[Rumour] Devils open to trading 2022 1st-round pick

[Gawdzukes]

22 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Heischer might be dragging teammates into the fight, but (their record shows) they are getting killed.  I like Heischer, but I’m not a fan of how soft their top forwards play.  Miller would be a perfect fit for their group.  

Apparently they have reached their leadership limit. No fit there unless they trade out some leadership.  

[wai_lai416]

28 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

No you said outscored.  Then went on to talk about goal scoring.  Thing is, no goal scoring player ever won a cup without refining the secondary part of their game.  it took trotz forcing Ovechkin to be a complete 2 way player and more unselfish before Ovi won the cup.

 

Bottom line is we're not talking about gretzky esque differences in goal scoring either.  Miller is by far a more complete player than laine.  Miller to NJ makes all the sense in the world no matter what your opinion is.  Sure makes more sense than Laine for every reason listed

 

If you can't argue that credibly, fine.  But disagreeing with you because it appears you're shifting the argument doesn't make me a troll any more than it makes your opinion right.

no one said my opinion is right it's my opinion. there's no denying Miller is the better player right now or might be the better player overall. but like i said Laine is more useful to the Devils than a 30 year old miller next year and beyond. that was my very first comment until someone not u started going off topic and telling me how Miller is better good for their center depth etc etc when he or hughes is unlikely to be playing center so it does nothing for their center depth as they won't demote hirshier

 

and the whole reason for wanting to trade Miller is because he doesn't really fit our timeline with his age.. so i fail to see how Miller is more useful than Laine is to the New Jersey when they are even further behind than us in terms of competing window. My very original post i was talking about Laine would be more useful to New Jersey than Miller because of age and he would fit their core competitive window then someone went and started saying miller is this miller is that which means absolutely nothing to New Jersey because by the time NJ is prolly competiting or close to contending.. Miller would be at least 33-34 years old. a 24 year old ppg guy yet to enter his prime is not a massive drop off from a that is in the middle of his prime and probably end of his prime in a few years.

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, wai_lai416 said:

no one said my opinion is right it's my opinion. there's no denying Miller is the better player right now or might be the better player overall. but like i said Laine is more useful to the Devils than a 30 year old miller next year and beyond. that was my very first comment until someone not u started going off topic and telling me how Miller is better good for their center depth etc etc when he or hughes is unlikely to be playing center so it does nothing for their center depth as they won't demote hirshier

 

and the whole reason for wanting to trade Miller is because he doesn't really fit our timeline with his age.. so i fail to see how Miller is more useful than Laine is to the New Jersey when they are even further behind than us in terms of competing window. My very original post i was talking about Laine would be more useful to New Jersey than Miller because of age and he would fit their core competitive window then someone went and started saying miller is this miller is that which means absolutely nothing to New Jersey because by the time NJ is prolly competiting or close to contending.. Miller would be at least 33-34 years old. a 24 year old ppg guy yet to enter his prime is not a massive drop off from a that is in the middle of his prime and probably end of his prime in a few years.

Miller will player Jersey’s 1C with Hughes on his wing.  Heischer will play 2C.  That’s a very good 1-2 punch at centre.  And Hughes would be more effective playing wing.  

I think we will extend Miller, but (if we don’t) I can see Jersey as a potential landing spot.  

[mll]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

Heischer might be dragging teammates into the fight, but (their record shows) they are getting killed.  I like Heischer, but I’m not a fan of how soft their top forwards play.  Miller would be a perfect fit for their group.  

 

And Fitzgerald kind of said as much.

 

In his end of season presser, he said they have a lot of the same up front.  Says he doesn't want a lot of the same and it's time to mix and match.  Be harder to play against and heavier skill.  Says straight line players are important to successful teams.  

 

He also says that he wants to add some veterans to better surround their young players to help them grow.  He might have to be do better than just sign a Tatar in free agency.

 

NJD got rid of pretty much all their vets and handed the team over to their youth.  So it's really a lot of inconsistency.  Looks like they are going to try and re-shape a few things.  On a young line, 1 player struggles and the whole line often falls apart.  They need some stable veteran presence and someone handing over their knowledge.

 

Boeser, after the Canucks added Miller, commented that him and Pettersson were always trying to keep the puck and force plays, while Miller taught them that sometimes it's better to get the puck deep and get in on the forecheck, rather than risk turning the puck over at the wrong place/time.  

