it. 

 

Now, like I said I wasn't there, I don't know what management discussed, I'm sure they knew/know something I didn't - but just seems like we're not taking advantage of our ammunition here. 

 

Thoughts?

thoughts? think for yourself and don't mimic the radio "experts."  if they knew anything about the game, they would be working in it.  their opinions and conjecture are just that, and usually ridiculous.  how do you know that "calgary would have done this in a heartbeat?"  Because Ottawa did something weird?  Do you actually think that a scenario played out where another gm offered jb a "2nd/3rd" to move up one or two spots and jb turned him down?  really?  or that he was too lazy to pick up a phone and make some calls - btw, he's known to be a gm who keeps in contact with all the other gms.  in short, he's well connected.  

 

PS, the data is quite clear that trading up is almost always a bad move, so fewer teams are willing to do it..

[Baggins]

15 hours ago, The Vancouver Connection said:

I don't but I look at teams like NJ who got a 3rd rounder for moving down 1 spot. 

That could be because they had two or three on their list that they'd be perfectly happy with. Moving down one spot they're guaranteed still getting one they wnat. When you have a specific guy you want moving down is rolling the dice he won't be grabbed by somebody else.

[GB5]

17 hours ago, The Vancouver Connection said:

Now, Let's just run through today's draft, even events leading up to the draft, perhaps even past trades/deals. 

 

Note: I have no problem/issue with Benning's pick. However, did we maximize our return today? No.

 

The second LDB was drafted by CBJ he should of traded down, with the flames, sabers at the very least. Get an additional 2nd or 3rd, Calgary would of done this in heartbeat, they had picks they could of parted with and they wanted MT bad, it was obvious. 

 

I think Benning is a great scout he knows what he's doing on that end, but he's no mastermind - Being a GM requires more than being a great scout, it requires the ability to negotiate, quick on your feet and to deal. 

 

This isn't the first time we've missed to maximize our return, and it seems it won't be the last. The issue here isn't who we pick or trade or who we sign, it's always the return that should be the focus. We missed out on an opportunity to acquire more picks today and we missed the boat, that's it. 

 

Now, like I said I wasn't there, I don't know what management discussed, I'm sure they knew/know something I didn't - but just seems like we're not taking advantage of our ammunition here. 

 

Thoughts?

You guys are all over the place 'eh?

 

Woulda coulda shouda......gets old pretty quick. You make it sound sooooo easy, I'm surprised that JB and the rest of the Canucks brain trust never thought of that.  .....Seems like every GM should be lining up to give away their draft picks to the Canucks I guess. 

[RyIe]

Juolevi was a good pick at 5. Like Benning and Linden said, there's a premium on elite defensemen these days, teams have to overpay to acquire them. Well the overpayment was picking him at 5 and not taking the risk that another team would have acquired him. Juolevi was going in the top 6 for sure, none of Keller, Jost, Sergachev, and Nylander would have knocked him down.

 

The misstep this year was failing to deal at the trade deadline for picks.  

 

 

[zimmy]

4 minutes ago, RyIe said:

Juolevi was a good pick at 5. Like Benning and Linden said, there's a premium on elite defensemen these days, teams have to overpay to acquire them. Well the overpayment was picking him at 5 and not taking the risk that another team would have acquired him. Juolevi was going in the top 6 for sure, none of Keller, Jost, Sergachev, and Nylander would have knocked him down.

 

The misstep this year was failing to deal at the trade deadline for picks.  

 

 

"Misstep" gets my vote as the best descriptor of JimmyGM's maneuvering ever! But what was the trade deadline, a misstep or failure? One comes off as rather more condeming don't you think?

[canuckledraggin]

You'll notice that none of the top 15 picks in the draft were moved. It seems as though everyone was locked into taking a player with their pick and didn't consider a move up or down to be worth the risk. There's way to much we shoulda done this... when you consider nobody else did anything besides make their pick.

[aqua59]

18 hours ago, The Vancouver Connection said:

Now, Let's just run through today's draft, even events leading up to the draft, perhaps even past trades/deals. 

 

Note: I have no problem/issue with Benning's pick. However, did we maximize our return today? No.

 

The second LDB was drafted by CBJ he should of traded down, with the flames, sabers at the very least. Get an additional 2nd or 3rd, Calgary would of done this in heartbeat, they had picks they could of parted with and they wanted MT bad, it was obvious. 

 

I think Benning is a great scout he knows what he's doing on that end, but he's no mastermind - Being a GM requires more than being a great scout, it requires the ability to negotiate, quick on your feet and to deal. 

 

This isn't the first time we've missed to maximize our return, and it seems it won't be the last. The issue here isn't who we pick or trade or who we sign, it's always the return that should be the focus. We missed out on an opportunity to acquire more picks today and we missed the boat, that's it. 

 

Now, like I said I wasn't there, I don't know what management discussed, I'm sure they knew/know something I didn't - but just seems like we're not taking advantage of our ammunition here. 

 

Thoughts?

You've milked three pages of thread on this topic when we all won't know the answer for years.

[aqua59]

44 minutes ago, canuckledraggin said:

You'll notice that none of the top 15 picks in the draft were moved. It seems as though everyone was locked into taking a player with their pick and didn't consider a move up or down to be worth the risk. There's way to much we shoulda done this... when you consider nobody else did anything besides make their pick.

Thats a great point!

 

[harrytoolips]

19 hours ago, MayRayDown said:

What inside sources do you have that flames or sabres wouldn't have picked Joulevi over who they picked?

And this is exactly it..JB says they had Joulevi at #5 on their list, and obviously he didn't want to risk losing that player, assuming say Cal or Buf we're going to pick another player...and risk losing their targeted player for what, a 2nd round pick that has a 30% or whatever chance of becoming a fringe NHLer, I'm sure he'd say no thanks..

[harrytoolips]

14 hours ago, Wrecken said:

After PLD was picked (screw you CBJ!) I was praying that they would announce a trade before we picked and that we had moved back to 9-10 and gotten acouple more picks in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. I am happy with OJ, but there were others that would have been fine with me at 9-10. However I doubt any of the other teams cared much after the top 4 were gone.

Benning obviously didn't want to risk losing his BPA at #5 for what a 2nd or 3rd round pick?? Forget it you take the BPA..

[harrytoolips]

1 hour ago, canuckledraggin said:

You'll notice that none of the top 15 picks in the draft were moved. It seems as though everyone was locked into taking a player with their pick and didn't consider a move up or down to be worth the risk. There's way to much we shoulda done this... when you consider nobody else did anything besides make their pick.

Ottawa moved up from 12 to 11 with NJ..