stawns Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 2 minutes ago, 48MPHSlapShot said: The thing is that, even if a system is sound, but the current group of players are unable to execute, it's up to the coach to then implement a system that the players are capable of executing. Otherwise you're just trying to force a square peg into a round hole while the losses pile up. If there's a problem in the dressing room that's affecting the team as a whole, the coach has to be able to identify the issue and communicate to the GM that there's a bad egg in the bunch that needs to be removed. It depends.......if they're committed to a style of play, it might just be a matter of roster change. I do think TGs time is running out, but not because of his systems Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainhorvat Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 Can’t we just fire Green and put a magic bullet behind the bench? It will cost aquaman only $49.99 instead of paying millions for a coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbbyNux Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 29 minutes ago, stawns said: I mean from the playoff bubble team. It's not how many, but who you replace. I feel like there's a player (maybe two) on that roster who needs to go and that will make a huge difference in the makeup of the team. It's up to JB to figure out who that is. The team was bad prior. You can't keep blaming the players. Every team has one or two guys like that. Edmonton has Kassian. Carolina signed D'Angelo and he was supposed to be the worst. The players should be able to play through the problem players (if there are any). We thought it was Schmidt. The compass is constantly pointing at management as the problem. Players gotta play through it, but you can see the message is falling on deaf ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbbyNux Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 3 minutes ago, stawns said: It depends.......if they're committed to a style of play, it might just be a matter of roster change. I do think TGs time is running out, but not because of his systems The roster has been changed, a lot. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawnAntoski Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 8 minutes ago, Canuckfanforlife82 said: There is nothing in this current state of the franchise that suggest this is going to be a playoff club this year. You can’t figure things out during the season. Face offs, pk, scoring, chemistry. Those are too many things all at once to try to figure out. They don’t have time. They can’t start the way they have and expect to just flip a switch and it will be good abough to make the playoffs. There has been nothing in this clubs history to have faith they will. It’s more likely based on this teams history they won’t make the playoffs that’s the reality. This team needs a makeover at the top. A new vision. A small, weak team just is not what I think this fanbase wants. I dont know why Benning thought we did. I agree: that the regular season is were the team should be fine tuning itself for the playoffs and not figuring things out - the on ice product is stale and predicable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darius Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 5 minutes ago, ShawnAntoski said: Good context and if you remove the expansion teams - only the Canucks have not chosen in the top3. this is a fair point, and has caused me to think about it several times in the past. But I look at it this way, other than the year Willie got the last gasp out of the sedins, Benning has had the luxury of picking top 10 every year up to the year he decided the core was set and he could trade first rounders to bolster the team. 2014- 6th 2015- 23rd 2016-5th 2017-5th 2018-7th 2019-10th 2020 - traded 2021- traded Thats a lot of high draft picks, some of which would be top 3 in a re-draft. At what point can we expect to have a decent team? Forget being a contender, im talking about being a middle of the pack team that can win on any given night. I think my position is, from this point forward, if they miss the playoffs again the owner needs to clean house starting with management. In what world does Benning deserve a decade to turn a franchise around...this is year 8. 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawnAntoski Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 10 minutes ago, 48MPHSlapShot said: The thing is that, even if a system is sound, but the current group of players are unable to execute, it's up to the coach to then implement a system that the players are capable of executing. Otherwise you're just trying to force a square peg into a round hole while the losses pile up. If there's a problem in the dressing room that's affecting the team as a whole, the coach has to be able to identify the issue and communicate to the GM that there's a bad egg in the bunch that needs to be removed. Was a Schmidt a bad egg or did he just realize that he is not a fit in Vancouver after his experience with Vegas ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainhorvat Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 Someone confirm is Jason King the powerplay coach? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rekker Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 1 minute ago, captainhorvat said: Someone confirm is Jason King the powerplay coach? No coach is willing to own up to it yet. