Changes that could improve the NHL

[IBatch]

14 minutes ago, DrJockitch said:

If they had had Michael Jordan they would have found a way to screw that up. 
‘It is weird that they took away 4v4 because the Oilers were to good at it but also moved the net further away from the boards to expand Gretzky’s office. 

They moved the net out in 91 to 11 feet to "increase scoring" ... so again after the Oilers we're done.   Sure they just won a cup ... but not one they were supposed too, and without Gretzky and Coffey plus a lot of those key secondary players during the the 80's...They moved it out to 13 feet Gretzky's final year ... in the deepest part of the dead puck era until the early 2000's and then back to 11 feet again lol.     As a side note Brian Burke is a huge advocate of making the rink wider ... and has made sure all new arenas ice is built in a way that the first row of seats has the ice capability already under it for the future.  The idea around this of course is to increase scoring too.   Read his stuff on why it's pretty logical - players were getting bigger and bigger and scoring sucked.   Funny thing though, scoring is way up now and the players are the same size as they were in the mid-late 80's.   Skill is back!   Sure the quality PMDs has a lot to do with that ... and know PIT back to back cups had something to do with how speed speed speed counterattack changed how GMs approached the draft as well.    The amount of young D's that have come in and made an impact recently - it's possible you might have to go back to the early 80's to find the same thing.   Hope so!  Makar ... so nice to see that back.   Josi... nice to see a Borque like season again too. 

Edited July 14, 2022 by IBatch

[StanleyCupOneDay]

The biggest thing on my wish list is an available challenge to a penalty call for each team playing. I’m tired of seeing refs making a boneheaded decision that effects the end result. Obviously I don’t want hockey to become like other sports where stoppages for coaches are abundant, but I feel this rule change for a single challenge would be a good balance so the better team actually does win the game.

[hammertime]

I'm not a fan of being able to sign a 35yo player to a long term contract. IMO you should not be able to sign players past 38 unless it's no more than max 2 years at a time. a 35 year old player should not be allowed to sign longer than 5 years. 38+2.

[King Heffy]

Best solution would be some actual accountability with problem refs.  Give teams a 3 ref ****list and see how fast guys like Sutherland suddenly either learn how to conduct themselves appropriately or find other employment.  The open corruption that has been plaguing the officiating ranks has tarnished the sport as a whole.  Stop fining teams for calling out the BS the refs are pulling and start fixing the root cause of the problem.

Edited July 15, 2022 by King Heffy

[Kevin Biestra]

53 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Best solution would be some actual accountability with problem refs.  Give teams a 3 ref ****list and see how fast guys like Sutherland suddenly either learn how to conduct themselves appropriately or find other employment.  The open corruption that has been plaguing the officiating ranks has tarnished the sport as a whole.  Stop fining teams for calling out the BS the refs are pulling and start fixing the root cause of the problem.

 

It's a rule that makes sense in terms of avoiding the creation of bad contracts.  But at the same time how much do the owners / GMs need to be saved from themselves?  In all other businesses people just have to use common sense in signing their contracts for labor, materials, rent, whatever or else eat the costs of a dumb contract.  Decade after decade we have to shut down the league because GMs can't restrain themselves.

 

Things find an equilibrium eventually in every marketplace, but that keeps getting postponed with change after change.  But I guess eventually if they don't want to do that they will fine tune the rules to make things idiot proof enough.  But these are the big leagues...it isn't supposed to be idiots at the helm by the team they are running NHL franchises.

 

I generally lean toward freedom to contract...with whatever the consequences are for both parties who sign the deal.  Of course making a detailed CBA is one way to implement that freedom to contract.  But it is kind of silly to watch owners and management shoot themselves in the foot time and time again and then shut down the league to try to figure out why their feet are sore.

 

Edited July 15, 2022 by Kevin Biestra

[Kevin Biestra]

Oh and get the ads off the boards and make them nice and clean again.

[UnkNuk]

Scrap divisions and conferences.  

 

Every team plays every other team twice - once at home and once away.  In a 32 team league that would mean a 62 game regular season - a good thing as the current regular season is too long.  And a balanced schedule for all teams would add meaning to the President's Trophy.

 

Top 16 teams get into the playoffs.

