[PGT] Canucks @ Oilers

[hammertime]

7 minutes ago, groovy said:

Obviously not that easy. 6 mill for 30 goal man Loui. Much better value in a guy like Vanek. Even Vrbata has been chipping in again. Hockey is a team game. You are only as good as the guys around you.

Eriksson has been miss cast. He needs a guy like Virtanen if per se Vertanen were to hit his ceiling. Someone to work the boards drive the zone and get pucks on net while Loui works the crease and picks up the trash. Vrbata is trash he may have a few goals but you don't win battles with selfish guys like that. 

[canuckleheads fan]

7 hours ago, mll said:

It's Benning that specifically named Boucher a kid that should get more playing time to increase his confidence.

That's fine, and it's WD's job to find a situation where he and the team can be successful. We learned last game he's too slow to play on Bo's transition line. We know he's too slow to play and lacks the back check to play with the twins and he's too slow and not concerned enough about back checking to play with Sutter, so where exactly would play him? 4th line, 10 minutes a game.

[Smashian Kassian]

I thought they played pretty good last night, they generated their fair chances to put a few behind Talbot but it was a combination of unlucky breaks and not having the personnel to make the difference on our side. Even then when you really think about it the difference in the game was McDavid. We outplayed Edmonton but he had that one chance with the puck then rifled one top cheese. Then when down on that rush against Edler/Sbisa and drew the penalty.

 

I thought the Horvat line & the Twins played well, Chaput works hard but I question whether they should have Granlund on their line in a game like this, he seems to read & react to the Twins alot better than Chaput. But Granlund did play well with Bo/Sven so its a double edged sword.

 

I get people blame Willie but there isn't alot he can do with this roster. I have some gripes with him too (especially the PP), but again with the roster we have right now I don't think any coach in the league could get this team to be much better.

[Chris12345]

36 minutes ago, NHTyrany said:

The question is: will Edmonton convert and win a cup before their salary cap woes take them back to the abyss?

I don't think Ebs starts with the oil next year. Knights.

[Boudrias]

2 minutes ago, Smashian Kassian said:

I thought they played pretty good last night, they generated their fair chances to put a few behind Talbot but it was a combination of unlucky breaks and not having the personnel to make the difference on our side. Even then when you really think about it the difference in the game was McDavid. We outplayed Edmonton but he had that one chance with the puck then rifled one top cheese. Then when down on that rush against Edler/Sbisa and drew the penalty.

 

I thought the Horvat line & the Twins played well, Chaput works hard but I question whether they should have Granlund on their line in a game like this, he seems to read & reaction to the Twins alot better than Chaput. But Granlund did play well with Bo/Sven so its a double edge sword.

 

I get people blame Willie but there isn't alot he can do with this roster. I have some gripes with him too (especially the PP), but again with the roster we have right now I don't think any coach in the league could get this team to be much better.

Who plays on who's line is not designed to necessarily win games at this point IMO. Chaput played with the Twins to give coaching and the GM some idea of how well he could play top 6. He has had a good season on the 4th line. I thought he had a good game against the Oilers. I see more potential in Chaput than Megna and can see him sticking next year.

 

The standout forward for the Canucks this season has to be Granlund. He has had a great year. He showed he could play with the Twins and then last night gets 7 shots with Horvat's line. Should have had a goal last night. My interest is seeing Granlund playing with two bigger forwards. His shot is superior and he can be deadly in front of the net. I think he would shine with bigger bodies to create space for him.

[CeeBee51]

19 minutes ago, Boudrias said:

 

 

The standout forward for the Canucks this season has to be Granlund. He has had a great year. He showed he could play with the Twins and then last night gets 7 shots with Horvat's line. Should have had a goal last night. My interest is seeing Granlund playing with two bigger forwards. His shot is superior and he can be deadly in front of the net. I think he would shine with bigger bodies to create space for him.

Shoulda had one, coulda had 3. Granny was good last night

[John McClane]

I wonder how much it is the players playing hard for WD, or there playing hard because there is outstanding leadership in the room. I'm hoping it's the latter. 

I don't care to much about wins rite now. There out there battling every game and that's awesome. I don't enjoy watching quitters. 