 

NJD could definitely use someone with Miller's profile and who can pass on that kind of knowledge to a young team.  Miller was 26 when he was traded to Vancouver.  Do they want a 30 year old on a retirement contract or will they target someone a bit younger who can still be effective when their window opens up.  And does Miller want to go through it all again when he has yet to win it all.  

 

[eeeeergh]

27 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Miller will player Jersey’s 1C with Hughes on his wing.  Heischer will play 2C.  That’s a very good 1-2 punch at centre.  And Hughes would be more effective playing wing.  

I think we will extend Miller, but (if we don’t) I can see Jersey as a potential landing spot.  

Miller is exactly what NJ needs. Hughes is over a ppg player, and will likely continue his breakout even more next year. Miller rounds out a pretty epic forward core of theirs.

However, if they're going to make the playoffs, they absolutely need a goalie too. Blackwood isnt going to cut it. I think maybe they take a run at Varlamov from NYI, since New York already has Sorokin doing so well. 

NJ with Miller and Varlamov is a pretty terrifying team. Playoff lock imo. 

[wai_lai416]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

Miller will player Jersey’s 1C with Hughes on his wing.  Heischer will play 2C.  That’s a very good 1-2 punch at centre.  And Hughes would be more effective playing wing.  

I think we will extend Miller, but (if we don’t) I can see Jersey as a potential landing spot.  

lol Miller with Hughes is like Miller with EP.. doesn't work.. Hughes needs the puck to be effective like EP.. Miller likes to hold on to the puck all the time and skate thru entire teams. and having Hughes with Miller on the same line is a disaster defensively.. both players don't backcheck.. it's essentially a odd man rush the other way minus 2 players everytime they turn the puck over in the offensive zone. CDC views Jersey as a potential landing spot coz of the 2nd overall pick.. Jersey doesn't view Miller as a player they want to target as there are better probably cheaper top 6 option out there that wouldn't cost them a 2nd overall or having to move their centers to a wing.. + miller doesn't fit the timeline for that group.. is Jersey competing next year or the year after? probably not? they can't keep the puck out of their net.. they have no goalie.. their defense is horrible outside of hamilton/severson.

[mll]

32 minutes ago, eeeeergh said:

Miller is exactly what NJ needs. Hughes is over a ppg player, and will likely continue his breakout even more next year. Miller rounds out a pretty epic forward core of theirs.

However, if they're going to make the playoffs, they absolutely need a goalie too. Blackwood isnt going to cut it. I think maybe they take a run at Varlamov from NYI, since New York already has Sorokin doing so well. 

NJ with Miller and Varlamov is a pretty terrifying team. Playoff lock imo. 

Goalies are impacted by their environment and there's a gap between NYI and NJD defensively and even style of play.

 

NYI was mostly a reliable defensive team under Trotz - is also a more veteran team.  There's not that attention to detail in NJD yet and they are still really young.   NJD is also a rush/possession team where they also give up a lot of odd man rushes, while NYI barely gives up any.  Trotz wants to prevent neutral zone turnovers, so unless there's a low risk entry path, NYI will dump the puck.  NJD is still trying to skate through guys which often leads to turnovers.

 

[eeeeergh]

3 minutes ago, mll said:

Goalies are impacted by their environment and there's a gap between NYI and NJD defensively and even style of play.

 

NYI was mostly a reliable defensive team under Trotz - is also a more veteran team.  There's not that attention to detail in NJD yet and they are still really young.   NJD is also a rush/possession team where they also give up a lot of odd man rushes, while NYI barely gives up any.  Trotz wants to prevent neutral zone turnovers, so unless there's a low risk entry path, NYI will dump the puck.  NJD is still trying to skate through guys which often leads to turnovers.

 

NJ probably needs a goalie that can steal games then, like Demko does for us. Maybe Varlamov isnt the answer then - they could take a run at Fleury in UFA. 

[ShawnAntoski]

2 hours ago, eeeeergh said:

Miller is exactly what NJ needs. Hughes is over a ppg player, and will likely continue his breakout even more next year. Miller rounds out a pretty epic forward core of theirs.

However, if they're going to make the playoffs, they absolutely need a goalie too. Blackwood isnt going to cut it. I think maybe they take a run at Varlamov from NYI, since New York already has Sorokin doing so well. 

NJ with Miller and Varlamov is a pretty terrifying team. Playoff lock imo. 

NJ is a mess despite there high end players.  I agree, that Miller is a good fit with there young roster: a talented and veteran player that was able to evolve his game from when he was with Tampa to Vancouver.

 

As for Blackwood, he is a Vezina candidate vs the Canucks.

