JM_ Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 23 minutes ago, theo5789 said: I doubt Phil Kessel was ever really ripped and he's made quite a career for himself. You never know what player you'll get as many players of all shapes and sizes make the NHL for whatever reason. But yes Shinkaruk has been a disappointment, but he had some early injuries that set him back and maybe he couldn't get out of that funk. the only thing ripped about Kessel was the bread going into his cheese dip. But he's a great example of pure shooting skills and he's managed to figure out where he needs to get to most of the time to be effective. Boeser is what an athletic Kessel would have looked like. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Surfer Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 51 minutes ago, theo5789 said: I doubt Phil Kessel was ever really ripped and he's made quite a career for himself. You never know what player you'll get as many players of all shapes and sizes make the NHL for whatever reason. But yes Shinkaruk has been a disappointment, but he had some early injuries that set him back and maybe he couldn't get out of that funk. Kessel was like the Charles Barkley of ice hockey. 26 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said: the only thing ripped about Kessel was the bread going into his cheese dip. But he's a great example of pure shooting skills and he's managed to figure out where he needs to get to most of the time to be effective. Boeser is what an athletic Kessel would have looked like. Nobody could believe the athletic feats he could pull off. Kessel, out of shape (?), did things like allmost win the standing vertical jump in fitness testing his draft year. Very explosive & one of the fastest skaters. A freak of nature that cannot be explained! I know, I know, I have seen the video's of a puffed and chuffed Kessel fighting to get back in to plays in Toronto. You still have to train for endurance. Shinkaruk never had that power, or explosiveness in his stride. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flickyoursedin Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 13 hours ago, AlwaysACanuckFan said: Cozens-Getzlaf Yes please Krebs-Skinner Yes please Podk-Laine Yes please Zegras-Giroux Yes please Broberg-Edler Yes please Caufield-Debrincat Yes please Soderstrom-Ellis Yes please Boldy-Wheeler Yes please Turcotte-Bergeron Definitely Yes please Would be happy with any one of those because the Canucks can use any one of them, and would make a nice addition to Pettersson Hughes Horvat Boeser. What would be a comparable with Newhook? I’ve seen Barzal comps for Newhook which isn’t a bad comp I see a Zach Parise with less defensive responsibility. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 1 hour ago, Canuck Surfer said: At age 16 Shinkaruk was an absolute star. 49 goals and WHL 91 points two years before he was drafted. I remember being so excited when we drafted him! He had potential to be a great pick! I also remember seeing a picture of him with his shirt off at prospect camp. Beside Jordan Subban & Bo, who were both ripped. It set me off right away. Sloppy & it was obvious. I wondered how a guy could show up without having put the same work in? You cannot take it for granted. I'm sure most scouts have a pretty good idea whats what, before the combines? But since that year I started paying attention. Could he do a pull up though...Mittlestadt set the bar literally as a guy who despite little upper body strength could do amazing things. I get what your saying though, these kids are coming in as fit as ever which bodes well for both the NHL and the fans. Shinkaruk was definitely a disappointment, one thing Bennings made very clear is he won’t put up with entitlement (McCaan, and JV early on) and will either beat it out of them or trade them right away. Goldobin will undoubtedly be the next causality (not that he’s entitled, but he’s had his chances and we will move on from him as soon as possible), it’s helpful to create a culture of both internal competition for spots (bye bye Gagne) and promote character. AG plays his heart out which is an example of how this is starting to really work for us.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flickyoursedin Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 12 hours ago, shayster007 said: Can't say I see the Laine/Pod comparison. Podkolzins defining characteristic is he gives 110% every shift. That exact thing is the knock on Laine. What was it about him that made them your choice? I like the Russian a lot and I'm excited about the idea he may drop. I was thinking first couple years of Laine. Big Euro winger with 35+ goal potential. I was trying to keep most of my comps with new age players but somebody has since dropped the Marian Hossa comp which is a way better comparison to how Podkolzin plays. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mll Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 10 minutes ago, IBatch said: Could he do a pull up though...Mittlestadt set the bar literally as a guy who despite little upper body strength could do amazing things. I get what your saying though, these kids are coming in as fit as ever which bodes well for both the NHL and the fans. Shinkaruk was definitely a disappointment, one thing Bennings made very clear is he won’t put up with entitlement (McCaan, and JV early on) and will either beat it out of them or trade them right away. Goldobin will undoubtedly be the next causality (not that he’s entitled, but he’s had his chances and we will move on from him as soon as possible), it’s helpful to create a culture of both internal competition for spots (bye bye Gagne) and promote character. AG plays his heart out which is an example of how this is starting to really work for us.... Mittlestadt had a shoulder misalignment - surprising that they didn't notice it at the combine but the Gophers' coaching staff noticed it immediately. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