[oldnews]

11 hours ago, singing chef said:

Do you not subscribe to the philosophy that a coach should challenge such a " phantom call " and thereby support his players ?  In this case there was no evidence that coach Desjardins did just that.

I'm not under the illusion that 'challenging' a call like that will change anything - or that there is any use trying to talk to Chris Lee.

[JM_]

Watching this game i think a couple of things are clear, we've got a really hard working group, and Willie just can't be part of the future.

 

He's got tabula rasa right now, anything goes as far as how he wants to try out the kids, etc. and what does he do? Whats the innovation? He tries to recapture the 'old days' of the Sedin's with Burr 

 

Sure Chaput may have some tools that fit that 'ideal twins partner theory' (speed, forechecking) but the Sedin's don't have the tools they used to have. It doesn't matter if Chaput is Hansen-light. 

 

Right now there is no better time to try line combinations with the Sedin's split and we're not going to see it. 

[canuckleheads fan]

10 hours ago, darkpoet said:

Yup and he's right.

Sure the kid needs some time to get in better shape (and I believe he will this summer), and learn that staying there is paramount, but he has a serious pro level shot/release. And when he's given top minutes he's shooting the puck - and creating chances - at a pretty respectable rate. 

People say "oh well he bounced around on waivers for 3 teams" yeah... the story behind that is that all of those teams wanted him because they saw his potential.

We get shut out tonight and one of the best shooters on the team is buried on the 4th line while Chaput gets paired up with the Sedins ..

bye bye Willie.... 

Boucher is a one trick pony, he can shoot. His problem is that he's fat and very slow. He's been with the team how long, almost two months, and he's still not in game shape? I question his commitment. I asked this before, where do you play a slow skater who shows little interest in back checking? Too slow for Bo and Baer's transition game, too slow and not defensively sound enough to play with the twins, too slow for the checking line, who did a good job on McDavid's line last night.  Boucher gets 4th line minutes, because all he is is a fringe NHL player. Teams took a flyer on him because he had impressive Jr and pretty good AHL numbers. Last year, Boucher scored 19 points in 38 games with NJ and was a point a game player in his last stint in the AHL with Albany. NJ is as bad as we are this year, yet Boucher couldn't stick, why is that?  He also couldn't stick with Nashville, not even on their 4th line. Granted, Nashville might be a playoff team, but they're not that stacked, so why couldn't Boucher stick? The reason is that he's too sloooowwwwww which really limits how he can be deployed.  At this stage, Boucher is nothing more than a fringe NHLer. Sadly, a third of our team is fringe NHLers.  At 23 he has probably had all the skate training he needs to realize that he won't be getting much faster (a body only has so much faster twice muscle fiber). Maybe losing 10 or 15 pounds in the off-seasonwill help. If not Boucher becomes another tantalizing player who lacked that one element to his game that would have allowed him to be successful. Just like Megna and his hands. Great compete level, fantastic skater, good Hockey IQ but sadly no finish.

[JM_]

6 minutes ago, canuckleheads fan said:

Boucher is a one trick pony, he can shoot. His problem is that he's fat and very slow. He's been with the team how long, almost two months, and he's still not in game shape? I question his commitment. I asked this before, where do you play a slow skater who shows little interest in back checking? Too slow for Bo and Baer's transition game, too slow and not defensively sound enough to play with the twins, too slow for the checking line, who did a good job on McDavid's line last night.  Boucher gets 4th line minutes, because all he is is a fringe NHL player. Teams took a flyer on him because he had impressive Jr and pretty good AHL numbers. Last year, Boucher scored 19 points in 38 games with NJ and was a point a game player in his last stint in the AHL with the Albany. NJ is as bad as we are this year, yet Boucher couldn't stick, why is that?  He also couldn't stick with Nashville, not even on their 4th line. Granted, Nashville might be a playoff team, but they're not that stacked, so why couldn't Boucher stick? The reason is that he's too sloooowwwwww which really limits how he can be deployed.  At this stage, Boucher is nothing more than a fringe NHLer. Sadly, a third of our team is fringe NHLers.  At 23 he has probably had all the skate training he needs to realize that he won't be getting much faster (a body only has so much faster twice muscle fiber). Maybe losing 10 or 15 pounds in the off-seasonwill help. If not Boucher becomes another tantalizing player who lacked that one element to his game that would have allowed him to be successful. Just like Megna and his hands. Great compete level, fantastic skater, good Hockey IQ but sadly no finish.

