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[Discussion] A stupid proposal


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Ok, how do we get another mid 1st for this year?

 

Nothing is for free that is for sure...……………………..

 

So, what does our 2020 2nd, DiPietro and Baertschi get us as a single 2019 pick?

 

Remember, this is for discussion purposes only...……...

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Baertschi has no value until he shows he can play consistently without concussion effects. If he comes in next year and plays 40ish games before the deadline, then he might be tradeable.

 

DiPietro is a quality goaltending prospects but teams almost never trade for those due to the unknown development path of many goalies.

 

Honestly if we want a mid round 1st it needs to start with a Pearson, Sutter or Tanev.

 

Id look at Pearson+ 2020 2nd for a mid 1st.

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Well my question is why would you want to trade assets for a draft pick this year?  Outside of Tanev or Sutter, we don't have any assets that aren't young players except for Sven.  

 

Our 2nd and Sven alone should fetch us a 20th overall pick in my estimation. 

 

Are you looking for the Canucks to make the biggest splash ever at an NHL draft?  We already have two extra picks this year (Ottawa and someone else's 6th rounders). 

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to get a mid first, it would take a jake or a juolevi. we’ld have to give up someone, we don’t want to. outside of brock, most of our wingers are 3rd and 4th liners. i think leivo and pearson have been adequate but not true, top six. 

it will be interesting to see if the bo/pear/louie trio can continue to show chemistry. if they can, that would give your wingers like lind time to grow into those roles. everything takes time.

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I would rather wait and see what we have in Pearson, Leivo and Spooner.

 

Pearson - former 24 goal scorer with the offensively challenged Kings and an owner of a SC ring

Leivo - I think we've seen penty of promise here

Spooner - former Benning draft pick (2010 2nd round (45 OA) and 13 goal scorer with the Bruins


I suspect that Sutter had been playing through injury for much of the past season until it just got too bad to continue.  This would explain his performance.  He's 30 and far from over the hill imo.  I think that Benning made a good call having 2 defense first lines going into this season however, players have developed and he may want to move on from this strategy next year.  Both Beagle and Sutter bring leadership, and solid defensive play as well as good PK work and face offs.  Sutter brings more offense.  So, maybe one of them has become redundant.  Gaudette has shown that he will develop in the NHL.  There is upside here.

  

I'm not sure where Virtantn's ceiling is.  I suspect he'll end up as a very good 3rd line winger.  If he can learn to crash the net front and play in the dirty areas, 2nd line is a possibility.  However, I really like what he brings.  A big guy who can hit and skate very well while bringing 15 goals is a piece you want to keep.

 

The back end is where I see trades coming from.  Hutton is due a raise but would likely be playing on the 3rd pair if Edler is re-signed.

 

Hutton and Sutter could be our chips to move on.  Would prefer a young RHD (Trouba?) over a draft pick.  

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IMO Hughes and Kakko are the cleary favorite for top spot and top talent, but after that I feel like it's a pretty shallow draft and up in the air what the top 10-20 is going to look like.  I know its in Vancouver but I don't think 2019 is a good draft to be trading away assets to move up or acquire more 1st rounders.

 

Anyways, that mid-late 1st rounder, most likely won't be playing for Vancouver until at least 2021, if not later.  No point of trading away known assets for an unknown draft pick.  I'd rather use these assets to maybe pry a young 20-24 years old player that could be ready to step in on defense mostly (Maybe on a lower scale, but a type of deal like Jones/Johansen or Lindholm/Hanifin for Ferland/Hamilton)

 

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12 hours ago, janisahockeynut said:

Ok, how do we get another mid 1st for this year?

 

Nothing is for free that is for sure...……………………..

 

So, what does our 2020 2nd, DiPietro and Baertschi get us as a single 2019 pick?

 

Remember, this is for discussion purposes only...……...

Depends on who is running the team.

 

33 minutes ago, timberz21 said:

IMO Hughes and Kakko are the cleary favorite for top spot and top talent, but after that I feel like it's a pretty shallow draft and up in the air what the top 10-20 is going to look like.  I know its in Vancouver but I don't think 2019 is a good draft to be trading away assets to move up or acquire more 1st rounders.

 

Anyways, that mid-late 1st rounder, most likely won't be playing for Vancouver until at least 2021, if not later.  No point of trading away known assets for an unknown draft pick.  I'd rather use these assets to maybe pry a young 20-24 years old player that could be ready to step in on defense mostly (Maybe on a lower scale, but a type of deal like Jones/Johansen or Lindholm/Hanifin for Ferland/Hamilton)

 

I don't agree about how long it will take, Boston got mid guys that played right away, a lot of teams get their draft picks playing a lot faster than the Canucks.

