[Discussion] if Podkolzin is available at 10 do we take him

[CanucksCountry]

Sorry if there is already a topic on this but I couldn't find one

But any ways with Podkolzin dropping in the draft rankings if he is available at 10 do you take him

 

Why or why not?

 

Edited May 15, 2019 by Roger Neilsons Towel
Added Poll

[JM_]

No.

 

He has 2 more years on his KHL contract.

 

Also, for a guy touted as a "star in the making" already playing in Russia I'd be concerned about ever seeing him suit up if he didn't like who picked him. 

 

That and we have bigger holes to fill on defence. 

 

Also from a contract pov if he didn't sign with us, I think he'd be a free agent at 22 but I need a person with better cap knowledge than me to confirm that. 

 

Edited May 15, 2019 by Jimmy McGill

[48MPHSlapShot]

No. You don't take a gamble on a guy that's tied up for two more years in Russia and may not ever even want to play in the NHL with a top ten pick. 

[DrJockitch]

If he is really top 3 talent that is dropping because of the Russia factor, i would probably take him. 

Elite talent is the hardest thing to get in this league.  Figure out the rest a couple years down the road.

Not expecting to see anyone we draft at 10 for 2-3 years anyway. 

If they get to Van earlier, great but I don't expect to see them until they are in their 20s.

[JM_]

10 minutes ago, DrJockitch said:

If he is really top 3 talent that is dropping because of the Russia factor, i would probably take him. 

Elite talent is the hardest thing to get in this league.  Figure out the rest a couple years down the road.

Not expecting to see anyone we draft at 10 for 2-3 years anyway. 

If they get to Van earlier, great but I don't expect to see them until they are in their 20s.

thats true, but the Canucks have so many other needs I don't see how Jim can take the risk. 

[JeremyCuddles]

People make it sound like all of these kids will be in the NHL within the next 2 years. Lol. Leaving a really talented player on the board cause we won't see him within the next 2 years is incredibly shortsighted.

 

As for the OP's question. It really depends who is hypothetically on the board at the time. There are a lot of forwards in the 5-10 range I like ahead of Podkolzin.

 

Edit: Really the only downsides I am hearing is "he's Russian" and he is committed to KHL for 2 years. People talk about him like he doesn't want anything to do with the NHL. From what I am seeing all he said was he wanted to stay in Russia until he was NHL ready. Why is it so wrong for him to develop in Russia? People on this board are drooling from the lips to see Tryamkin back. Didn't play a lick of time in the AHL nor does he have the intangibles of Podkolzin. Podkolzin is considered close to NHL ready. So he should be in the NHL in 2 years. If that's too long a wait for a 17 year old kid I dunno man.

Edited May 15, 2019 by N7Nucks

[Alflives]

Podkolzin is dropping because he doesn't have elite puck skills.  There are other buys much better. 

[IBatch]

This is a tough call.  I guess it would come down to the combine and what Benning and co think of him and where they put him on their board.  Most scouts have him near the top two, talent wise it’s undeniable.  Two years in the KHL isn’t a bad thing, it’s better than juniors and the AHL.  Year three he’s a rookie playing for us...

[AlwaysACanuckFan]

11 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Podkolzin is dropping because he doesn't have elite puck skills.  There are other buys much better. 

Always go with  the best bang for the buck

[Zhukini]

I'd rather take him than reach for a dman

[JeremyCuddles]

14 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Podkolzin is dropping because he doesn't have elite puck skills.  There are other buys much better. 

I read two different scouting reports, lastwordonhockey and dobberprospects, and both say he has great stickhandling and can embarrass defenders. So I am not entirely sure where you read this. Feel free to let me know. This guy's intangibles honestly scream Benning guy. He battles, never quits on a play, has good leadership qualities. I seen both of those scouting reports call him a power winger. He's 6'1 nearly 200 pounds already according to eliteprospects. Everything we want outta Virtanen this kid has, minus the hitting.

[higgyfan]

4 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Podkolzin is dropping because he doesn't have elite puck skills.  There are other buys much better. 

I haven't seen that criticism of him.  I think he is too good to pass up and it's unlikely he falls to the 10th.