250Integra Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 1 hour ago, Jimmy McGill said: the only thing ripped about Kessel was the bread going into his cheese dip. But he's a great example of pure shooting skills and he's managed to figure out where he needs to get to most of the time to be effective. Boeser is what an athletic Kessel would have looked like. Boeser can only dream of having Kessel speed. Say you want about his weight / physical appearance, but he fly down the wing and snipe the puck. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post JM_ Posted May 7, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted May 7, 2019 1 hour ago, Canuck Surfer said: Kessel was like the Charles Barkley of ice hockey. Nobody could believe the athletic feats he could pull off. Kessel, out of shape (?), did things like allmost win the standing vertical jump in fitness testing his draft year. Very explosive & one of the fastest skaters. A freak of nature that cannot be explained! I know, I know, I have seen the video's of a puffed and chuffed Kessel fighting to get back in to plays in Toronto. You still have to train for endurance. Shinkaruk never had that power, or explosiveness in his stride. 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGokou Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 3 hours ago, Canuck Surfer said: At age 16 Shinkaruk was an absolute star. 49 goals and WHL 91 points two years before he was drafted. I remember being so excited when we drafted him! He had potential to be a great pick! I also remember seeing a picture of him with his shirt off at prospect camp. Beside Jordan Subban & Bo, who were both ripped. It set me off right away. Sloppy & it was obvious. I wondered how a guy could show up without having put the same work in? You cannot take it for granted. I'm sure most scouts have a pretty good idea whats what, before the combines? But since that year I started paying attention. In hindsight there are 2 major factors that I feel you could tell he might be a bust and it has nothing to do with his size. First was that he was a fairly early birthday, being much older than his peers. He had a great 16 year old season as you already mentioned and if he had built on that I would probably have no qualms selecting him where he was. However, he actually regressed in his draft season which imo is a big big BIG red flag. Noone should regress in their draft season compared to their D-1 season unless you had a major injury. Even if you had worse teammates you should be able to improve on your season a minimum of 20-30% year over year (this is the average improvement based on my calculations). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGokou Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 2 hours ago, smithers joe said: i heard that kalliyev’s comparison was goldobin. they say, super skilled but doesn’t bring it often enough. i get it. can’t wait for the draft book to come out. they have comparison for the top 2 rounds. Personally Im confident that kaliyev won't be a bust. Goldobin had a 1.4 ppg average in his draft season AND was a early birthday born in October. Kaliyev is practically a full year younger than Goldobin was and put up 1.52 ppg average this season. He also had a higher goal scoring rate than Goldobin. Even if kaliyev doesn't put out his full effort every night like Goldobin I see Kaliyev's floor as 2nd line winger....he's just too talented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 1 minute ago, TGokou said: Personally Im confident that kaliyev won't be a bust. Goldobin had a 1.4 ppg average in his draft season AND was a early birthday born in October. Kaliyev is practically a full year younger than Goldobin was and put up 1.52 ppg average this season. He also had a higher goal scoring rate than Goldobin. Even if kaliyev doesn't put out his full effort every night like Goldobin I see Kaliyev's floor as 2nd line winger....he's just too talented. There are going to be several players with similar ceilings to Kaliyev, that will be there at 10 too. Maybe we are better off taking a guy with a similar ceiling, but without the character flaws of this guy? I read that Podkolzin might (hopefully) fall to 10. Would you rather have Kaliyev or Podkolzin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noble 6 Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 19 minutes ago, TGokou said: Personally Im confident that kaliyev won't be a bust. Goldobin had a 1.4 ppg average in his draft season AND was a early birthday born in October. Kaliyev is practically a full year younger than Goldobin was and put up 1.52 ppg average this season. He also had a higher goal scoring rate than Goldobin. Even if kaliyev doesn't put out his full effort every night like Goldobin I see Kaliyev's floor as 2nd line winger....he's just too talented. Wasn't Goldobin also playing with Galchenyuk and Yakupov? Kaliyev is playing with good players, but no 1st and/or 3rd overall picks. Regarding one of Kaliyev's general knocks, his effort, I've heard that his coach actually asks him not to be the first man in