[Kevin Biestra]

15 hours ago, IBatch said:

Well said.   Believe long term, this is probably what will happen.   The league can't expand and expect interest to remain high forever without making changes.    Agree winning the conference final now, in many ways was like winning the cup pre-expansion.  I'm actually a fan of retraction.   Without the cap, the league would have been headed that way and they knew this.   Worth a year without revenue not just to fix salary disclosure - but also save 6-8 teams asses.   Wonder how many people on this site are aware of even though Hartford/CAR franchise won a cup, not too many years after attendance slid like crazy, even though they still were a good team, and once the Staal/Ward era crashed their attendance became dismal.   Florida still suffers with bad attendance lol.   ARI/CAR/FLD definitely are teams the league could have lost.    ARI still should be moved.   

 

I figured things were always headed to a 32 team league.  It just works logically for divisions and playoffs, divisible by two down to every division.

 

They should do away with the wild card.  We don't need one with eight teams per division and four making it.  Four per division like the old days, and now it's not some wackadoo setup where three divisions have five teams and some poor division has six.  That was a time for the wild card.  Completely pointless now.

 

I'd be for some kind of baseball style set up like you say where we have play ins.  16 out of 32 teams missing the playoffs entirely just seems like way too much.  Obviously I'm used to stuff like that with baseball but hockey had always been everybody but the bum teams make it and then we really see who is who, and I liked it that way.  16 out of 21 teams making it was the sweet spot in my opinion.  Now that there are 32...  I might do something like top two teams per division get a bye and then spots 3-6 out of 8 do the first play in round.  It will muck up the historical playoff stats and put teams with byes at a scoring leader disadvantage unless there is some sort of "keep them busy for home ice advantage" round like in the COVID year.  But...it's not like any of the stats have been treated with any sanctity of any kind really and that's certainly less of a departure from history than shootouts, OTLs, etc.

 

I would also hire some hockey historians to, if possible, go through all the old games that they can and see if some of the more modern stats can be retroactively tallied for the older seasons where they weren't kept.  Even if it's just basic stuff like +/- and minutes / SPCT for goalies.

[Kragar]

On 7/12/2022 at 8:14 AM, IBatch said:

Salary

Compare Taxes of Two Teams

Vancouver Canucks

(52.72% x $5,500,000)

$2,899,600

Toronto Maple Leafs

(52.83% x $5,500,000)

$2,905,650

Difference in Tax Paid

$6,050

 

your salary.

Enter an Annual Salary

Compare Taxes of Two Teams

Vancouver Canucks

(53.14% x $12,000,000)

$6,376,800

Toronto Maple Leafs

(53.21% x $12,000,000)

$6,385,200

Difference in Tax Paid

$8,400

 

Yes i'm sure they are really concerned about this.. 

 

Or if you'd like to see some Cali i've already mentioned them - they pay about 4.5% less tax then we do ... look it up.   And the Alberta teams pay less.  But marginally so.  

 

Enter an Annual Salary

Please enter an amount equal to or above the league minimum salary of $700,000.

Compare Taxes of Two Teams

Anaheim Ducks

(49.19% x $5,500,000)

$2,705,450

Vancouver Canucks

(52.72% x $5,500,000)

$2,899,600

Difference in Tax Paid

$194,150

 

How is CAli "marginally" more expensive?    Get this calculates the cities they play in given their divisions as well.  To me this reads "5.5" in CALo is like 5.3 in Vancouver more or less.   Yes CAli and NY teams pay similar tax rates as Alberta teams which i've mentioned already.    Within a couple points anyways.   After them there is a massive drop.   Down to 42, then down to 36.64.   You can take a horse to water ... 

I'm curious how the Canuck and Leaf tax rates are so close, when the top rate in BC is 7% higher than ON (approx 20% vs 13%)

 

In any case, another solution, not listed in the polling option, is petitioning the government to reduce the tax rate 

[UKNuck96]

2 hours ago, 6of1_halfdozenofother said:

Two words: relegation &^@#ing league.

 

That'll get teams working, if they know players are going to &^@# off if they can't stay up in the top tier league because their $&!#ty team got relegated.

 

It'd also give $&!#ty teams incentive to get their &^@#ing act together or get wiped off the map.

 

Enough &^@#ing around, let's &^@#ing do this!  

I’m all for relegation and a pyramid system but how do you square that with the draft, cap hits etc. plus NA sports are far more corporate and not derived from community clubs. When the owners are in it for the money and not for the sporting achievement and said owners  run the league as opposed to being governed by it 

[ShawnAntoski]

To answer OP: replace Ratman with someone that actually loves the game and its history.

