[Rumour] J.T. Miller Trade/Contract Talks

[Attila Umbrus]

4 minutes ago, aGENT said:

We're not rebuilding. The core is in place.

 

There's no reason, that with the right return and subsequent moves this summer, that we couldn't still be a bubble playoff team the next couple years, on route to building that contender. All while massively upgrading our cap allocation and future ability to compete during the core's window.

 

Do we want to be a better team now, with Miller, before their prime, or a better team during their prime?

 

I know which one I prefer, and it sounds like management agrees with me.

 

 

Like I said before, I agree with your points. It all makes sense to me. But I worry about the players. You lose them and their belief in this team then it’s all for nothing and we can welcome back another 3 plus years of losing and trades and players wanting out.

 

Your vision can go both ways. 

[coryberg]

2 hours ago, Furevanucks said:

My guess is Schenn does not get traded Bruce loves him

 

 

That and his trade value doesn't value his worth to the team. He is cost controlled for another year at 850k, brings much needed physicality,toughness, leadership and PK ability. Most projections put his value at a 4th or 5th round pick. I'd rather keep him for another season at that price. Im sure he could fetch that next year at the deadline.

 

On a side note it's crazy to see the impact that playing with Hughes has had on his offensive numbers this season. His 9 points and plus 8 in 29 games would extrapolate to 25 points and a plus 23 over 82 games. His best season of his career was 11 years ago when he had 22 points and a minus 7 in 82 games.

[aGENT]

21 minutes ago, Attila Umbrus said:

Like I said before, I agree with your points. It all makes sense to me. But I worry about the players. You lose them and their belief in this team then it’s all for nothing and we can welcome back another 3 plus years of losing and trades and players wanting out.

 

Your vision can go both ways. 

Yup, as could stagnating. No guarantees.

[Attila Umbrus]

10 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Yup, as could stagnating. No guarantees.

Safe is death for sure. It’s going to be tricky balance all of it. The one thing i’m happy about is that we have a guy like JR managing the transition. I had lost my faith in Benning over the last few seasons and it’s certainly nice to have a guy at the helm like JR. He’s the right guy for the job I think. 

Edited February 1, 2022 by Attila Umbrus

[aGENT]

10 minutes ago, coryberg said:

That and his trade value doesn't value his worth to the team. He is cost controlled for another year at 850k, brings much needed physicality,toughness, leadership and PK ability. Most projections put his value at a 4th or 5th round pick. I'd rather keep him for another season at that price. Im sure he could fetch that next year at the deadline.

 

On a side note it's crazy to see the impact that playing with Hughes has had on his offensive numbers this season. His 9 points and plus 8 in 29 games would extrapolate to 25 points and a plus 23 over 82 games. His best season of his career was 11 years ago when he had 22 points and a minus 7 in 82 games.

Only way I can see it is if adding Schenn is the difference between us getting Schneider or not. In that case, bye Luke.

 

But otherwise, yes, he's a solid, low cost depth D who happens to play well with Hughes and has limited trade value in his own.

[aGENT]

35 minutes ago, HKSR said:

I think that's the challenge.  An honest assessment of this team might be that they are much better than what they've done this year.  Primarily starting the year playing .300 hockey set this team WAY back. 

They're certainly better than their poor start! Right @WHL rocks?

 

35 minutes ago, HKSR said:

An honest assessment might include, "what if Petey and Boeser get going?" and "that there was no covid week".  That would completely transform this team.  Not only would we have been playing .700 hockey, we might have played .800 hockey and be challenging for top 3 in the entire NHL. 

I don't think any realistic assessment has us in the wheelhouse of the Canes, Avs, Panthers, Lightning etc. The truth likely lies somewhere in the middle.

 

And yes, Petey/Boeser returning to form is part of the reason I feel comfortable selling high on Miller. If one player makes that big of a difference, we're an even worse team than either of us is willing to admit

 

35 minutes ago, HKSR said:

We can't just look 2 or 3 or 4 years out and think that we need to dump players if we actually have a good thing going right now. 

We don't really though. Better coaching and has certainly turned things around but that doesn't cloud the real and obvious structural issues on this team. Management has come out and already told us what they think. We have holes. We need to get younger, we need to build a cap cushion, we need to get faster. And that doesn't even bring up our succession plan issues, particularly on D.

 

35 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Again, this is all for JR and Allvin to decide, but man oh man, this is a critical decision for sure. 

That it is. I think it's largely already been made, but what they do, the return they get etc are certainly critical. This could set the team up for a decade or...

[Nucker 67]

Heard Craig Button earlier today, saying if the Canucks trade Miller, they better get a #3 Dman in return. He doesn't feel a package of all picks and prospects is wise, as you never know if those players will have NHL careers. Miller is a proven, top NHL player with a good contract in his prime.

 

Here's a list of some (possibly) #3 Dmen:

 

BOS - (R) Carlo

CAR - (L) Slavin or (R) Pesche

COL - (R) Girard

FLA - (L) Gudas or (R) Montour (or is he more of a 4/5?)