I agree about this year's draft and depth but the next year must be a lot better because so many of those players are talked about now like Crosby and Stamkos were a year or more before their draft.

 

Markstrom and a late pick or old prospect might get a 14th or later pick might get a late first round pick this year.

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9 hours ago, VancouverHabitant said:

 

Our 2nd and Sven alone should fetch us a 20th overall pick in my estimation. 

I doubt Sven’s current injury issues (as well as his injury issues in his career) add that much value to get us the 20th overall pick even if combined with our 2nd round pick.  

 

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I am pretty well thinking that Tanev, Baertschi, Hutton Sutter, Markstrom, 2020 2nd, DiPietro are chips I would be ok with trading

 

-Tanev's days here are numbers...…….IMO, Tanev still has good value (not great) and be worth a low 1st (24 - 31), another defensive scheme might be his cure, but we need to up grade, as we need more offense out of our first pairing

-Baertschi's value is de-valued but he still has a decent value...maybe a mid 2nd

-Hutton showed well this year, but there are other alternatives, and sell high on him would be a good idea...value a 2nd

-Sutter's getting old .....value a 2nd

-Markstrom is a question mark and older....value a 2nd

-DiPietro has continued to develop, and is not an undrafted rookie...….value a 2nd

 

The veterans are all tradeable this year, as none should be protected at the expansion draft...……….so if we can package any of them, we should.

 

I do not think Spooner, Pouliot, or Schaller have any value

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12 hours ago, janisahockeynut said:

Ok, how do we get another mid 1st for this year?

 

Nothing is for free that is for sure...……………………..

 

So, what does our 2020 2nd, DiPietro and Baertschi get us as 

 

Remember, this is for discussion purposes only...……...

heartburn Jan, heartburn.

 

I guess I'd want to know who in the 15-25 range you think is projecting to be worth that? I don't know anything about the players in that range this year to be that high on losing Mikey or a 2nd.

 

Bear I'm OK with losing and if he could net us another 2nd rounder for 2019. I'd be confident that Brackett could land us someone in the 30-50 range with potential. 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

heartburn Jan, heartburn.

 

I guess I'd want to know who in the 15-25 range you think is projecting to be worth that? I don't know anything about the players in that range this year to be that high on losing Mikey or a 2nd.

 

Bear I'm OK with losing and if he could net us another 2nd rounder for 2019. I'd be confident that Brackett could land us someone in the 30-50 range with potential. 

 

 

 

Sorry for the Heartburn Jimmy.....LOL

 

I think you know me by know, that I like to start things off and have the narrative work out the details....

 

I am looking at a 16 to 20 ish pick, as a mid-1st ( Technically the mid first would be 11 to 20, but I don't think it is realistic to expect under a 16ish, that might even be wishful thinking on my part...……….

 

I do think that the cream is at the top...that goes for the first round and first round compared to the rest of the draft, but there is going to be some nice picks in around my target area...…….I like Seider big RHD German defenseman, he is going around that area

 

But more importantly, having that 2nd 1st allows Benning a lot of latitude on the better 1st, and where he goes with that one...……..

 

As for our 2nd and DiPietro...…..both great assets, no doubt, but having that 2nd 1st, could be a big part moving forward

 

I would like our draft to go like this...….

 

1st, 1st, 2nd, 3rd...……………..forward, Dman, Damn, Goalie...……….its a dream! I also want some size

 

Hey, if you have a better way to get me that 16-20 OA...…..I am all ears...…….but you gotta give to get!

 

Again, sorry for the heartburn!

 

 

 

 

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12 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

Sorry for the Heartburn Jimmy.....LOL

 

I think you know me by know, that I like to start things off and have the narrative work out the details....

 

I am looking at a 16 to 20 ish pick, as a mid-1st ( Technically the mid first would be 11 to 20, but I don't think it is realistic to expect under a 16ish, that might even be wishful thinking on my part...……….

 

I do think that the cream is at the top...that goes for the first round and first round compared to the rest of the draft, but there is going to be some nice picks in around my target area...…….I like Seider big RHD German defenseman, he is going around that area

 

But more importantly, having that 2nd 1st allows Benning a lot of latitude on the better 1st, and where he goes with that one...……..

 

As for our 2nd and DiPietro...…..both great assets, no doubt, but having that 2nd 1st, could be a big part moving forward

 

I wold like our draft to go like this...….

 

1st, 1st, 2nd, 3rd...……………..forward, Dman, Damn, Goalie...……….its a dream! I also want some size

 

Hey, if you have a better way to get me that 16-20 OA...…..I am all ears...…….but you gotta give to get!

 

Again, sorry for the heartburn!

 

 

No problem, I have zantac.