on the forecheck normally. The coach wants his linemates to be first and Kaliyev to be parked in the slot with his deadly shot. That doesn't excuse everything, but it's something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 1 minute ago, Horvat is a Boss said: Wasn't Goldobin also playing with Galchenyuk and Yakupov? Kaliyev is playing with good players, but no 1st and/or 3rd overall picks. Regarding one of Kaliyev's general knocks, his effort, I've heard that his coach actually asks him not to be the first man in on the forecheck normally. The coach wants his linemates to be first and Kaliyev to be parked in the slot with his deadly shot. That doesn't excuse everything, but it's something. I've watched Kaliyev play, only a few time, but I don't remember ever seeing him as first on a puck. Even when he was racing for a free puck, especially against a wall, he always let the other team's player get to the puck first. For myself, that's a really bad sign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 I'd rather have Bobby Orr Brink over Kaliyev. At least he hustles and is hard to play against. From what I've seen of Kaliyev, he maybe has the best shot in the draft, but I question his compete level. He seems to want to stay outside the scrum, waiting for the puck to free so he could score, like a certain other player we have (Goldobin). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Surfer Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 4 hours ago, TGokou said: In hindsight there are 2 major factors that I feel you could tell he might be a bust and it has nothing to do with his size. First was that he was a fairly early birthday, being much older than his peers. He had a great 16 year old season as you already mentioned and if he had built on that I would probably have no qualms selecting him where he was. However, he actually regressed in his draft season which imo is a big big BIG red flag. Noone should regress in their draft season compared to their D-1 season unless you had a major injury. Even if you had worse teammates you should be able to improve on your season a minimum of 20-30% year over year (this is the average improvement based on my calculations). I agree with all of this. It points to him having become complacent after he had his big 16 year old season. I just re read his draft profiles. He was known to have been quick, but not owning elite speed. I also recall Green calling him out early as his AHL coach. Suggested he had to change his game. Because he did not have the speed to just go wide on AHL, D, like he did in junior. Never mind NHL D. Had he taken that on board, and bust his hump early to develop better power, agility to make lateral moves, in his stride? He probably would have been an NHL player. And by the combines? You should be able to demonstrate in interviews that you have taken on development programs. Know your weaknesses. Demonstrate that you have put in world class training in the physical tests to address them. If you are not putting in the work, it will show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noble 6 Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathrowe Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 17 hours ago, theo5789 said: Interesting comparisons, but these are their ceilings, I wonder what comparables their floors would be to determine how risky a pick would be. Cozens- Kyle Turris Krebs-Tyson Jost Podk- Raffi Torres Zegras- Sam Gagner Broberg- Jake Virtanen as a defensemen Caufield-Nathan Gerbe with a better shot Soderstrom- Want to say Troy Stecher but I love the guy Boldy- Bobby Ryan without the Ducks Turcotte- Nazem Kadri No Clue, just tried to have fun with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theo5789 Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 1 minute ago, Deathrowe said: Cozens- Kyle Turris Krebs-Tyson Jost Podk- Raffi Torres Zegras- Sam Gagner Broberg- Jake Virtanen as a defensemen Caufield-Nathan Gerbe with a better shot Soderstrom- Want to say Troy Stecher but I love the guy Boldy- Bobby Ryan without the Ducks Turcotte- Nazem Kadri No Clue, just tried to have fun with it Fair enough, but it makes you think in a different perspective for these players. For example, if Turcotte's ceiling is Bergeron and floor is Kadri, it's a pretty safe pick that will be rewarding. Caufield has potential to be Debrincat, but if he ends up being like Gerbe (is this guy really 5'4?), then do you take that risk? Podkolzin could become a Nichushkin is more of a floor comparison I think. That Zegras floor comparison could be frightening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noble 6 Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seannnp Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 On 5/5/2019 at 8:43 AM, Alflives said: Is there really much of a difference in potential ceiling after the top three of Hughes, Kakko, and Byram are gone? The guy from 4 to 12 could really go in any order. Podkolzin or Boldy or Dach could just as easily go at four as 10. I don't know about that Alf. I think Dach is gone much earlier than 10th. I also don't expect Byram to go 3rd. I expect him to be taken by Detroit. My top 20 : NJ - Hughes NYR - Kakko CHI - Turcotte COL - Dach LA - Cozens DET - Byram BUF - Podkolzin EDM - Boldy ANA - Zegras VAN - Newhook PHI - Caufield MIN - Krebs FLA - Soderstrom ARI - Kaliyev MON - Broberg COL - Harley LAS - Lavoie OTT - Knight ANA - York PIT - Seider 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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