Quotables

“Podkolzin checks all the intangible blocks, as he can be counted on to address a variety of his coach’s concerns. What separates him from all the other “toolsy” forwards is that he can either create or finish plays while traveling at maximum speed, and his strong balance and stickhandling seems to convince defenders to back off more than they should. Podkolzin is effective both in open ice and during trench warfare, and he’s capable of completing on-the-tape passes that lead directly to quality chances near the net..” – Steve Kournianos, The Draft Analyst

 

“An absolute pit bull. Podkolzin offers high-end offensive awareness, lightning quick hands and a confrontational style. Despite some muted point totals coming from his club team, he’s made a habit of showing up in a big way on the international stage. A potential high-end producer in the NHL. – Cam Robinson, Dobber Prospects

 

“Podkolzin is very skilled and can make the flashy plays to deke defenders, but he rarely does that off a standstill or along the walls. Instead, Podkolzin is typically full speed ahead to the net. He’s also a very good playmaker and finisher who can take advantage of space if defenders give it to him by making a pass or sniping from a distance. He’s a fine/good skater but hustles so hard that he looks like he’s always going fast. – Corey Pronman, The Athletic (from ‘Pronman: 2019 NHL Draft midseason rankings’, The AthleticNHL – 1/29/19)

 

"Podkolzin started his draft season with a great performance at the Hlinka-Gretzky Cup where he scored eight goals and three assists in just five games. He was also the team captain in that tournament. Podkolzin has all the offensive tools needed to become an elite level player. He has great top speed and he can make plays at high speed. He’s capable of making quick turns. His shot is amazing but he also has the vision and passing skills to be a good playmaker. His one-on-one skills are great as well. On top of all that, he has good size (6-1, 190) and he isn’t afraid to use it. He can power his way to the net at the junior level, and when he adds more muscle to his frame, he can do that at the pro level as well. The Russian factor may cause Podkolzin to drop in the NHL Entry Draft and you may need to wait a couple of years while he develops in Russia but his offensive upside is one of the highest in this draft class."  Jokke Nevalainen

 

This kid has the potential to become an elite power forward in the NHL.  I think LA or Detroit take him.

[Nucker 67]

I don't know. I think Podkolzin is the 3rd best player in this Draft. Passing on him at #10? So he wants to play the next 2 years in the KHL. He would be 19-20 when he joins the NHL. Why is this a problem? Can a player refuse to be Draft eligible in the NHL? Maybe it's a silly question, but I wanted to ask anyway. Reason being, if Podkolzin had no intentions of playing in the NHL, why would he make himself eligible to be drafted? What if he turns out to be like Draisaitl?

[Baer.]

Absolutely. Third most skilled forward in draft.

[JeremyCuddles]

The more I read up on this kid the more I doubt he'd even get that far down the list. Lol. I'd be surprised if he's around at 6/7 let alone 10. If he's on the board at 10 I probably sprint to the podium to call his name.

[Alflives]

10 minutes ago, N7Nucks said:

I read two different scouting reports, lastwordonhockey and dobberprospects, and both say he has great stickhandling and can embarrass defenders. So I am not entirely sure where you read this. Feel free to let me know. This guy's intangibles honestly scream Benning guy. He battles, never quits on a play, has good leadership qualities. I seen both of those scouting reports call him a power winger. He's 6'1 nearly 200 pounds already according to eliteprospects. Everything we want outta Virtanen this kid has, minus the hitting.

 

5 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

I haven't seen that criticism of him.  I think he is too good to pass up and it's unlikely he falls to the 10th.

Quotables

“Podkolzin checks all the intangible blocks, as he can be counted on to address a variety of his coach’s concerns. What separates him from all the other “toolsy” forwards is that he can either create or finish plays while traveling at maximum speed, and his strong balance and stickhandling seems to convince defenders to back off more than they should. Podkolzin is effective both in open ice and during trench warfare, and he’s capable of completing on-the-tape passes that lead directly to quality chances near the net..” – Steve Kournianos, The Draft Analyst

 

“An absolute pit bull. Podkolzin offers high-end offensive awareness, lightning quick hands and a confrontational style. Despite some muted point totals coming from his club team, he’s made a habit of showing up in a big way on the international stage. A potential high-end producer in the NHL. – Cam Robinson, Dobber Prospects

 

“Podkolzin is very skilled and can make the flashy plays to deke defenders, but he rarely does that off a standstill or along the walls. Instead, Podkolzin is typically full speed ahead to the net. He’s also a very good playmaker and finisher who can take advantage of space if defenders give it to him by making a pass or sniping from a distance. He’s a fine/good skater but hustles so hard that he looks like he’s always going fast. – Corey Pronman, The Athletic (from ‘Pronman: 2019 NHL Draft midseason rankings’, The AthleticNHL – 1/29/19)