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Vintage Canuck- Posted October 31, 2021 Author Share Posted October 31, 2021 2 minutes ago, captainhorvat said: Someone confirm is Jason King the powerplay coach? Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawnAntoski Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Darius said: this is a fair point, and has caused me to think about it several times in the past. But I look at it this way, other than the year Willie got the last gasp out of the sedins, Benning has had the luxury of picking top 10 every year up to the year he decided the core was set and he could trade first rounders to bolster the team. 2014- 6th 2015- 23rd 2016-5th 2017-5th 2018-7th 2019-10th 2020 - traded 2021- traded Thats a lot of high draft picks, some of which would be top 3 in a re-draft. At what point can we expect to have a decent team? Forget being a contender, im talking about being a middle of the pack team that can win on any given night. I think my position is, from this point forward, if they miss the playoffs again the owner needs to clean house starting with management. In what world does Benning deserve a decade to turn a franchise around...this is year 8. Imo, a more prudent or cheaper approach (at the moment) would be to see how this roster will do with a different staff. Half way through last years shorten season would had been a good time to try that experiment with last year's crew - but JB (imo) didn’t want to let Green go without evaluating him with a much deeper roster and so far, the on ice product doesn't lie. I remember reading during the Kings cup runs, how Blake with the Kings would transition from one core to another: they have prospects in the AHL learning to win together so that when they get called up they already have chemistry with each other. Edited October 31, 2021 by ShawnAntoski 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishopshodan Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 11 minutes ago, captainhorvat said: Can’t we just fire Green and put a magic bullet behind the bench? It will cost aquaman only $49.99 instead of paying millions for a coach. I don't know . I get your idea but I use a magic bullet every morning for my protein shakes. It's really aggressive in it's blending. I feel the blades move too fast right off the hop, so my frozen berries sorta float in the middle and don't blend as well as I would like. We don't need any floaters on this team so I'm not sure about Coach Magic B even though it is probably time to move on from Green. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darius Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 1 minute ago, ShawnAntoski said: Imo, a more prudent or cheaper approach (at the moment) would be to see how this roster will do with a different staff. Half way through last years shorten season would had been a good time to try that experiment with last year's crew - but JB (imo) didn’t want to let Green go without evaluating him with a much deeper roster and so far, the on ice product doesn't lie. yup i agree. should have made it clearer in my point above. I would remove Green first and see how a new staff would do .... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 12 minutes ago, Warhawk said: Good post and fair enough DLC. I apologize for some of the rudeness in my post, I was a bit emotional last night not just because of the losses piling up but because of other life circumstances as well. Losing Toffoli, Markstrom and Tanev was huge, but Tanev especially for years was a trade chip we had to improve the future of the team but we kept him in hopes of playoff success that never really came and then he walked away for nothing. Sure we didn't have many studs to exchange for picks but we also weren't really in position to always be throwing picks into deals that was never going to put us over the top like in the said Toffoli deal. Deals like Gagner for 3 years at an overpaid price were just dumb, he did nothing for us and we got nothing for him, Benning needed to find better value to flip at a later date. Hamhuis walked, Richardson walked, Tanev and Markstrom walked, Mathias walked and then signed as a free agent and was flipped the following year etc At the end of the day, 7-8 years with Benning during a retooling phase you would think our team would have accumulated at least a few more draft picks than we gave away but I think right now it's dead even at the average number of picks we are given at 7 per year (8x7) Just using comparables from any team basically in history who goes into a phase like this, they accumulate young assets as much as possible by jettisoning older expiring contracts, signing one or two year free agents to then flip which we sometimes did but not nearly enough, weaponizing open cap space etc. Any team retooling will have more than average amount of picks during the phase but why not us? We rushed prospects out the door trying to improve the club and the facts speak for themselves we lost a lot of these deals. Even small insignificant trades add up, using hindsight we often were on the side that threw in something extra for no good reason. Yes hindsight is easy I don't want to go through them all but 3rd for Pedan, Forsling for Clendenning, 2nds for Vey and Baertschi, Bonino 2nd for Sutter 3rd, McCann 2nd 4th for Gudbranson 5th, 3rd 4th for Pouliot, Madden, 2nd, 4th for Toffoli