Edited June 1, 2022 by ShawnAntoski

[ShawnAntoski]

2 hours ago, mll said:

 

And Fitzgerald kind of said as much.

 

In his end of season presser, he said they have a lot of the same up front.  Says he doesn't want a lot of the same and it's time to mix and match.  Be harder to play against and heavier skill.  Says straight line players are important to successful teams.  

 

He also says that he wants to add some veterans to better surround their young players to help them grow.  He might have to be do better than just sign a Tatar in free agency.

 

NJD got rid of pretty much all their vets and handed the team over to their youth.  So it's really a lot of inconsistency.  Looks like they are going to try and re-shape a few things.  On a young line, 1 player struggles and the whole line often falls apart.  They need some stable veteran presence and someone handing over their knowledge.

 

Boeser, after the Canucks added Miller, commented that him and Pettersson were always trying to keep the puck and force plays, while Miller taught them that sometimes it's better to get the puck deep and get in on the forecheck, rather than risk turning the puck over at the wrong place/time.  

 

NJD could definitely use someone with Miller's profile and who can pass on that kind of knowledge to a young team.  Miller was 26 when he was traded to Vancouver.  Do they want a 30 year old on a retirement contract or will they target someone a bit younger who can still be effective when their window opens up.  And does Miller want to go through it all again when he has yet to win it all.  

 

Good chance, Fitzgerald might become JRs' ,Craig Patrick: the GM who acquired the Crosby core, whilst, JR lead them to a few cups.

[Elias Pettersson]

5 hours ago, mll said:

 

And Fitzgerald kind of said as much.

 

In his end of season presser, he said they have a lot of the same up front.  Says he doesn't want a lot of the same and it's time to mix and match.  Be harder to play against and heavier skill.  Says straight line players are important to successful teams.  

 

He also says that he wants to add some veterans to better surround their young players to help them grow.  He might have to be do better than just sign a Tatar in free agency.

 

NJD got rid of pretty much all their vets and handed the team over to their youth.  So it's really a lot of inconsistency.  Looks like they are going to try and re-shape a few things.  On a young line, 1 player struggles and the whole line often falls apart.  They need some stable veteran presence and someone handing over their knowledge.

 

Boeser, after the Canucks added Miller, commented that him and Pettersson were always trying to keep the puck and force plays, while Miller taught them that sometimes it's better to get the puck deep and get in on the forecheck, rather than risk turning the puck over at the wrong place/time.  

 

NJD could definitely use someone with Miller's profile and who can pass on that kind of knowledge to a young team.  Miller was 26 when he was traded to Vancouver.  Do they want a 30 year old on a retirement contract or will they target someone a bit younger who can still be effective when their window opens up.  And does Miller want to go through it all again when he has yet to win it all.  

 

Miller might not have a choice.  The teams that are competing for a Cup right now probably don't want Miller.  The Rangers are fine without him and probably want to keep their young guys.  Miller may have to go to a team like New Jersey and help them just like he helped the Canucks and hope that they can become a Cup contender in 3-4 years.

 

Pittsburgh and Boston have been mentioned as destinations for Miller.  But those teams aren't really Cup contenders at this point either and they are on the downward swing from their Cup years.  I really don't see Boston challenging for a Cup and Pittsburgh hasn't even sorted out the situation with Malkin and Letang.

 

New Jersey is a team that needs Miller.  And they have the assets we need in a trade.  With the right moves over the next 2 years it is possible they can become a playoff team.  They have alot of pieces, young pieces, and could use a couple strong veterans.

 

I think the 2nd overall pick is in play for the right deal.  Miller and the 15th pick could be tempting.  New Jersey has almost no veteran leadership right now.  And they have tons of cap space and more coming next summer.  They could easily sign Miller to a 7-8 year extension if they wanted to.  Miller playing with Jack Hughes would be like Miller playing with Petey.  Hughes needs a veteran guy like Miller to help him out.  

 

Miller   Hughes   Mercer

 

That would be a great top line for them.  Hischier would be their BO on the 2nd line.  Tatar is pretty much useless at this point and will be gone next summer.

 

I'd do Miller and 15OA for 2OA and Kevin Bahl.  

