[Rumour] J.T. Miller Trade/Contract Talks

[Petey Castiglione]

10 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Problem being, you "can't go for it" without those assets to spend, on guys to push you over.

 

We're nowhere near a team like Colorado and with little in the way of pieces to get us even close to that level. We get some of those pieces by moving Miller and growing organizational depth over the next couple years 

Oh I think we're near Colorado.  When they were "bottoming out" for Makar and trading Duchene.  They had Mac & Landy as their new core to build around.  We have Petey, Hughes, Demko & Horvat.

 

Trading Miller will help us get those extra pieces that could push us over the top.

[Elias Pettersson]

6 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Isn’t McLeod one of the “group of 8” that assaulted that girl in London?  Stay off those guys. 

I've never heard of that before.  Do you have any links to the story?  

[204CanucksFan]

5 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Yeah I don't get the whole Aquilini can't tell JR what to do or else he never would have accepted this job narrative.  From all accounts that is exactly what happened at last year's deadline when Miller was taken off the market and JR came out and said we are going to give our boys a chance to make the playoffs.  Obviously that decision came from the owner because the best thing for the team was to trade Miller at that time as teams were calling.  Same thing will happen this year and this year we WILL make the playoffs with the current team we have.  

Here is a quote from an article on Sportsnet from shortly after JR was hired. It answers your question far better than I can:

 

"He resigned as the Pittsburgh Penguins’ general manager in January, four years after orchestrating consecutive Stanley Cup victories, for what was characterized then as “personal reasons.” But those reasons partly had to do with autonomy and what Rutherford felt was the growing encroachment by those above him into hockey operations.

 

He needed autonomy more than he needed the money, so Rutherford abruptly walked away.

 

Whatever the Aquilini family is paying him now, Rutherford wouldn’t be coming to Canucks without the owners’ promise of autonomy and full authority on hockey matters.

 

It doesn’t mean that Rutherford won’t be in frequent contact with Francesco Aquilini -- part of what gave Rutherford an advantage in Pittsburgh over his predecessor, Ray Shero, was his ability to manage up -- but the new president won’t need permission to make a trade."

 

Here's a link to the article: https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/now-rutherfords-team-new-canucks-prez-full-control/

 

Just a couple notes, that second word is "resigned" as in he quit, not re-signed. He has already left one job because the owner didn't give him autonomy why would he change that stance now. He's not here for the money, I mean that helps, but he certainly doesn't need it so he chose this job because the Aqua promised him autonomy.

[aGENT]

7 minutes ago, Petey Castiglione said:

Oh I think we're near Colorado.  When they were "bottoming out" for Makar and trading Duchene.  They had Mac & Landy as their new core to build around.  We have Petey, Hughes, Demko & Horvat.

 

Trading Miller will help us get those extra pieces that could push us over the top.

We're not presently close to the Colorado team that won the Cup last year. But yes, moving Miller might help get us pieces that get us closer to that goal in a few years.

[Pure961089]

https://canucksarmy.com/2022/08/07/12-waiver-eligible-players-league-canucks-keep-eye-on-october/

 

This player could fit right in our top 4 D.  If LA can't fit him in their defence the Canucks would be happy to ablige.  I wonder what the Kings would ask for in return?

[Alflives]

12 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

I think at some point management shifted their plans based on wanting to re-sign Miller. 
 

They realized the offers weren’t coming close to what they needed to make it worth trading him and pulled him off the market out of respect to him. JR has spoken about trade rumours being hard on players and their families. And if they decided they wanted to try and re-sign him there was no need to damage that relationship.

So we then offer Miller six years x 7.5 and that is “realistically” trying to re-sign him?  I think JR wanted to make trades, including Miller, from day one getting here.  But as the team did better and better under Boudreau the changes JR wanted to make had to be delayed until after the season.  And then there was less of a market, and we see us stuck - like we are right now - looking like Miller will play this year and leave July 2023.  

