[proposal] Moving Ferland + our 2023 1st so that we can afford Miller, Boeser, and Horvat

[Goal:thecup]

JR mentioned in a list of things he talked about wanting to do and was constricted somewhat, that if the right moves were to be made, we could start banking cap space again, and we can't do that if we have players on IR.

If correct, that would put a couple names to the 'move a couple guys' narrative, i.e. Ferland and Sutter, maybe Keeper.

 

[@Mll, is this correct?]

[eeeeergh]

Just now, Junkyard Dog said:

Rutherford talked about the holes on the roster, the fact that the cap makes it hard to fill those holes and that it could take some time to do so. Only real deals he could make are a dollar for dollar(1 for 1) right now and doesn't sound too keen on that being a long-term solution.

 

He mentioned the fact that he'd like to acquire younger players to fit this group and that he's fine with building a group that could take time to develop into a long-term successful team. Doesn't want to trade any high draft picks either.

 

 

This points towards us being sellers at some point. The team needs youngsters and cap space in order to fill the holes and reshape the roster. 

Yep and that's not at all unreasonable. I dont think Miller and Horvat are the guys he lets walk though - Horvat is the captain in name, and Miller is the de facto captain. 

My guess is the guys he moves on from are guys that play roles that are easily replaceable by younger players. 

Pearson, Dickinson, Poolman, Hamonic likely get moved at some point. Sure, none of them gets us 1st rounders, but they'll provide cap space and the Canucks can draft with our own picks. 

[philtbc829]

2 hours ago, Pears said:

Approximately 20 minites after Rutherford said he doesn’t intend on trading any picks   

Ya but GMs are like politicians ..they speak with forked tongues ....and I'm not entirely sold on Brocky boy....wonder what Minny would give up to get a home town boy back...

[Goal:thecup]

7 minutes ago, eeeeergh said:

Yep and that's not at all unreasonable. I dont think Miller and Horvat are the guys he lets walk though - Horvat is the captain in name, and Miller is the de facto captain. 

My guess is the guys he moves on from are guys that play roles that are easily replaceable by younger players. 

Pearson, Dickinson, Poolman, Hamonic likely get moved at some point. Sure, none of them gets us 1st rounders, but they'll provide cap space and the Canucks can draft with our own picks. 

Prompted me to make a list of guys in danger of aging out:

May 13/85 Halak

Aug 24/88 Hunt

Nov 2/89 Schenn

Feb 1/90 Myers

Oct 1/90 Chiasson

Oct 1/90 Dowling

Personally, I'd like to keep Schenn and Myers from that list, but I'm just an old guy too.

[eeeeergh]

7 minutes ago, Goal:thecup said:

Prompted me to make a list of guys in danger of aging out:

May 13/85 Halak

Aug 24/88 Hunt

Nov 2/89 Schenn

Feb 1/90 Myers

Oct 1/90 Chiasson

Oct 1/90 Dowling

Personally, I'd like to keep Schenn and Myers from that list, but I'm just an old guy too.

Yeah I forgot about Myers - I think he could be moved at the trade deadline to a contender as well, especially if he keeps playing for the rest of the year like he has these past few games.

[#Canucks]

3 hours ago, King Heffy said:

Ferland is on LTIR; we don't need to get rid of him.

 

& Aqua is covered partially by the insurance for LTIR the teams take out. This is a no go for sure.

[wildcam]

4 hours ago, Patel Bure said:

[proposal] Moving Ferland + our 2023 1st so that we can afford Miller, Boeser, and Horvat

 

The Canucks will likely have to move on from one of Boeser, Miller, or Horvat at some point....or will they?  Correct me I’m wrong, but wouldn’t the Canucks be able to afford Boeser’s 7.5 QO if they got Ferland off the books?  Then, in the following season, Hamonic can be replaced by someone like Juulsen while we also move Pearson so that we can afford both Horvat and Miller.

 

Now obviously - all of the above is a moot point is if this current Canucks winning streak is just a hot streak.  If the Canucks go back to struggling and are way out of it by the trade deadline, then you obviously make a JT Miller move at the deadline and bring a guy like Braden Schneider in return.

 

On the flip side, if the Canucks make a miraculous come back this season and make the playoffs, then the goal should be for the Canucks to keep this core intact and build upon the fruits of this season.  Hence - my Ferland + 1st idea to clear cap and using that money to qualify Brock.  
 