[Elias Pettersson]

4 hours ago, wai_lai416 said:

lol Miller with Hughes is like Miller with EP.. doesn't work.. Hughes needs the puck to be effective like EP.. Miller likes to hold on to the puck all the time and skate thru entire teams. and having Hughes with Miller on the same line is a disaster defensively.. both players don't backcheck.. it's essentially a odd man rush the other way minus 2 players everytime they turn the puck over in the offensive zone. CDC views Jersey as a potential landing spot coz of the 2nd overall pick.. Jersey doesn't view Miller as a player they want to target as there are better probably cheaper top 6 option out there that wouldn't cost them a 2nd overall or having to move their centers to a wing.. + miller doesn't fit the timeline for that group.. is Jersey competing next year or the year after? probably not? they can't keep the puck out of their net.. they have no goalie.. their defense is horrible outside of hamilton/severson.

The Lotto Line didn't work?  

[mll]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Miller might not have a choice.  The teams that are competing for a Cup right now probably don't want Miller.  The Rangers are fine without him and probably want to keep their young guys.  Miller may have to go to a team like New Jersey and help them just like he helped the Canucks and hope that they can become a Cup contender in 3-4 years.

 

Pittsburgh and Boston have been mentioned as destinations for Miller.  But those teams aren't really Cup contenders at this point either and they are on the downward swing from their Cup years.  I really don't see Boston challenging for a Cup and Pittsburgh hasn't even sorted out the situation with Malkin and Letang.

 

New Jersey is a team that needs Miller.  And they have the assets we need in a trade.  With the right moves over the next 2 years it is possible they can become a playoff team.  They have alot of pieces, young pieces, and could use a couple strong veterans.

 

I think the 2nd overall pick is in play for the right deal.  Miller and the 15th pick could be tempting.  New Jersey has almost no veteran leadership right now.  And they have tons of cap space and more coming next summer.  They could easily sign Miller to a 7-8 year extension if they wanted to.  Miller playing with Jack Hughes would be like Miller playing with Petey.  Hughes needs a veteran guy like Miller to help him out.  

 

Miller   Hughes   Mercer

 

That would be a great top line for them.  Hischier would be their BO on the 2nd line.  Tatar is pretty much useless at this point and will be gone next summer.

 

I'd do Miller and 15OA for 2OA and Kevin Bahl.  

 

Miller apparently can't talk about an extension before the draft and has to wait till free agency opens up.  At the draft he's a 1-year rental and it's pretty unlikely that a team would give up such a high draft pick for just 1-year. 

[Alflives]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Miller might not have a choice.  The teams that are competing for a Cup right now probably don't want Miller.  The Rangers are fine without him and probably want to keep their young guys.  Miller may have to go to a team like New Jersey and help them just like he helped the Canucks and hope that they can become a Cup contender in 3-4 years.

 

Pittsburgh and Boston have been mentioned as destinations for Miller.  But those teams aren't really Cup contenders at this point either and they are on the downward swing from their Cup years.  I really don't see Boston challenging for a Cup and Pittsburgh hasn't even sorted out the situation with Malkin and Letang.

 

New Jersey is a team that needs Miller.  And they have the assets we need in a trade.  With the right moves over the next 2 years it is possible they can become a playoff team.  They have alot of pieces, young pieces, and could use a couple strong veterans.

 

I think the 2nd overall pick is in play for the right deal.  Miller and the 15th pick could be tempting.  New Jersey has almost no veteran leadership right now.  And they have tons of cap space and more coming next summer.  They could easily sign Miller to a 7-8 year extension if they wanted to.  Miller playing with Jack Hughes would be like Miller playing with Petey.  Hughes needs a veteran guy like Miller to help him out.  

 

Miller   Hughes   Mercer

 

That would be a great top line for them.  Hischier would be their BO on the 2nd line.  Tatar is pretty much useless at this point and will be gone next summer.

 

I'd do Miller and 15OA for 2OA and Kevin Bahl.  

Great trade for us.  From the Jersey perspective, if they want to have a chance to win, they play Miller at centre with Hughes on his wing.  Hughes is too small, and plays way too soft, to be an effective centre without the puck.  

[Alienhuggyflow]

47 minutes ago, mll said:

 

Miller apparently can't talk about an extension before the draft and has to wait till free agency opens up.  At the draft he's a 1-year rental and it's pretty unlikely that a team would give up such a high draft pick for just 1-year. 

I might be in the minority but any trade where a pick or prospect that won't help us while we have Petey, would be pretty fn disappointing. 

 

We are so much closer to being a 100 point team then non playoff team and any move should reflect that.

 

I think trading him is dumb and there are several other contracts that can be moved to create cap, especially since we only have Brock to worry about along with depth pieces and 38 million in cap off the books the next two seasons.

 

If we do move him his value extended is worth a ton.