[Alflives]

14 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Yeah I don't get the whole Aquilini can't tell JR what to do or else he never would have accepted this job narrative.  From all accounts that is exactly what happened at last year's deadline when Miller was taken off the market and JR came out and said we are going to give our boys a chance to make the playoffs.  Obviously that decision came from the owner because the best thing for the team was to trade Miller at that time as teams were calling.  Same thing will happen this year and this year we WILL make the playoffs with the current team we have.  

And that’s not the ideal result of the Miller situation, but it’s not too terrible either.  JTM plays with us.  We make the playoffs.  Heck, with Demko we could do well in the playoffs too!  Then Miller leaves July 1, 2023.  We still get his cap space.  Not all bad.

[Alflives]

15 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

I've never heard of that before.  Do you have any links to the story?  

It’s been posted earlier in this thread.  

[Elias Pettersson]

6 minutes ago, Pure961089 said:

https://canucksarmy.com/2022/08/07/12-waiver-eligible-players-league-canucks-keep-eye-on-october/

 

This player could fit right in our top 4 D.  If LA can't fit him in their defence the Canucks would be happy to ablige.  I wonder what the Kings would ask for in return?

It says LA may put Durzi on waivers.  So why would we give up Miller for him?  We can offer them Höglander straight up...

[Petey Castiglione]

3 minutes ago, Pure961089 said:

https://canucksarmy.com/2022/08/07/12-waiver-eligible-players-league-canucks-keep-eye-on-october/

 

This player could fit right in our top 4 D.  If LA can't fit him in their defence the Canucks would be happy to ablige.  I wonder what the Kings would ask for in return?

Great read and gives us insight into what management is potentially thinking of doing to shore up the defence.

 

I like the sounds of Leon Gawanke.  Strong skater with a booming shot.  Good size at 6'2" 198lbs.  Put up 10 goals last season in the A.

[Alflives]

8 minutes ago, Pure961089 said:

https://canucksarmy.com/2022/08/07/12-waiver-eligible-players-league-canucks-keep-eye-on-october/

 

This player could fit right in our top 4 D.  If LA can't fit him in their defence the Canucks would be happy to ablige.  I wonder what the Kings would ask for in return?

There is no chance Durzi is put on waivers.  

[204CanucksFan]

8 minutes ago, aGENT said:

We're not presently close to the Colorado team that won the Cup last year. But yes, moving Miller might help get us pieces that get us closer to that goal in a few years.

That's not even close to what he said. He compared us to the Colorado team that finished last in the league when they already had Mac, Land and Rant and drafted Makar due to the bad season then traded Duchene at the start of the next season and used that to add Byram and Girard which are the parts that now put them over the top.

[Pure961089]

Just now, Alflives said:

So we then offer Miller six years x 7.5 and that is “realistically” trying to re-sign him?  I think JR wanted to make trades, including Miller, from day one getting here.  But as the team did better and better under Boudreau the changes JR wanted to make had to be delayed until after the season.  And then there was less of a market, and we see us stuck - like we are right now - looking like Miller will play this year and leave July 2023.  

This looked resonable at one point.  Then Calgary signed Huberdeau to that obscene contract.  Miller is going to want something similar.  Just like Miller, Huberdeau had showed no signs of being a 115 point player until last year.  Both 29, both had career years.  The Canucks can't afford another OEL or LE contract.  At some point the Canucks need to learn from their mistakes and not have our current management make the same mistakes Benning made.

[Elias Pettersson]

9 minutes ago, 204CanucksFan said:

Here is a quote from an article on Sportsnet from shortly after JR was hired. It answers your question far better than I can:

 

"He resigned as the Pittsburgh Penguins’ general manager in January, four years after orchestrating consecutive Stanley Cup victories, for what was characterized then as “personal reasons.” But those reasons partly had to do with autonomy and what Rutherford felt was the growing encroachment by those above him into hockey operations.

 

He needed autonomy more than he needed the money, so Rutherford abruptly walked away.

 

Whatever the Aquilini family is paying him now, Rutherford wouldn’t be coming to Canucks without the owners’ promise of autonomy and full authority on hockey matters.

 

It doesn’t mean that Rutherford won’t be in frequent contact with Francesco Aquilini -- part of what gave Rutherford an advantage in Pittsburgh over his predecessor, Ray Shero, was his ability to manage up -- but the new president won’t need permission to make a trade."