[Hairy Kneel]

One ref.

Video review is creeping it's way into more areas of the game now.

One ref is plenty, plus linesman have more influence now.

Add vid review for dives and embellishments. Give them one warning, then give 2 minutes and a game misconduct for every dive. Or those who snap their heads back with no contact.

 

 

 

Edited July 22, 2022 by Hairy Kneel

[IBatch]

On 7/14/2022 at 11:31 PM, Kevin Biestra said:

 

I figured things were always headed to a 32 team league.  It just works logically for divisions and playoffs, divisible by two down to every division.

 

They should do away with the wild card.  We don't need one with eight teams per division and four making it.  Four per division like the old days, and now it's not some wackadoo setup where three divisions have five teams and some poor division has six.  That was a time for the wild card.  Completely pointless now.

 

I'd be for some kind of baseball style set up like you say where we have play ins.  16 out of 32 teams missing the playoffs entirely just seems like way too much.  Obviously I'm used to stuff like that with baseball but hockey had always been everybody but the bum teams make it and then we really see who is who, and I liked it that way.  16 out of 21 teams making it was the sweet spot in my opinion.  Now that there are 32...  I might do something like top two teams per division get a bye and then spots 3-6 out of 8 do the first play in round.  It will muck up the historical playoff stats and put teams with byes at a scoring leader disadvantage unless there is some sort of "keep them busy for home ice advantage" round like in the COVID year.  But...it's not like any of the stats have been treated with any sanctity of any kind really and that's certainly less of a departure from history than shootouts, OTLs, etc.

 

I would also hire some hockey historians to, if possible, go through all the old games that they can and see if some of the more modern stats can be retroactively tallied for the older seasons where they weren't kept.  Even if it's just basic stuff like +/- and minutes / SPCT for goalies.

Interesting concepts.   I think making the first round best of five like it used to be is perfectly fine (with the addition of the play-ins), as long as the league goes back to 80 or even 78 games.    Don't want the best teams not have to work for the cup as hard as teams did before

 

You'd be happy to know... as for hockey history, save percentages have been done all the way back to i think very early 50's now.    And you can see why Plante, Bower, Sawchuk, Hall etc, ranked so high in older folks minds.   Imagine, there was guys with career sp over .920 back then too!  Drydens rivals Haseks...same i believe.   Parent,  just his PHI years (most of his career anyways), was very good too.     Plus minus im not as sure about.  

[IBatch]

5 hours ago, Hairy Kneel said:

One ref.

Video review is creeping it's way into more areas of the game now.

One ref is plenty, plus linesman have more influence now.

Add vid review for dives and embellishments. One warning, then game misconduct for divers. Or those who snap their heads back with no contact.

 

 

 

Actually think they should allow one linesman to make calls behind the play that get missed.    And for sure get rid of the extra ref.   It gummed up the game, plus you'd get only the best of the best in the business.    There was a time you'd know pretty much every vet ref in the game very well, their style, how they called the game etc.   Paul Stewart was one of my faves because he just let the guys play.   Sure we got burned by all of them at one point (Fraser)... but they had personality too.   Now i barely pay any attention ever to who's reffing and don't have any thoughts about "they are out to get us" either, every team feels that way to a certain degree.   Our current team the past several seasons is right at, or near the top in power plays for.   And in 2011 we got 2 PPs for every one of Bostons but still read/hear about how we got burned lol.    No ref, is calling it all, in a final or in a playoff game for that matter.   And it's part of the game is so much better the second season. 

[IBatch]

6 hours ago, Hairy Kneel said:

One ref.

Video review is creeping it's way into more areas of the game now.

One ref is plenty, plus linesman have more influence now.

Add vid review for dives and embellishments. Give them one warning, then give 2 minutes and a game misconduct for every dive. Or those who snap their heads back with no contact.

 

 

 

I added this to the poll...good suggestion!   As for those guys that fake it, the refs know who they are ... risky business to embellish,  i'm sure they hate it when they see the review later and realize they got played.    We've had players do this too... McDiver lol.   Gretzky used his "whining" way too much - but if they can get away with things that's what they do.   Was it Kesler who was barely touched, and had a delayed reaction that looked like he just got hit by a bus?   Or Cooke.   Can't re-call.   Sure makes it for a fun TV highlight though. 