From TB Cernak, Killorn. Slavin,  Parryako++ is the kind of value a guy with 217 points in 200 games who is a centre that plays tough minutes in all situations whose never had any major injuries and fitness wise out performed almost every nuck during drills in practice. 

 

The way I see it and interpret what we've heard from insiders is JT if he gets moved its because a team makes a deal that JR can't say no to and that to me will be an RHD that's every bit as valuable in that position that JT is in his, or one that's not quite but comes with ++ like a Cernak or Parryako.

Otherwise why? He's under contract this season and is not only willing but wants to be here, sure he's not gonna take a discount but who cares? We're a better team with him and despite what other fanbases think we're in good shape cap wise especially after  the next couple of seasons and in 3-4 years the cap is gonna go up to 90++ million and only one possible 10+ million contract (Petey) 

 

 

 

[Alflives]

5 minutes ago, Alienhuggyflow said:

I might be in the minority but any trade where a pick or prospect that won't help us while we have Petey, would be pretty fn disappointing. 

 

We are so much closer to being a 100 point team then non playoff team and any move should reflect that.

 

I think trading him is dumb and there are several other contracts that can be moved to create cap, especially since we only have Brock to worry about along with depth pieces and 38 million in cap off the books the next two seasons.

 

If we do move him his value extended is worth a ton.

From TB Cernak, Killorn. Slavin,  Parryako++ is the kind of value a guy with 217 points in 200 games who is a centre that plays tough minutes in all situations whose never had any major injuries and fitness wise out performed almost every nuck during drills in practice. 

 

The way I see it and interpret what we've heard from insiders is JT if he gets moved its because a team makes a deal that JR can't say no to and that to me will be an RHD that's every bit as valuable in that position that JT is in his, or one that's not quite but comes with ++ like a Cernak or Parryako.

Otherwise why? He's under contract this season and is not only willing but wants to be here, sure he's not gonna take a discount but who cares? We're a better team with him and despite what other fanbases think we're in good shape cap wise especially after  the next couple of seasons and in 3-4 years the cap is gonna go up to 90++ million and only one possible 10+ million contract (Petey) 

 

 

 

Agreed.  JR said we are going to move pieces to get better while not taking a step back.  So if we do trade Miller the main part of the return will be a fully developed player (or players) who will help us right now.  So players 23-27.  Sure there might be a puck and (or) a prospect too, but those will not be the most valuable parts of the return.

Basically we are not rearranging our deck chairs.  We are switching some of our older ones for ones that are used, but have more years left in them.  

[Alienhuggyflow]

42 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Great trade for us.  From the Jersey perspective, if they want to have a chance to win, they play Miller at centre with Hughes on his wing.  Hughes is too small, and plays way too soft, to be an effective centre without the puck.  

Moving up 13 spots in a draft in which a guy at 15 may very well be as good as someone at 2 is not a good trade for us,IMHO.

 That would be a massive risk that does nothing in the present and pretty much signals to Petey we have no intention of winning during his contract .

Legit #1 RHD, or a #2 RHD with a +. Otherwise we keep the heartbeat of a the team who does everything and based on his time here is a 90+ point player.

This decision pretty much sets the table for the direction this teams going.

A futures trade for me spells the end of the core under 25.

I 

[Alienhuggyflow]

Just now, Alflives said:

Agreed.  JR said we are going to move pieces to get better while not taking a step back.  So if we do trade Miller the main part of the return will be a fully developed player (or players) who will help us right now.  So players 23-27.  Sure there might be a puck and (or) a prospect too, but those will not be the most valuable parts of the return.

Basically we are not rearranging our deck chairs.  We are switching some of our older ones for ones that are used, but have more years left in them.  

That's exactly how I see it Alf. Shuffling the deck a bit.

I think under Bruce the team showed the core is fully capable and that's with a few of the core taking until the all-star break to find their form.

[shiznak]

I question why the hell would NJ want Miller, when they could just use their money on Kadri/Copp and keep their 2nd overall pick.

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, shiznak said:

I question why the hell would NJ want Miller, when they could just use their money on Kadri/Copp and keep their 2nd overall pick.

Miller is 29.  Kadri is 32.

Miller is a leader and a number one center.  Kadri is neither.

Miller is signed for this coming season at a great number.  Kadri will cost a lot more on this year's cap.

Miller will play 1C allowing Hughes to play wing and develop his game without the puck.

 

Miller to Jersey for 2OA is a fair trade.  But JR isn't interested in that kind of return.  He stated no step back.  So Miller, if he goes to Jersey, would be for Zacha, a D, and a pick in a later round.