[PGT] St. Louis Blues at Vancouver Canucks | Dec. 19, 2022

[lmm]

5-1 is the new "Playing for a tie"

11 hours ago, -Vintage Canuck- said:

 

you see, its not so bad

that stat puts us firmly in the top 84%

[smithers joe]

on the merrick show this morning, jeff and elliot said schenn could garner a first. you can't turn that down can you?

[Odd.]

55 minutes ago, stawns said:

I still there’s good bones in there, it’s just a bad mix of players and a coach who clearly doesn’t care and has little to no structure to his systems.

 

Firign BB should be the first move

Yes, because firing 4 coaches in a span of 5-6 years is definitely part of the solution.

 

Put Trotz, Laviolette, Quennville, Gallant, or anyone of those top tier coaches into Bruce’s place and you’ll find out much quickly it’s the quality of players, not the coaches.

 

Bruce is the 2nd most winningest coach in the NHL. You don’t achieve that with “no structure”. You’re just regurgitating what Dim Jim 2.0 (who has done nothing alongside Alvin to rectify the situation) said when 2 months before you wouldn’t have said a word about his structure.

 

Your boy by the way played astonishing last night, surely he’s a recipe for a winning team.

[King Heffy]

Just now, smithers joe said:

on the merrick show this morning, jeff and elliot said schenn could garner a first. you can't turn that down can you?

I love Schenn but I'd drive him to the airport.

[Zhukini]

Just now, smithers joe said:

on the merrick show this morning, jeff and elliot said schenn could garner a first. you can't turn that down can you?

If that's true and you do, anyone still choosing to support this team is either a fool, or doesn't care about the team. 

[stawns]

2 minutes ago, Odd. said:

Yes, because firing 4 coaches in a span of 5-6 years is definitely part of the solution.

 

Put Trotz, Laviolette, Quennville, Gallant, or anyone of those top tier coaches into Bruce’s place and you’ll find out much quickly it’s the quality of players, not the coaches.

 

Bruce is the 2nd most winningest coach in the NHL. You don’t achieve that with “no structure”. You’re just regurgitating what Dim Jim 2.0 (who has done nothing alongside Alvin to rectify the situation) said when 2 months before you wouldn’t have said a word about his structure.

 

Your boy by the way played astonishing last night, surely he’s a recipe for a winning team.

Actually I was against bringing in BB from the day the rumours started.  He was never going to be anything but a placeholder and that was a terrible move for a group who was supposed to grow together.

 

Do you think they have a lot of structure to their game?

[stawns]

16 minutes ago, Oldmanpower said:

Not rebuilding. Not competing. Up against the cap. We are in the No Mans Land of the nhl.

Wtf

They just need to identify the right core and make moves to build around that.  The issue is that this management group seems incapable of seeing that obvious core, let alone make moves to support them.   There’s the makings of a good team there and they should have started building around it at the last tdl………the “no man’s land” is completely management driven

[Mackcanuck]

We suck,

We even suck at sucking! 

[-Vintage Canuck-]

Ouch.

 

 

[Canucks Curse]

10 minutes ago, smithers joe said:

on the merrick show this morning, jeff and elliot said schenn could garner a first. you can't turn that down can you?

you do not turn that down. You take the 1st, shake Schenn's hand and tell him you will re sign him in offseason 2 years, NMC 2 million per year and promise him an A.

[lmm]

12 hours ago, Odd. said:

2020-present Canucks are going to be remembered as one the worst era of absolute uninspired hockey in franchise history 

with skilllz

[Odd.]

Just now, stawns said:

Actually I was against bringing in BB from the day the rumours started.  He was never going to be anything but a placeholder and that was a terrible move for a group who was supposed to grow together.

 

Do you think they have a lot of structure to their game?

This team had an unstable Torts and 2 rookie coaches in Desjardins and Green. We needed a coach who knows how to win, has had success in the regular season, brings a winning culture, and is one of the most experienced and respected people in the game. Bruce was the right coach without a doubt. His age doesn’t mean shit, football and NBA coaches coach well past their 70’s, if they still have enough left in the tank. So if you’re using age as the reason, that’s not a viable reason.

 

The structure is not the problem here. Bruce’s teams in the past were ALWAYS top 10 in scoring and top 10 in GA. Unfortunately, when you have leaders who are passive bent passengers with no drive like your boy Horvat, Miller, Boeser, OEL, Myers, coupled with borderline questionable defensive players, with $0 cap space, you will find that no amount of structure or experience will be able to fix what is clearly rotten in that group of players.

[BarnBurner]

32 minutes ago, Boudrias said:

I think Schenn should be moved for a 2nd rounder but can only hope he would resign in the summer. Love the guy for what he brings on and off the ice. 

He's Captain material.

[lmm]

1 minute ago, Odd. said:

This team had an unstable Torts and 2 rookie coaches in Desjardins and Green. We needed a coach who knows how to win, has had success in the regular season, brings a winning culture, and is one of the most experienced and respected people in the game. Bruce was the right coach without a doubt. His age doesn’t mean shit, football and NBA coaches coach well past their 70’s, if they still have enough left in the tank. So if you’re using age as the reason, that’s not a viable reason.