[Harold Drunken]

Anything that helps bad officiating and questionable calls not determine the outcome of a game directly. 

[IBatch]

16 hours ago, Harold Drunken said:

Anything that helps bad officiating and questionable calls not determine the outcome of a game directly. 

Without it becoming full baseball boring ... etc ... it could goofy pretty fast.   Even now with some plays that were simply amazing getting disallowed "because the skate, with .01 second replay angle - was off-side", the "out-come" a lot of games and even series have been impacted.

 

  It's never going to be perfect.   Wonder how many glorious goals from the past would have been disallowed because a linesman's eyes simply can't do what 20 different camera angles can?

 

As an aside how many breakaways per game would Bure, Selanne, Federov etc etc have if you didn't have to skate or make that extra pass in the neutral zone?  THAT is the best rule change i've seen ever.    Man those 80's Oilers stats would look even more ridiculous, same every player before as well.  Old we stars careers got a massive boost, and guys that were skilled but struggled in the dead puck era - blossomed. 

 

 A lot i'm sure ... Sometimes you win, and sometimes, Otto kicks it in.   It really depends which side of it your on with how you feel.   Kind like the shoot-out.  You get some buzz when you win it, but then well, it's a oily feeling all the same ...the game should really just be a tie.  

 

Nothing wrong with that.    All attempts to change 3rd periods, just rolled into the same darn idea, "make it to OT boys and we've got that point even if we lose the game!"    is way more ridiculous, then a training drill (3 x 3...I mean how often does that EVER happen during a game?)  and way way way more ridiculous then adopting a European dealio, that simply is a skills competition.   Also puts undue stress on your goalie.  They for sure get boned doing this physically and stats wise.   

 

Anyways - im all for making changes that improve the game.   Like removing the redline.   Probably the most significant change i've seen in my lifetime.    As far as refs go, not an easy job - same with the linesman.   And as far as the flow of the game, i get more frustrated with that extra ref getting in the way, then i'm a missed call.   They still happen anyways.    

[IBatch]

17 hours ago, Harold Drunken said:

Anything that helps bad officiating and questionable calls not determine the outcome of a game directly. 

Bad officiating, for me at least, means putting the best of the best out there.   One less ref and assign a linesman the power to call a major.    Would he an improvement.   One less guy on the ice too.   COL winning with too many guys on the ice lol... sure that stung. 

[UKNuck96]

27 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Bad officiating, for me at least, means putting the best of the best out there.   One less ref and assign a linesman the power to call a major.    Would he an improvement.   One less guy on the ice too.   COL winning with too many guys on the ice lol... sure that stung. 

I would go with one ref, one tmo ref who has eyes in the sky view and in constant comms via wireless link.

 

would remove linemen and use technology to automate offside calls, similar to soccer goal line tech where it buzzes, do same for goals so we don’t spend ages reviewing unless it’s being checked for legality.

also speed up the game by the ref making the call and symbol while calling it, but don’t then come over and redo it for the crowd. The announcer can do that when the players hit the box. 

also would like to see less minors called for small things to speed up the game but use a basketball style personal foul system so if they tot up it’s 2 mins each time after that.

 

would also like to see goalies sitting their own penalties and make the backup play until a break in play 

 

 

[IBatch]

8 hours ago, UKNuck96 said:

I would go with one ref, one tmo ref who has eyes in the sky view and in constant comms via wireless link.

 

would remove linemen and use technology to automate offside calls, similar to soccer goal line tech where it buzzes, do same for goals so we don’t spend ages reviewing unless it’s being checked for legality.

also speed up the game by the ref making the call and symbol while calling it, but don’t then come over and redo it for the crowd. The announcer can do that when the players hit the box. 

also would like to see less minors called for small things to speed up the game but use a basketball style personal foul system so if they tot up it’s 2 mins each time after that.

 

would also like to see goalies sitting their own penalties and make the backup play until a break in play 

 

 

Civic better go brush off his skates and become a ref then.   Your always going to need two linesman to break up fights ... he's the tree that could make Chara look rather ordinary.     But the idea of a ref with a good earpiece isn't a bad one. TO war room could beep in his ear if they see something that needs actual checking.   To me it's never going to be perfect - you win some, you lose some, and it evens out.     I'm all for one ref, if that means use an ear piece then so be it.    The moment linesman are not longer needed, is the day i stop watching the game.