 

Here's a link to the article: https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/now-rutherfords-team-new-canucks-prez-full-control/

 

Just a couple notes, that second word is "resigned" as in he quit, not re-signed. He has already left one job because the owner didn't give him autonomy why would he change that stance now. He's not here for the money, I mean that helps, but he certainly doesn't need it so he chose this job because the Aqua promised him autonomy.

I think the deal is JR can do what he wants to improve this team.  Aquilini isn't going to encroach on his day to day decisions which looks like what started to happen in Pittsburgh.  So he does have full autonomy here.

 

However, when it directly interferes with money going into Aquilini's pockets that is a red line that cannot be crossed.  Doesn't mean JR can't make other important decisions and be left alone for the most part, which seems to be happening.  But trading your best player at the deadline when you are in a playoff spot is probably the one and only decision JR cannot make on his own...

[aGENT]

1 minute ago, 204CanucksFan said:

That's not even close to what he said. He compared us to the Colorado team that finished last in the league when they already had Mac, Land and Rant and drafted Makar due to the bad season then traded Duchene at the start of the next season and used that to add Byram and Girard which are the parts that now put them over the top.

I'm aware. We were agreeing that we'd like to emulate something along the lines of the same game plan the next couple years.

[Pure961089]

4 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

It says LA may put Durzi on waivers.  So why would we give up Miller for him?  We can offer them Höglander straight up...

Yeah, thats what I'm getting at. Management is playing it cool, might not have to sell the farm to improve your RHD afterall.  This is what Allvin was talking about finding difference makers.  

[steviewonder20]

18 minutes ago, Pure961089 said:

https://canucksarmy.com/2022/08/07/12-waiver-eligible-players-league-canucks-keep-eye-on-october/

 

This player could fit right in our top 4 D.  If LA can't fit him in their defence the Canucks would be happy to ablige.  I wonder what the Kings would ask for in return?

They had me at “the Kings have 5 NHL-quality RHD…and several more in the system”.

[tas]

18 minutes ago, Pure961089 said:

This looked resonable at one point.  Then Calgary signed Huberdeau to that obscene contract.  Miller is going to want something similar.  Just like Miller, Huberdeau had showed no signs of being a 115 point player until last year.  Both 29, both had career years.  The Canucks can't afford another OEL or LE contract.  At some point the Canucks need to learn from their mistakes and not have our current management make the same mistakes Benning made.

you really can't compare huberdeau and miller. huberdeau was well over a point per game for 4 straight years (1.21 average, 99 per 82 gp), miller wasn't. over those same 4 years miller had 0.95 points per game, 78 per 82. 

[DeNiro]

33 minutes ago, Alflives said:

So we then offer Miller six years x 7.5 and that is “realistically” trying to re-sign him?  I think JR wanted to make trades, including Miller, from day one getting here.  But as the team did better and better under Boudreau the changes JR wanted to make had to be delayed until after the season.  And then there was less of a market, and we see us stuck - like we are right now - looking like Miller will play this year and leave July 2023.  

Where did you read we offered him that?

 

If that was actually an offer that was their starting point, it doesn’t mean a whole lot. It’s part of every negotiation.

 

My guess is that term is the sticking point. Millers agent is probably willing to offer a certain AAV but wants 7 or 8 years to get it. Management on the other hand is likely hesitant to offer anything over 6.

 

Either one side deviates from their ask or a deal doesn’t get done, simple as that. I’ve always felt that a 6 year deal at 8.25-8.5 is fair for both sides.

 

Edited August 7, 2022 by DeNiro

[mll]

28 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

It says LA may put Durzi on waivers.  So why would we give up Miller for him?  We can offer them Höglander straight up...

There's no reason for them to put Durzi on waivers.  Blake already confirmed that Sean Walker is going to switch sides.  Most of their young Ds still need seasoning and are waiver free.  They were in the lineup last season because Doughty only played 39 games and Sean Walker 6.  They used 14 Ds but those prospects weren't really ready yet.  

 

If they were worried about having too many Ds  they wouldn't have re-signed Edler.
 

Edited August 7, 2022 by mll