 From the Kyle Wellwood training camp?

 

Lets see if he works on his skating his summer. I'm sure he knows thats the area he has to work on, Bo went far with a power skating coach. Nothing for us to lose to extend him on a 2-way deal and if we lose him to waivers thats OK too. If he can pick up some speed he'd be a good asset. 

 

 

[DIBdaQUIB]

22 minutes ago, S'all Good Man said:

Watching this game i think a couple of things are clear, we've got a really hard working group, and Willie just can't be part of the future.

 

He's got tabula rasa right now, anything goes as far as how he wants to try out the kids, etc. and what does he do? Whats the innovation? He tries to recapture the 'old days' of the Sedin's with Burr 

 

Sure Chaput may have some tools that fit that 'ideal twins partner theory' (speed, forechecking) but the Sedin's don't have the tools they used to have. It doesn't matter if Chaput is Hansen-light. 

 

Right now there is no better time to try line combinations with the Sedin's split and we're not going to see it. 

He didn't just get a green light to be creative with the roster, he was given an edict by JB to do so yet...as you say, the creativity was NIL.  Sedins still killed the PP as they have for 3 years now...Megna gets bumped up and Boucher down...Edler gets big minutes etc.

 

I get the arguments about Boucher's conditioning etc but this is about seeing the kids put in real NHL situations to see how they respond and what their potential is.  WD appears unable to deploy players with that kind of mindset which makes me seriously question if he is the coach for a team that is in full rebuild needing to live with the pain of rookies and take chances with their deployment.

[Westcoasting]

48 minutes ago, Boudrias said:

Who plays on who's line is not designed to necessarily win games at this point IMO. Chaput played with the Twins to give coaching and the GM some idea of how well he could play top 6. He has had a good season on the 4th line. I thought he had a good game against the Oilers. I see more potential in Chaput than Megna and can see him sticking next year.

 

The standout forward for the Canucks this season has to be Granlund. He has had a great year. He showed he could play with the Twins and then last night gets 7 shots with Horvat's line. Should have had a goal last night. My interest is seeing Granlund playing with two bigger forwards. His shot is superior and he can be deadly in front of the net. I think he would shine with bigger bodies to create space for him.

The more i watch Granlund the more i think he is going to improve the most and be a top quality goal scorer. Baer, i'm not sold on yet.

[alfstonker]

2 hours ago, Scottish⑦Canuck said:

No need for the condescending comment, but thanks. 

 

 

And yeah. Until like 5 in the morning.

I didn't think you got NHL TV over there. Kudos to you for staying up till that time. 

[Boudrias]

32 minutes ago, S'all Good Man said:

Watching this game i think a couple of things are clear, we've got a really hard working group, and Willie just can't be part of the future.

 

He's got tabula rasa right now, anything goes as far as how he wants to try out the kids, etc. and what does he do? Whats the innovation? He tries to recapture the 'old days' of the Sedin's with Burr 

 

Sure Chaput may have some tools that fit that 'ideal twins partner theory' (speed, forechecking) but the Sedin's don't have the tools they used to have. It doesn't matter if Chaput is Hansen-light. 

 

Right now there is no better time to try line combinations with the Sedin's split and we're not going to see it. 

What did you expect Desjardin to do last night? The issue is not all about whether Chaput can play top 6 but where the Twins will play next year. I certainly do not see them as 3rd line players unless they alter their games significantly. As for Chaput he has Memorial Cup and Calder Cup creds. I expect him back next year. He had a solid game last night.

 

I agree with your idea of splitting the Twins as an experiment. It might become a reality next year. It is no longer about finding a fit for the Twins it is about how they will fit to finish their contract. Recently they are getting 15 to 18 TOI and likely that is how next year plays out as well. Danny as a shooter still has cred with me but he defers as much as ever. Henrik can still be effective off the half board. I suspect they will have a summer of reflection on how they have to change their game. Still hope they are moved next year to a CUP contender.