and a Virtanen resigning Lind + Gadjovich (two 2nds) gone for nothing MacEwan gone for nothing 1st + for Miller looks good on paper but were we ready? and Miller's attitude stinks imo These are all losses. That's a lot Smaller deals too. Seeing Kassian last night irked me. He had issues but so did an overpaid Prust and we still threw in a 5th in that deal. Jensen was as good as Etem but we through in a 6th 5th for Larsen why were we tight against the cap every year, often having just 6 or 7 picks in a draft apparently remaining competitive but have tied for the 3rd worst winning percentage in the last 6-7 seasons? Why didn't we weaponize a single dollar during this time? Why was Benning trying to trade for P.K Subban? Why did we luck out in 2018 for Quinny Bear and where would we be if that had not happened? It's not looking good right now in year 8 and the cupboards are very bare. The fanbase couldn't say goodbye to Torts fast enough. Some good reasons for that but is parting comment was that the Canucks had to rebuild. Not well received. I started calling for a tear down and rebuild in the summer of 2012. Bottom line I don't think the fanbase could handle a total rebuild. Ownership and management has pandered to press and fans by failing to do a full rebuild. The group we have today is probably the biggest effort to revamp the team that I have ever witnessed. My biggest critic of JB has been his roll over of vets for future assets. It has been pretty bad. Add Edler to your list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilduce39 Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 For all the talk the biggest issues are Petey and Brock not playing anywhere near to their potential. Those two guys have been our best forwards in previous seasons and are nowhere near their potentials right now. Petey missing half a year and skipping training camp it makes sense he’s rusty. Brock was fighting an injury and missed a few games to start the year. The team is playing a lot better defensively compared to last season… but we need some guys scoring, starting with the top of the lineup. Conversation around the team is drastically different with those two back around PPG where they usually are. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainhorvat Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 6 minutes ago, -Vintage Canuck- said: Yes. Wtf man! How is he an upgrade over Newell Brown? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfgang Durst Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 11 minutes ago, Darius said: this is a fair point, and has caused me to think about it several times in the past. But I look at it this way, other than the year Willie got the last gasp out of the sedins, Benning has had the luxury of picking top 10 every year up to the year he decided the core was set and he could trade first rounders to bolster the team. 2014- 6th 2015- 23rd 2016-5th 2017-5th 2018-7th 2019-10th 2020 - traded 2021- traded Thats a lot of high draft picks, some of which would be top 3 in a re-draft. At what point can we expect to have a decent team? Forget being a contender, im talking about being a middle of the pack team that can win on any given night. I think my position is, from this point forward, if they miss the playoffs again the owner needs to clean house starting with management. In what world does Benning deserve a decade to turn a franchise around...this is year 8. thanks darius. Enough high first round picks to build a legit contender. That's only the high first round picks. GM's of other franchises hit gold even with their 2nd or 3rd round picks. Stevie Yzerman build this Lightning team through the draft (Hedman, Point only to name to players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NHL97OneTimer Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 32 minutes ago, ShawnAntoski said: Yeah, the offseason job JB did created a much deeper roster and all your points I agree with: too much individual play to create offense and no real plan when attacking; atleast, on a positive note the D & goaltending are performing. We've been spoiled over the years of seeing set plays from the Sedins. A decade from the peak later, it's even more obvious how lucky we were to be entertained by them. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RakuRaku Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 2 hours ago, Alflives said: The loses aren’t going to change to wins until Petey gets going. We are pretty much playing evens with teams without Petey doing much. Once he starts to score, then we will win. He will start going soon. Next game. True... But eventually if things don't go well... Gotta shake things up!! Di Giuseppe has proven to be a real effective 2-way player who can offer more than Chiasson.... Klim whenever he's ready can fire up Podz!! Worth a try!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfgang Durst Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 4 minutes ago, Darius said: yup i agree. should have made it clearer in my point above. I would remove Green first and see how a new staff would do .... would you trust Jim Benning to hire the "right headcoach" for this team? I mean Willie Desjardins was a clear miss - even for fans it was clear that he isn't an NHL coach. Travis Green with no NHL experience named as headcoach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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