NYR - (L) Lindgren or (R) Schneider

PIT - (R) Marino

STL - (R) Parayko

WAS - (L) Orlov

 

This could be more of a straight up player trade though,  maybe a mid-round pick or two added by the other team, but the Canucks would get something they really need. 

 

Not sure I like this idea, as it's always nice to have the extra high pick and a prospect to look forward to. BUT, Demko would have better D in front of him. They could be a tougher team to beat with better D.

 

 

 

Edited February 1, 2022 by NUCKER67

[LegionOfDoom]

9 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

Heard Craig Button earlier today, saying if the Canucks trade Miller, they better get a #3 Dman in return. He doesn't feel a package of all picks and prospects is wise, as you never know if those players will have NHL careers. Miller is a proven, top NHL player with a good contract in his prime.

 

Here's a list of some (possibly) #3 Dmen:

 

BOS - (R) Carlo

CAR - (L) Slavin or (R) Pesche

COL - (R) Girard

FLA - (L) Gudas or (R) Montour (or is he more of a 4/5?)

NYR - (L) Lindgren or (R) Schneider

PIT - (R) Marino

STL - (R) Parayko

WAS - (L) Orlov

 

This could be more of a straight up player trade though,  maybe a mid-round pick or two added by the other team, but the Canucks would get something they really need. 

 

Not sure I like this idea, as it's always nice to have the extra high pick and a prospect to look forward to. BUT, Demko would have better D in front of him. They could be a tougher team to beat with better D.

 

 

 

Is carolina willing to part with Slavin? Or is that just spitballing ? That guy is a workhorse very big on his game 

[Nucker 67]

Just now, LegionOfDoom said:

Is carolina willing to part with Slavin? Or is that just spitballing ? That guy is a workhorse very big on his game 

Just spitballing, threw some names out there, guys who could be #3 Dmen.,

 

but what Button said sort of made sense. The Canucks only have two Top 4 Dmen (OEL and Hughes). They desperately need proven (better) D to help them defend and produce. Drafting a Dman or a D prospect could take several years before they make a difference or they even make the team. Canucks need help now, their core is young and ready to take that next step.

[aGENT]

14 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

Heard Craig Button earlier today, saying if the Canucks trade Miller, they better get a #3 Dman in return. He doesn't feel a package of all picks and prospects is wise, as you never know if those players will have NHL careers. Miller is a proven, top NHL player with a good contract in his prime.

 

Here's a list of some (possibly) #3 Dmen:

 

BOS - (R) Carlo

CAR - (L) Slavin or (R) Pesche

COL - (R) Girard

FLA - (L) Gudas or (R) Montour (or is he more of a 4/5?)

NYR - (L) Lindgren or (R) Schneider

PIT - (R) Marino

STL - (R) Parayko

WAS - (L) Orlov

 

This could be more of a straight up player trade though,  maybe a mid-round pick or two added by the other team, but the Canucks would get something they really need. 

 

Not sure I like this idea, as it's always nice to have the extra high pick and a prospect to look forward to. BUT, Demko would have better D in front of him. They could be a tougher team to beat with better D.

 

 

 

This was always primarily going to be for younger players/near ready prospects IMO. A pick may be part of any package, but it will be far from the main piece.

 

Most of those D you listed aren't going anywhere IMO (Slavin, Pesce, Parayko, Orlov etc). Nor do they necessarily fit the age/cap range we should be looking at IMO.

 

Also you're forgetting Lundqvist and Robertson from the Rangers and Barron from the AVS.

 

1 minute ago, NUCKER67 said:

Just spitballing, threw some names out there, guys who could be #3 Dmen.,

 

but what Button said sort of made sense. The Canucks only have two Top 4 Dmen (OEL and Hughes). They desperately need proven (better) D to help them defend and produce. Drafting a Dman or a D prospect could take several years before they make a difference or they even make the team. Canucks need help now, their core is young and ready to take that next step.

Giraffe says hi. Granted he's not a long term asset there (one of our biggest issues!) as his deal is done in 2 years and will be mid 30's.

[86Viking]

I wouldnt move JT in a deal for Carlo but I would move Garland for Carlo in a deal possibly. Schenn has done a solid job with Hughes though and at his cap hit its a bonus, need to get a solid deal in return for whoever we trade. ELC RHD would be ideal like Schneider or Barron

[Maddogy]

I am curious but ignorant about the situation with the Islanders. Are they giving up on this season? They have a 1st round pick which may become a good pick if they miss the playoffs. They have at least 3 bad contracts with their forwards. If they wish to push for the playoffs they need to make a trade now to add more offence. 

[Provost]

1 hour ago, NUCKER67 said:

Heard Craig Button earlier today, saying if the Canucks trade Miller, they better get a #3 Dman in return. He doesn't feel a package of all picks and prospects is wise, as you never know if those players will have NHL careers. Miller is a proven, top NHL player with a good contract in his prime.

 

Here's a list of some (possibly) #3 Dmen:

 

BOS - (R) Carlo

CAR - (L) Slavin or (R) Pesche

COL - (R) Girard

FLA - (L) Gudas or (R) Montour (or is he more of a 4/5?)