[Smashian Kassian]

1 hour ago, Boudrias said:

Who plays on who's line is not designed to necessarily win games at this point IMO. Chaput played with the Twins to give coaching and the GM some idea of how well he could play top 6. He has had a good season on the 4th line. I thought he had a good game against the Oilers. I see more potential in Chaput than Megna and can see him sticking next year.

 

The standout forward for the Canucks this season has to be Granlund. He has had a great year. He showed he could play with the Twins and then last night gets 7 shots with Horvat's line. Should have had a goal last night. My interest is seeing Granlund playing with two bigger forwards. His shot is superior and he can be deadly in front of the net. I think he would shine with bigger bodies to create space for him.

 

 

 

Yeah that's fair. I don't disagree.

 

I'm with you on Chaput & Granlund. Granlund's been great, Chaput has done very well in his role. I don't think he will have a Burrows-like rise to the top line but he should be a good bottom 6 guy for us going forward (hopefully). He did play pretty good with the Twins but he just doesn't seem to have the offensive skill/IQ to complement them aswell as you would want but I do agree that it was worth a shot. That was just my observation. No doubt he works hard and was good at trying to maintain possession with that line though.

 

Maybe when we have Boeser next season Granlund will play with him. Wouldn't mind seeing those 2 get a shot with Horvat as far as bigger bodies for Granny to play with. I agree with you on that point for sure. Granlund is a smart player, really works well on any line. JB definitely made a great trade getting him, looks like he will be a fixture in the top 9 for years to come. 

[canuck2288]

3 hours ago, spook007 said:

No, but as long as we are in the games, we have a chance to win.

The point is we are not winning those games and the "system" is not going to put butts in the seats 

[Smashian Kassian]

Twins definitely seem to be secondary players going forward. I think that would be good for them though. They have been counted on for such a long time to carry the offense. Lessen their minutes/role a bit, even experiment from time to time having them play with other players.

 

I think they still have it in them to be contributing players (even in a 2nd line role) but not guys that can shoulder the load consistently. The coaches definitely have to acknowledge that & try to give them a role accordingly.

 

It would be interesting to see them play a bit with Boeser next year if he steps in and shows he can be a NHL player right away. 

[JM_]

31 minutes ago, DIBdaQUIB said:

He didn't just get a green light to be creative with the roster, he was given an edict by JB to do so yet...as you say, the creativity was NIL.  Sedins still killed the PP as they have for 3 years now...Megna gets bumped up and Boucher down...Edler gets big minutes etc.

 

I get the arguments about Boucher's conditioning etc but this is about seeing the kids put in real NHL situations to see how they respond and what their potential is.  WD appears unable to deploy players with that kind of mindset which makes me seriously question if he is the coach for a team that is in full rebuild needing to live with the pain of rookies and take chances with their deployment.

why did he go away from the PP that produced a game before? 

 

Boucher.... well, maybe he needs to be given some chances to flop so it sinks in on getting his skating and conditioning up? 

[JM_]

18 minutes ago, Boudrias said:

What did you expect Desjardin to do last night? The issue is not all about whether Chaput can play top 6 but where the Twins will play next year. I certainly do not see them as 3rd line players unless they alter their games significantly. As for Chaput he has Memorial Cup and Calder Cup creds. I expect him back next year. He had a solid game last night.

 

I agree with your idea of splitting the Twins as an experiment. It might become a reality next year. It is no longer about finding a fit for the Twins it is about how they will fit to finish their contract. Recently they are getting 15 to 18 TOI and likely that is how next year plays out as well. Danny as a shooter still has cred with me but he defers as much as ever. Henrik can still be effective off the half board. I suspect they will have a summer of reflection on how they have to change their game. Still hope they are moved next year to a CUP contender.

I expected him to split the twins, and keep them off the PP, at least together. Why not try one per unit? Why not put Daniel on the 3rd line? Is production screams 3rd liner. 

 

The Sedin's are elite passers, but the game has sped up around them. Chaput isn't going to change that. 

 

I'd actually like to see Chaput given 3rd line C duties with Sutter on his wing for a few games. Like you say he performed well in junior so that would be something I'd like to see tried.