Scotland Independence?

[ckamo]

I stand corrected. S-C, that goes for if the Yes vote wins as well?

[alfstonker]

Just been sent this. Maybe this is the reason they don't want Scotland to go.

http://www.oilandgaspeople.com/news/1039/scottish-west-coast-untapped-oil-and-gas-reserves-worth-trillions/

[RUPERTKBD]

Anyone catch John Oliver's take on it last night? Brilliant, as usual.

[Green Building]

I read this article this morning and thought someone else might find parts of it interesting, especially after the post by alfstonker.

LONDON -- How do you divorce after a 300-year union? It's complicated, and there is a deadline.

If Scots vote yes to separation on Thursday, a clock starts ticking down to March 24, 2016 - the independence day declared by the Scottish government.

The British and Scottish administrations have agreed that they will recognize the outcome of the referendum and appoint negotiators to work out the details of separation "in the best interests of the people of Scotland and of the rest of the United Kingdom."

But there is disagreement on many issues, and only 18 months to redraft laws, establish international agreements and work out relationships with international organizations. Robert Hazell, head of the Constitution Unit at University College London, says that is an "impossible timetable," and estimates it could take up to three years to hammer out the details.

Some of the key issues:

Dividing the assets

The Yes and No campaigns have very different assessments of Scotland's financial picture, including its share of Britain's national debt and North Sea oil reserves. The pro-independence Scottish government says Scotland would be entitled to 90 percent of Britain's oil wealth - based on divvying up the two countries' waters - but only liable for about 8 percent of its 1.3 trillion pound ($2.1 trillion) national debt, based on its share of the U.K. population.

The British government disputes this, pointing out that Scotland has higher per capita public-sector spending than England and so is more indebted. Scottish independence leader Alex Salmond has signaled he could play hardball.

Country clubs

Salmond says that Scotland wants to remain in the United Nations, the European Union and NATO, and he anticipates little difficulty in keeping those seats. Opponents say re-admission cannot be guaranteed. NATO, in particular, may be perturbed by Salmond's promise to remove nuclear weapons from Scottish territory.

That's not so much a problem for Scotland - nuclear weapons are not a membership requirement - as for Britain, whose entire nuclear arsenal is based aboard submarines at the Faslane naval base in western Scotland. Adm. Mark Stanhope, a former head of the Royal Navy, has said that moving the weapons "would add a dangerous period of destabilization in our nuclear defense posture at a time when the international picture is clearly deteriorating."

The Royal United Services Institute, a military think-tank, estimates that moving the weapons could cost several billion pounds (dollars) and take until 2028. In the shorter term, Salmond may seek to use the base as a bargaining chip in negotiations with Britain.

Opponents of independence also say the loss of Scotland would sharply reduce Britain's clout on the world stage. It could endanger its place in the G-7 group of wealthy industrialized nations and its seat on the United Nations Security Council, although Salmond says Scotland would support Britain in efforts to keep the security council seat.

The currency question

The day after an independence vote, the pound sterling will remain Scotland's official currency. The Scottish government wants to keep it in the long term as well - as a key prop of stability amid the uncertainty independence would bring. British officials and bankers say it's not that simple. Bank of England governor Mark Carney has said that "a currency union is incompatible with sovereignty."

Salmond thinks the British government is bluffing. He says "a common-sense agreement on a common currency" is in everyone's best interest. Another unknown is whether businesses will pull out of Scotland. Financial institutions including the Royal Bank of Scotland and insurance giant Standard Life have announced plans to transfer some operations south of the border to ensure they remain part of British tax and currency systems.

Salmond says these are administrative measures and that the firms will keep most of their thousands of jobs in Scotland - but only time will tell.

Drawing a border

At the moment only a blue-and-white billboard informs motorists and train passengers that they have passed from England into Scotland, and border checks will not be set up the day after an independence vote.

Salmond said there is "no danger" of such border formalities, saying Scotland would become part of the passport-free Common Travel Area Britain operates with the Channel Islands and the Republic of Ireland.

He says Scotland, like Britain, will be a member of the EU. But opponents say membership cannot be guaranteed; countries such as Spain, that face strong secessionist movements, may be uneasy about quick recognition.

If Scotland remains outside the EU - or if Britain leaves, as some London politicians wish - there may be no alternative to border checks. Britain could also take umbrage if Scotland adopts much more liberal immigration policies.

Scots will be getting different passports if they opt for independence, even if they don't need them to cross the border. The Scottish government says all British citizens living in Scotland will automatically be considered Scottish citizens, as will Scotland-born Britons who live elsewhere. They will be able to apply for Scottish passports from independence day in 2016, and would be allowed to retain dual Scottish and British nationality.

Keeping the Queen

One thing both sides agree on - Queen Elizabeth II will continue to be the Scottish monarch after independence. Scotland and England shared a monarch for a century before they united politically in 1707, and the queen remains head of state in Canada, Australia and several other former British colonies.

The queen will keep her Balmoral estate in Scotland, the royal family's traditional summer-vacation destination. Many other symbols of state are up for grabs. Scotland will likely adopt the Saltire, a blue-and-white flag that already flies alongside the Union Jack over government buildings in Edinburgh.

