CanadianRugby Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 Anyway, good luck to all 3 guys waived. I think they all did their best when they were here and they wanted to be here. Can't say that about some guys last few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mll Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 15 minutes ago, teepain said: We just hoping he clears tomorrow I actually hope for his sake that he gets claimed. He's gone through enough last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kootenay Gold Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 2 minutes ago, mll said: I actually hope for his sake that he gets claimed. He's gone through enough last season. Has anyone actually been claimed off of waivers yet? I can't think of any since training camp cuts started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mll Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Baggins said: It wasn't those guys that stole Baer's spot..... it was Gaudette, who I honestly believed all summer would be in Utica to start the year. But that was before his preseason performance. No one stole Baertschi's spot - it was decided before camp even started that he was not going to make the team. Benning just talked of how he has been trying to trade him for several weeks. He wasn't at media day at the opening of camp or at the end of last season when all the other vets included the injured ones like Sutter were. When they practiced the PP units he was a placeholder. His PP numbers are far better than Leivo or Pearson's. He started camp with Focht as his C. That was the Vey, Gaunce treatment while others were on lines with NHLers. Edited October 1, 2019 by mll Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mll Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 5 minutes ago, Kootenay Gold said: Has anyone actually been claimed off of waivers yet? I can't think of any since training camp cuts started. None so far this season. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostsOf1994 Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 14 minutes ago, LarsEller said: I think the reality is that no one would claim Schaller and the Canucks need to free a couple mill in cap. He's basically invisible on the ice. The difference in cap savings is small, like baer is 1.075 and schaller is 950k...? What would be worse? Baer gets hurt again and is on LTIR ? or he plays out his contract ? Or we buy him out costing us more cap space long term? Baer @1.833 for 2 years is attractive to other teams, he would be well below league average salary at that point, 3.5 is league average. A potential backup top 6F that is in the AHL to a contender at the deadline should net a decent return. If a trade dows happen at the deadline, baer could stay on the AHL until the NHL playoffs start and be called up because at that point there is no limit on roster size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sbriggs Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Kragar said: And you know this... how? Loui was coming off a 6 yr 4.25M/yr contract, after his best year with the Bruins, a 30-goal scorer that year. I struggle to imagine he was getting many offers close to his old contract, and doubt he would sign one in July. Mats Zuccarello was in a similar position this past year. similar age at the time of signing, making 4.5 per on his last contract, he now has a 5yr, 6m per contract, and his offense was never up to Loui's the year prior to signing. I could ask you the same thing, how do you know? For the most part at the time no one including the TSN or SPN were complaining terribly that the contract was out of reach, many thought it was a fair deal. The only problem with LE contract is he didn't live up to it, not that Benning offered it. Sometimes these players have to be accountable for themselves, he knows he's sucked and I'm sure doesn't blame JB so why would we. I would waive him and let him mentor our boys in Utica or let himwalk away from his contract, No is doing anyone any favors by keeping up with the big club, I'll bet he rides the press box more then he plays and eventually is waived once Green shows management and ownership he's not worth a spot. Edited October 1, 2019 by Sbriggs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilduce39 Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 7 minutes ago, mll said: No one stole Baertschi's spot - it was decided before camp even started that he was not going to make the team. Benning just talked of how he has been trying to trade him for several weeks. He wasn't at media day at the opening of camp or at the end of last season when all the other vets included the injured ones like Sutter were. When they practiced the PP units he was a placeholder. His PP numbers are far better than Leivo or Pearson's. He started camp with Focht as his C. That was the Vey, Gaunce treatment while others were on lines with NHLers. Yeah, you called this one for awhile. I wonder if it’s injury concern, cap related or if they just want a heavier bottom 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VIC_CITY Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Canuckster86 said: 1. EP 2. Bo 3. Brock 4. JT 5. Ferland 6-9. Then imo Sven/Pearson/Leivo/Roussel who are all close. All 4 of these guys can be good 3rd liners or fill