 

Looking at the trade partners in that area, I'm having a hard time seeing a team that would give up its 1st at the draft for Bear + futures. Usually teams cough up their 1st at the TDL, and unfortunately for us we always seem to have our guys injured for that. 

 

I think your best hope for something like this is with Carolina, who probably lose Ferland and are looking for a winger replacement. If you can construct a Bear + deal that is worth that I want to see it. I think they'd probably want Jake instead. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Wizardofoz said:

Depends on who is running the team.

 

I don't agree about how long it will take, Boston got mid guys that played right away, a lot of teams get their draft picks playing a lot faster than the Canucks.

I agree about this year's draft and depth but the next year must be a lot better because so many of those players are talked about now like Crosby and Stamkos were a year or more before their draft.

 

Markstrom and a late pick or old prospect might get a 14th or later pick might get a late first round pick this year.

Kesler barely got a 24th overall. I doubt Markstrom and any other combinations will get you a 1st.

 

Might want to check your facts before stating Boston is playing their prospect faster than us.  It's only true for Pastrnak, Carlo and McAvoy.    Us we have Horvat, Virtanen, McCann, Boeser, EP and most likely Hughes soon.  Look at the 2017 draft, only 8 players have played the equivalent of 1 full season, EP included.   For 2016 it's only 11 or 12 players, and that was a deep draft.   I think you need to do a little research before throwing out false information.

 

Boston's draft pick

 

Axel Andersson - 2018 - 2nd - 0 games

Urho Vaakainen - 2017 - 1st - 2 games 

Charlie McAvoy - 2016 - 1st - 110 games (started playing draft +1)

Trent Frederic - 2016 - 1st - 13 games 

Ryan Lindgren - 2016 - 2nd - 3 games

Jacob Zboril - 2015 - 1st - 2 games

Jake Debrusk - 2015 - 1st - 130 games (started playing draft +2)

Zachary Seneshyn - 2015 - 1st - 0 games

Brandon Carlo - 2015 - 2nd - 223 games (started playing draft +1)

Jakob Forsbacka-Karlsson - 2015 - 2nd - 29 games

Jeremy Lauzon - 2015 - 2nd - 15 games

David Pastrnak - 2014 - 1st - 312 games (started playing his draft year, only because AHL available, was actually loan to WHJC his draft year and draft +1 year)

Ryan Donato - 2014 - 2nd - 60 games

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2 hours ago, timberz21 said:

Kesler barely got a 24th overall. I doubt Markstrom and any other combinations will get you a 1st.

 

Might want to check your facts before stating Boston is playing their prospect faster than us.  It's only true for Pastrnak, Carlo and McAvoy.    Us we have Horvat, Virtanen, McCann, Boeser, EP and most likely Hughes soon.  Look at the 2017 draft, only 8 players have played the equivalent of 1 full season, EP included.   For 2016 it's only 11 or 12 players, and that was a deep draft.   I think you need to do a little research before throwing out false information.

 

Boston's draft pick

 

Axel Andersson - 2018 - 2nd - 0 games

Urho Vaakainen - 2017 - 1st - 2 games 

Charlie McAvoy - 2016 - 1st - 110 games (started playing draft +1)

Trent Frederic - 2016 - 1st - 13 games 

Ryan Lindgren - 2016 - 2nd - 3 games

Jacob Zboril - 2015 - 1st - 2 games

Jake Debrusk - 2015 - 1st - 130 games (started playing draft +2)

Zachary Seneshyn - 2015 - 1st - 0 games

Brandon Carlo - 2015 - 2nd - 223 games (started playing draft +1)

Jakob Forsbacka-Karlsson - 2015 - 2nd - 29 games

Jeremy Lauzon - 2015 - 2nd - 15 games

David Pastrnak - 2014 - 1st - 312 games (started playing his draft year, only because AHL available, was actually loan to WHJC his draft year and draft +1 year)

Ryan Donato - 2014 - 2nd - 60 games

This is probably as good of an example why you want to get your elite players when you are down, as 4 in 13 is probably a decent stat for a top 10 team not call Tampa Bay, and of the 4 that did get their over 100 games in, I think only Pastrnak  and Carlo were after the 20th pick, if I recall. 

 

Good, accurate scouting and draft position is the only thing that beats out Old Lady Luck

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18 hours ago, janisahockeynut said:

A stupid proposal

....versus all the other ones on this board?    Jan, your proposal doesn't scratch the world of "stupid" in compare to most proposals so you will need to try harder.  Throw in Virtanen, Hutton and Sutter to that offer and "stupid" starts coming into potential range (in comparison to most proposals on this board).

 

Remember, the bar has been set pretty high (or low if you think about it) in terms of what 'stupid' means on CDC.    :)

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  • -SN- changed the title to [Discussion] A stupid proposal

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