 

"Podkolzin started his draft season with a great performance at the Hlinka-Gretzky Cup where he scored eight goals and three assists in just five games. He was also the team captain in that tournament. Podkolzin has all the offensive tools needed to become an elite level player. He has great top speed and he can make plays at high speed. He’s capable of making quick turns. His shot is amazing but he also has the vision and passing skills to be a good playmaker. His one-on-one skills are great as well. On top of all that, he has good size (6-1, 190) and he isn’t afraid to use it. He can power his way to the net at the junior level, and when he adds more muscle to his frame, he can do that at the pro level as well. The Russian factor may cause Podkolzin to drop in the NHL Entry Draft and you may need to wait a couple of years while he develops in Russia but his offensive upside is one of the highest in this draft class."  Jokke Nevalainen

 

This kid has the potential to become an elite power forward in the NHL.  I think LA or Detroit take him.

I think it was Craig Button (recently) who said that Podkolzin doesn't have the puck skills many thought he had.  I heard it on the radio recently.  Maybe someone here can find the comments? 

[Alflives]

Found it!

"Podkolzin just doesn’t have as much high-end skill as others at the top of this class have demonstrated,” Button said. “He’s more of a bulldog-type player. He might end up being a lot like Lawson Crouse.”

https://www.tsn.ca/podkolzin-plummets-in-tsn-hockey-s-mock-draft-3-0-1.1296254

 

[theo5789]

1 hour ago, Jimmy McGill said:

No.

 

He has 2 more years on his KHL contract.

 

Also, for a guy touted as a "star in the making" already playing in Russia I'd be concerned about ever seeing him suit up if he didn't like who picked him. 

 

That and we have bigger holes to fill on defence. 

 

Also from a contract pov if he didn't sign with us, I think he'd be a free agent at 22 but I need a person with better cap knowledge than me to confirm that. 

 

 

52 minutes ago, 48MPHSlapShot said:

No. You don't take a gamble on a guy that's tied up for two more years in Russia and may not ever even want to play in the NHL with a top ten pick. 

How is this different than say a guy going to college for a couple of years? Or being sent back to juniors and then a year in the AHL or whatever? The KHL is a men's league, so he will be developing there. 2 years is very little time and if he's NHL ready, then he would arrive at around the time any other player would be. Now unless we are looking for a player that can step in immediately, then it would be a different story, but that may not fit into the BPA mantra.

 

For comparison sake, Boeser did sign after his college season and played a few games, but he was a 20 year old before he became a full time NHLer. Not very far off from Podkolzin being away for a couple of years and jumping right in hopefully.

 

There is the chance he may not want to play here and maybe he's using this tactic to hopefully land on a team of choice (Jagr style?) because we all know about the buyout rules in the KHL. The teams will hopefully find out more on this during their interviews so they will make the decision to take him or not if he does drop to 10. But based on skill alone, I probably wouldn't pass on him if he does drop that far.

[JeremyCuddles]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

 

I think it was Craig Button (recently) who said that Podkolzin doesn't have the puck skills many thought he had.  I heard it on the radio recently.  Maybe someone here can find the comments? 

I read that report. I think he was referring to high end skill. Unless we are talking about two different reports. Button has Kaliyev above Podkolzin. His opinion has become invalid as far as I am concerned. Lol. Bob McKenzie's list had 8 of 10 scouts say Podkolzin is the 3rd best prospect in this draft. I trust Bob McKenzie's opinion over Button's personally. 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, N7Nucks said:

I read that report. I think he was referring to high end skill. Unless we are talking about two different reports. Button has Kaliyev above Podkolzin. His opinion has become invalid as far as I am concerned. Lol. Bob McKenzie's list had 8 of 10 scouts say Podkolzin is the 3rd best prospect in this draft. I trust Bob McKenzie's opinion over Button's personally. 

I think Button is basing his valuation on new viewings of the player though.  Bob's rankings are from earlier, aren't they?  

Anyway Button dropped the guy down to 13.  Add to that the whole Russian factor, and the player (maybe?) choosing to stay and over there, and the guy could fall a lot.  I'd rather pick up Broberg or Seider.  They both have higher ceilings.