NYR - (L) Lindgren or (R) Schneider

PIT - (R) Marino

STL - (R) Parayko

WAS - (L) Orlov

 

This could be more of a straight up player trade though,  maybe a mid-round pick or two added by the other team, but the Canucks would get something they really need. 

 

Not sure I like this idea, as it's always nice to have the extra high pick and a prospect to look forward to. BUT, Demko would have better D in front of him. They could be a tougher team to beat with better D.

 

 

 

Yep Carlo has been a name I have been throwing around as an ideal part of a return.  While some moves may just be picks and prospects just to clear cap space, Rutherford has talked about trying to be a consistent playoff team in a couple years.  That means getting NHL ready players back as well, not picks who likely won’t be a significant part of your lineup for 4 years which is the case for most players drafted out of the top 5-10.

 

I think you can do Miller plus an asset like Rathbone for a package including Carlo, Debrusk, and Senyshyn…. The latter two guys having asked for trades from Boston.

 

Boeser could be a deal where futures are primarily the return so that we gain cap space.

Edited February 1, 2022 by Provost

[86Viking]

9 minutes ago, Maddogy said:

I am curious but ignorant about the situation with the Islanders. Are they giving up on this season? They have a 1st round pick which may become a good pick if they miss the playoffs. They have at least 3 bad contracts with their forwards. If they wish to push for the playoffs they need to make a trade now to add more offence. 

a 1 for 1 deal involving Barzal and Pettersson? Petey 2 years left after this season compared to Barzal who has 1 year remaining

[aGENT]

19 minutes ago, Provost said:

Yep Carlo has been a name I have been throwing around as an ideal part of a return.  While some moves may just be picks and prospects just to clear cap space, Rutherford has talked about trying to be a consistent playoff team in a couple years.  That means getting NHL ready players back as well, not picks who likely won’t be a significant part of your lineup for 4 years which is the case for most players drafted out of the top 5-10.

 

I think you can do Miller plus an asset like Rathbone for a package including Carlo, Debrusk, and Senyshyn…. The latter two guys having asked for trades from Boston.

 

Boeser could be a deal where futures are primarily the return so that we gain cap space.

Debrusk is basically a borderline cap dump at this point. Senyshyn a throw in long shot. I'm certainly not adding Rathbone in to get that.

 

Now Garland + Poolman for Carlo + Debrusk (and Senyshyn I guess... Abby depth at worst) is basically cap neutral, replaces (albeit downgrades) their RD depth and improves their F's while getting us younger, the RHD we need etc.

[HKSR]

https://www.nhltraderumors.me/2022/02/nhl-rumors-canucks-forward-prefers-to.html

 

Yup, ok, might be time to move him.... so Boston, NYR, and Minnesota.  Have at er ladies and gentlemen!

[N4ZZY]

1 hour ago, NUCKER67 said:

Heard Craig Button earlier today, saying if the Canucks trade Miller, they better get a #3 Dman in return. He doesn't feel a package of all picks and prospects is wise, as you never know if those players will have NHL careers. Miller is a proven, top NHL player with a good contract in his prime.

 

Here's a list of some (possibly) #3 Dmen:

 

BOS - (R) Carlo

CAR - (L) Slavin or (R) Pesche

COL - (R) Girard

FLA - (L) Gudas or (R) Montour (or is he more of a 4/5?)

NYR - (L) Lindgren or (R) Schneider

PIT - (R) Marino

STL - (R) Parayko

WAS - (L) Orlov

 

This could be more of a straight up player trade though,  maybe a mid-round pick or two added by the other team, but the Canucks would get something they really need. 

 

Not sure I like this idea, as it's always nice to have the extra high pick and a prospect to look forward to. BUT, Demko would have better D in front of him. They could be a tougher team to beat with better D.

 

 

 

No to any of the LHD’s. 

 

I’d only be interested in young RHD for Miller. 

 

[Kubrick]

Remember when people were freaking out about trading our first round pick for JT.

 

looking like a solid investment now considering the return value.

[stawns]

53 minutes ago, Kubrick said:

Remember when people were freaking out about trading our first round pick for JT.

 

looking like a solid investment now considering the return value.

I think Jr's plan, at this stage, looks a lot like JBs would have.  JB did a much better job of amassing assets with value than people give him credit for and I think he would have used those assets to shape the team as they move into the next phase.

[aGENT]

5 minutes ago, stawns said:

I think Jr's plan, at this stage, looks a lot like JBs would have.  JB did a much better job of amassing assets with value than people give him credit for and I think he would have used those assets to shape the team as they move into the next phase.

He certainly deserve more credit than he's being given for drafting the core and assembling/acquiring the assets we're all debating about selling.

 

And I agree, I think that may have largely been the intended direction but this fall gave me some concerns. He seemed paralyzed by our bad start and did almost nothing to correct it, and too late.

 

And as good of a job as he did assembling all that, I'm not at all upset about the team bringing in Rutherford and co. Our front office has never looked this formidable and I also like the added emphasis they're putting on things outside immediate hockey ops (infrastructure, practice facilities etc) that weren't previous management's strengths (and had been neglected). Benning got us this far, I'm excited to see what the new guys do to push it over the top the next few years.