The red, white and blue British flag combines the emblems of its member regions, including England's red-and-white Cross of St. George and Scotland's blue. A redesign of the iconic banner may be in order.

[thedestroyerofworlds]

[Bure to Mogilny]

NO

[Scottish⑦Canuck]

NO

YOU CAN'T VOTE SO THIS MEANS NOTHING.

[aGENT]

As a Canadian of Scottish descent, I'm interested to see how this turns out.

I'm not as educated on the details as my head would like but my heart sure is cheering for the free and independent Scotland my ancestors dreamt of for generations.

Best of luck.

[King Heffy]

YOU CAN'T VOTE SO THIS MEANS NOTHING.

He's posted nothing but gibberish in this thread. Thanks for posting all the updates for those of us on the other side of the Atlantic. I don't have a vote but the yes side makes a stronger case from what I've seen.

[alfstonker]

What baffles me in all this is that it seems this process has been going on for 2 (?) years and during that time according to what I've been told there have only been "lines in the sand" and various threats from all directions aimed at Scotland.

Now with 2 days to go the 3 UK party leaders have got together and signed a commitment to "extra powers" to Scotland.

Well from the outside I find that unbelievable, especially as they apparently insisted "devolution max" which has never even been quantified as I understand it, was kept off the ballot paper.

Now if I was a Scot I would find such an attempt to blackmail me insulting with 2 days to go. It tells me they had no intention of giving anything extra at all, until those voting YES have forced their hand.

Further more I was sent a copy of their statement today and it doesn't even highlight what the additional powers are to be. Why would the Scots trust them?

[aeromotacanucks]

What baffles me in all this is that it seems this process has been going on for 2 (?) years and during that time according to what I've been told there have only been "lines in the sand" and various threats from all directions aimed at Scotland.

Now with 2 days to go the 3 UK party leaders have got together and signed a commitment to "extra powers" to Scotland.

Well from the outside I find that unbelievable, especially as they apparently insisted "devolution max" which has never even been quantified as I understand it, was kept off the ballot paper.

Now if I was a Scot I would find such an attempt to blackmail me insulting with 2 days to go. It tells me they had no intention of giving anything extra at all, until those voting YES have forced their hand.

Further more I was sent a copy of their statement today and it doesn't even highlight what the additional powers are to be. Why would the Scots trust them?

looks like the British politics are simply "on their pants" because they´re so afraid of lose Scotland they know their positions are in danger...

Scottish people are forced to obey the British government for hundreds of years. No wonder Scottish people want independence so much. they want their own government...

not a "more independent government but who is in charge is England"...

If I was a Scottish citizen I would vote YES for sure...

[avelanch]

i am part scottish, english, welsh and irish (and ukrainian), but if i were living in the UK, i'd probably be living in scotland and i'd be voting yes for sure.

[Bure to Mogilny]

YOU CAN'T VOTE SO THIS MEANS NOTHING.

True but u others should vote no cause cameron and the other two major uk politicisans are calling for more powers and welfares for the scots. Is a good deal i think unity is the most important thing to consider before voteing

[Dral]

i am part scottish, english, welsh and irish (and ukrainian), but if i were living in the UK, i'd probably be living in scotland and i'd be voting yes for sure.

if i was living in Scotland, I'd probably be a lot more aware what was going on and being making a very informed decision... as it stands, I'm personally leaning towards no.

True but u others should vote no cause cameron and the other two major uk politicisans are calling for more powers and welfares for the scots. Is a good deal i think unity is the most important thing to consider before voteing

Just out of curiosity - are you of voting age?

[RUPERTKBD]

Just out of curiosity - are you of voting age?

He couldn't possibly be. What an indictment of our education system it would be if we were turning out 18 year-olds with that sort of literacy deficiency..

[avelanch]

True but u others should vote no cause cameron and the other two major uk politicisans are calling for more powers and welfares for the scots. Is a good deal i think unity is the most important thing to consider before voteing

so two politicians come out and claim that there may be more powers for scotland, but fail to say what exactly those are, or how they plan on doing that, and you would, as a scotsman, vote yes because of this empty and vague promise?

[Miss Korea Bob.Loblaw]

so two politicians come out and claim that there may be more powers for scotland, but fail to say what exactly those are, or how they plan on doing that, and you would, as a scotsman, vote yes because of this empty and vague promise?

yah but doze welfarez

[aGENT]

As far as "Hail Mary's" go, that's not even a very good one. What a halfhearted attempt.

[RUPERTKBD]

As far as "Hail Mary's" go, that's not even a very good one. What a halfhearted attempt.

Pretty tough to complete a Hail Mary with a Caber

Shouldn't that be "Hail Mairi" anyway?

[alfstonker]

True but u others should vote no cause cameron and the other two major uk politicisans are calling for more powers and welfares for the scots. Is a good deal i think unity is the most important thing to consider before voteing

Really, well I'm no Scot but I've read the front page above, maybe you can tell us where it details the extra powers? Just had this really funny video sent to me.

Apparently the UK sent 100 or so MPs up to Glasgow to talk the Glasgow people into voting no. I love the accent, he should have done voice over for Mel Gibson

Just read some of the comments and it appears the guy who comes up to speak to him at about 3 minutes is the owner of a Scottish Newspaper.