 

The structure is not the problem here. Bruce’s teams in the past were ALWAYS top 10 in scoring and top 10 in GA. Unfortunately, when you have leaders who are passive bent passengers with no drive like your boy Horvat, Miller, Boeser, OEL, Myers, coupled with borderline questionable defensive players, with $0 cap space, you will find that no amount of structure or experience will be able to fix what is clearly rotten in that group of players.

I wonder how much the Canucks are missing Walker and Shaw

[jyu]

15 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

Lol, they needed cap space and they signed Miller and Boeser to $14 mil.

Utter failure - has nothing to do with Benning

 

For what, they think this team is good and just needs some finishing touches?

I'd agree that Benning is not to blame for the current mess.

 

This is not to say that Benning is flawless, he did make mistakes. But Benning left behind pretty good assets that could be turned into picks, prospects, and players and an opportunity to clear some cap space.

 

Surely, Benning didn't manage the cap very well and that has led to us taking a step back since 2020 bubble playoffs. He did leave some deadweight like Myers and arguably OEL (won't age well). But Myers comes off next season and one bad contract of OEL isn't supposed to break the team.

 

PA and JR misjudged the roster -- or as rumoured, the owner stepped in and forced their hands.

 

In another thread, there is an excellent post by @AnthonyG about how when Benning took over, we had to build up the roster players let alone the farm and that takes years, a decade, to accomplish.

 

PA and JR were given a team with a decent NHL roster but a barren prospect pool. Their job was supposed to be to reform the roster to build up a better prospect pool for the next few years. Instead, they chose to go with status quo on the NHL roster and not build up the prospect pool.

 

I'd say the blame goes to PA and JR or the owner if the rumour is true that he forced them the direction.

[dpn1]

All morning I have been checking canucks.com to see who is getting traded to finally shake the team out of this funk.  With Aiden McDonough coming this spring Brock becomes expendable.  His salary would free up cap space for signing Bo. 

[Maginator]

26 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

Lol, they needed cap space and they signed Miller and Boeser to $14 mil.

Utter failure - has nothing to do with Benning

 

For what, they think this team is good and just needs some finishing touches?

No. Trading 3 top 6 players (Garland, Boeser, Horvat) and potentially 2 top 4 defenceman ( Myers, OEL) isn't "finishing touches". Nowhere did I say this will turn around by next year and we will be a playoff team. I can see in 2-3 years time us getting there though.

 

I'm not going to knock management for the Boeser deal. Like I said in my post there were intangibles that could have effected his game last year (dad, TG). I don't think anyone in their right mind would have just let Boeser walk to Ufa as an unqualified RFA. Unfortunately we were handcuffed by his QO, courtesy of Benning.

 

Then Miller, I also don't think anyone in their right mind would have walked into this season without a deal for him after coming off 99 points. 80-90% of this board was happy with the signing... It's funny how quickly people turn.

 

Add-on: I think Alvin and Rutherford haven't been alluding to a quick "finishing touches" turnaround either. What I've gathered from Alvin is he's going to make moves to continue to get younger, and build for the future.

 

Just because they don't want to sell the entire team and go full Edmonton doesn't mean they aren't aware they need to take a step back in order to get younger & better in the future.

Edited December 20, 2022 by Maginator

[lmm]

1 hour ago, Gawdzukes said:

Lol, they needed cap space and they signed Miller and Boeser to $14 mil.

Utter failure - has nothing to do with Benning

 

For what, they think this team is good and just needs some finishing touches?

.You mean like these?

https://www.stadiumtalk.com/s/most-devastating-finishing-moves-wrestling-history-53e63a8587c2450f

Edited December 20, 2022 by lmm

[stawns]

14 minutes ago, Muttley said:

Travis Green had to be replaced quickly, the team was suffering. Nobody said Boudreau was going to be a long term solution but someone that could bring positivity 

back to a deflated group. Now it's obvious even he can't do much with this group the way it sits. I have very little faith in Alvin and Rutherford to be able to build a winner

here any time soon. Can they pull off a rebuild? Doubt it.

I don’t disagree on Green, but BB is just as much the problem as Green was.  He needs to go and they need to bring in a coach who will be with this team for awhile

[stawns]

6 minutes ago, Maginator said:

No. Trading 3 top 6 players (Garland, Boeser, Horvat) and potentially 2 top 4 defenceman ( Myers, OEL) isn't "finishing touches". Nowhere did I say this will turn around by next year and we will be a playoff team. I can see in 2-3 years time us getting there though.

 

I'm not going to knock management for the Boeser deal. Like I said in my post there were intangibles that could have effected his game last year (dad, TG). I don't think anyone in their right mind would have just let Boeser walk to Ufa as an unqualified RFA. Unfortunately we were handcuffed by his QO, courtesy of Benning.

 

Then Miller, I also don't think anyone in their right mind would have walked into this season without a deal for him after coming off 99 points. 80-90% of this board was happy with the signing... It's funny how quickly people turn.

 

Add-on: I think Alvin and Rutherford haven't been alluding to a quick "finishing touches" turnaround either. What I've gathered from Alvin is he's going to make moves to continue to get younger, and build for the future.

 

Just because they don't want to sell the entire team and go full Edmonton doesn't mean they aren't aware they need to take a step back in order to get younger & better in the future.

If they lose Horvat, the turn around will be significantly longer than that, imo.  If they step up and do what’s right and move Miller, Boeser and a couple others they clan turn it around in moderately short order