The obvious trading partner in this instance would once again be Arizona. They get our 2023rd 1st for their efforts to take on Ferland, while we get a good young piece in return.....

No 1st rounders now..BIG NO... Why trade Ferland ? 

At some point you have to make hockey trades as we will always be against cap...

Moving a top forward for #2 D man and getting back 1st or second rounder is good...

We can't keep trading 1st rounders as we have 2 of the last 3 yrs...

[IBatch]

3 hours ago, Junkyard Dog said:

Everything I got from the Rutherford presser is that he wants to build a long-term successful team. He wants younger guys that fit our age group, even if it might take a bit for the group to come together. He pointed out that there are holes on the roster that could take a while to fill given our cap implications. 

 

Sounds like we aren't gonna make any short-term quick fixes moves. In fact we could be sellers.

After years of failing to do anything of consequence at the TDL...this would be a breath of fresh air.    To finally sell something that boosts the core in a big way later.   Absolutely get the MG guys weren't getting us anything aside from Tanev probably.    Demko would have been traded for pucks before the bubble and the ED.   Maybe we'd have got what he cost as in a second back.   Of course i hope we make the playoffs - just hope we aren't buyers, and if we are struggling and not that close then sell sell sell. 

[WEVEGOTMOTTE]

Maybe for convenience as a throw in for one of Trader Jim's Blockbuster Win now Trade's then I'm all for it! 

[Provost]

Totally backwards....

We should trade Miller and Horvat for 1st round picks and blue chip prospects.

Rutherford (rightly) pointed out that we were a couple of years away.  Mostly that is due to the cap situation and needing money freed up to rejig the lineup.  I have been saying this since it was clear the season was likely done.

Two years from now both Miller and Horvat are UFAs so we either have to pay them full market rate with big raises or let them walk for nothing.  The latter will effectively destroy our chance to compete for years.  Nothing we could get in free agency for those dollars can replace their value to our roster.

Trade Miller at the deadline for a 1st round pick, a blue chip NHL ready prospect, and a useful roster player.  At the end of the season determine whether Horvat is willing to extend at a reasonable number or not, and if not then trade him before the draft if possible for another 1st round pick and a blue chip prospect.

Then you can either use the picks, or package up some combination of picks/prospects for a legitimate top 4D under club control... and use the cap space you created to fill any other holes.

In the end you restock some prospects you will need for cheap ELCs in the next 2-5 years to avoid a cap crunch.  You fill a gaping hole in the lineup via trade, and you create some short term cap space to bring in any other help you need.

I genuinely don't see any other way forward that has as high a likelihood of success.

[The Lock]

Ferland's cap hit isn't an issue for us given it's on the LTIR. Trading it away with a 3rd is just us getting rid of a pick with no benefit to us.

[mrturkish]

Well mr Patel I’m not big on continuing to trade our draft picks. 
if the canucks continue to make wise draft choices we will get at least 3 years of cap control at a decent price. 
I think sometimes we over think things and let our minds run away with questionable trade proposals. I think we need to see how this whole thing works out before we make crazy trades. Let’s give Jim Rutherford and his team scope out the situation and see where it takes us. 
thats my two cents for what it’s worth. 

[Ghostsof1915]

4 minutes ago, mrturkish said:

Well mr Patel I’m not big on continuing to trade our draft picks. 
if the canucks continue to make wise draft choices we will get at least 3 years of cap control at a decent price. 
I think sometimes we over think things and let our minds run away with questionable trade proposals. I think we need to see how this whole thing works out before we make crazy trades. Let’s give Jim Rutherford and his team scope out the situation and see where it takes us. 
thats my two cents for what it’s worth. 

Your nickname makes me think of Snatch.

 

 

[J.I.A.H.N]

1 hour ago, mrturkish said:

Well mr Patel I’m not big on continuing to trade our draft picks. 
if the canucks continue to make wise draft choices we will get at least 3 years of cap control at a decent price. 
I think sometimes we over think things and let our minds run away with questionable trade proposals. I think we need to see how this whole thing works out before we make crazy trades. Let’s give Jim Rutherford and his team scope out the situation and see where it takes us. 
thats my two cents for what it’s worth. 

So, you seriously think JR reads all our ideas and says.....hey, there is a good one, I think I will do it?