in top 6 wingers for injuries 10-13 Journeyman Beagle and Sutter at C, underwhelming #6 pick Jake, youngster Gaud hoping to take a step forward this year Enigma Goldy, has great skills. Cant put it together when it counts hence the waiving Motte- a fringe #13F on a decent team or a call up player from the A to fill a 4th line grinder energy role Then way down you have LE and Schaller I agree with everything you said except that I think Motte is a legit 4th liner. Thinking back at our 4th line players over the last handful of years, we haven't had many good ones. Brad Richardson was good. Personally, I liked Jack Skille. Nic Dowd was hard to play against and underrated. He probably should have been re-signed instead of us going after Beagle (and in hindsight, a very good trade by Benning). Then we have Motte. He's an energizer bunny who has 247 hits in 89 games with us, as well as 11 goals. So I'd put him right up there with our top 4th liners over the last 5 or so years. Edited October 1, 2019 by VIC_CITY 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeefcakeBo Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 5 minutes ago, GhostsOf1994 said: The difference in cap savings is small, like baer is 1.075 and schaller is 950k...? What would be worse? Baer gets hurt again and is on LTIR ? or he plays out his contract ? Or we buy him out costing us more cap space long term? Baer @1.833 for 2 years is attractive to other teams, he would be well below league average salary at that point, 3.5 is league average. A potential backup top 6F that is in the AHL to a contender at the deadline should net a decent return. If a trade dows happen at the deadline, baer could stay on the AHL until the NHL playoffs start and be called up because at that point there is no limit on roster size. Maybe i didnt make that clear. The cao savings will be when he is claimed tomorrow. While there are 0 chances of anyone claiming Schaller for 2m, Baer will be gone freeing up a lot more than just the 1m cap from sending him to the ahl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostsOf1994 Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 I agree with the cap savings, but not that Baertschi was waived solely on his cap hit. It's been a pleasure conversing Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddyguy Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 Dhaliwal is saying that some teams are showing interest in claiming Biega Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theo5789 Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 1 hour ago, Baggins said: It wasn't those guys that stole Baer's spot..... it was Gaudette, who I honestly believed all summer would be in Utica to start the year. But that was before his preseason performance. I feel like many think that if we ice the team that had the most total points, then suddenly we are a better team (too much EA sports?). We need to ice an actual team with players in different roles. Gaudette demonstrated offensive skill and beat out the bubble offensive player that didn't have a role anywhere else on the team. People complain about the defensive guys because they aren't the flashy ones, but they are the ones doing the unnoticed dirty work. This side of the game simply isn't appreciated by many and don't understand the concept that preventing goals is just as beneficial as scoring them. Motte is a high energy guy that led our team in hits and no one questions his work ethic, plus has some untapped offensive potential. Schaller is a big body that defends well (and finishes last year strong putting him at a PPG pace that matched his best offensive season) and can play center if needed. LE is excellent defensively, can play both wings and really be slotted almost on any line and have a role. The versatility of these guys gave them a leg up on a potentially 40 point guy (if healthy and playing regular top 6 minutes) with not much else to provide. The writing was on the wall when we signed Ferland and acquired Miller which took up two top 6 spots and Pearson didn't help him either. These guys along with Gaudette (and Boeser not holding out) "stole" Baertschi's spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theo5789 Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 1 minute ago, buddyguy said: Dhaliwal is saying that some teams are showing interest in claiming Biega He's a great team guy that I would be sad to see go, but wish him the best. We have some up and coming youth that deserve a look and Fantenberg will be the new Biega. Plus potentially Rathbone and Tryamkin as early as the end of this season. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeefcakeBo Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 (edited) 15 minutes ago, GhostsOf1994 said: I agree with the cap savings, but not that Baertschi was waived solely on his cap hit. It's been a pleasure conversing Lars Yeah, obviously not 100% cap, he didnt break into those top 6 roster spots. I think if you have to shed one of your forwards to free up cap though you have to waive the guy you want to keep least that someone else will still take. I think that looking at Pearson, Sutter, Baer, LE, Virtanen, Benning figure's they can live easiest without him, and a team might actually claim him as well to get that cap space. I guess we will know tomorrow, but I'll be pretty suprised if he isn't claimed. Thats where I'd put my money at least. Edited October 1, 2019 by LarsEller 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otis Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 Surprised that Sven was the guy to go. Hope he can find a home and role somewhere. Also, Daniel Sprong is a very interesting name. He was on pace for 25 goals last year with ANA. Didnt know they had the depth to lose him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NHL'er Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 Put all these waiver guys on a team and you get the latest Seattle expansion team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grape Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 2 hours ago, Baggins said: Steve Yzerman was cut from team Canada despite being a 100 point player. Twice. The knock was he was too one dimensional and didn't contribute defensively. There's a few knocks on Baertschi: not physical/agressive enough, doesn't pk, and with the summer additions may not even make the 2nd pp unit. Sometimes cuts are decided by who brings versatility to the table, or fills roles, rather than who puts up more points. Btw, Sutter, Schaller, and Motte all play both center and wing. All three are capable pk'ers as well. Versatility. I like Baer, and his defensive game has improved, but there's question marks there for being an overall better fit. There's 2 counterpoints to this 1. That's what I mean when I say that this type of move is "archaic." Obviously I don't literally mean archaic, but you're not going to find many examples from the modern day of teams doing so. In the past, yes, it's how teams wanted to play, with grinders and tough guys and penalty killer scattered throughout the bottom 2 lines. But it's much more progressive to have your best 12 forwards or close to your best 12 forwards in the lineup nowadays. This is especially true for the 3rd line. Not many third lines have limited skill or offense in the NHL nowadays. The Canucks have chosen to do the opposite, even given the fact that this team has been offensively challenged in the past. Without Baer, our best offensive/skill players outside of our top 6 are: Gaudette? Roussel? Sutter? This is not a recipe for success today in the NHL. What bothers me the most is that JB believes that we have enough skill on the team, which confirms that he doesn't think much skill is needed to play on the 3rd line. 2. Your example specifically mentions Yzerman as being too one dimensional. The players that made the team over him are not checking line guys like Tim Schaller. Instead they were still very deserving of being on the team, as by a quick look at the roster, basically every forward was above PPG or near PPG. In that case, Yzerman was literally deemed to be not as good as the other players due to his defensive deficiencies while the others could put up points and defend. I don't think at all that this is the case with Baertschi vs Schaller. There is no way that Baertschi's defensive deficiencies make him a less valuable player than Schaller. In fact, you already have guys like Miller, Eriksson, Beagle, Ferland, Horvat, Motte, Sutter etc... who can kill penalties, so there's no way Schaller is even close to being as valuable as Baertschi is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mll Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 1 hour ago, LarsEller said: Yeah, obviously not 100% cap, he didnt break into those top 6 roster spots. I think if you have to shed one of your forwards to free up cap though you have to waive the guy you want to keep least that someone else will still take. I think that looking at Pearson, Sutter, Baer, LE, Virtanen, Benning figure's they can live easiest without him, and a team might actually claim him as well to get that cap space. I guess we will know tomorrow, but I'll be pretty suprised if he isn't claimed. Thats where I'd put my money at least. Benning insists that it was not a cap move. It was simply having better players than Baertschi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grape Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 3 minutes ago, mll said: Benning insists that it was not a cap move. It was simply having better players than Baertschi. Man I don't understand... I mean it's not like this move will drop us significantly in the standings or make us definitively worse off... But it's just the ideology that our GM would rather have guys like Schaller and even Eriksson over Baertschi just because they're "better fits." You've gotta keep your best 12-14 forwards in the modern NHL, or close to that. Baertschi is unquestionably one of them. I don't like the fact that we will willingly cut skilled players just because our top 6 is set and they don't "fit" on the 3rd or 4th line because of their play style. With this ideology, you're handicapping yourself to only 2 scoring lines at all times when the elite teams have 3 or 4 lines that can score, because apparently any skilled player on the 3rd line is worthy of getting cut for someone like Schaller or Eriksson. If this is the idea going forward I don't think our offensive struggles will improve unless our elite guys start seriously dominating 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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